From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 1 11:18:13 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Sat Aug 1 11:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: RIAA Says "Don't Expect DRMed Music To Work Forever" References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h50619$fn4$1@news.spamcop.net... > > > "Buying DRMed content, then having that content stop working later, is > fair, > writes Steven Metalitz, the lawyer who represents the MPAA, RIAA in a > letter > to the top legal advisor at the Copyright Office. 'We reject the view that > copyright owners and their licensees are required to provide consumers > with > perpetual access to creative works.' In other words, if it stops working, > too > bad. Not surprisingly, Metalitz also strongly opposes any exemption that > would > allow users to legally strip DRM from content if a store goes dark and > takes > down its authentication servers." > > RIAA Says "Don't Expect DRMed Music To Work Forever" > http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/07/30/1736209/RIAA-Says-Dont-Expect-DRMed-Music-To-Work-Forever?from=rss > > Big Content: ludicrous to expect DRMed music to work forever > http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/07/big-content-ridiculous-to-expect-drmed-music-to-work-forever.ars > It's time to blow the Digital Millennium act off the books. From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 1 11:29:34 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Aug 1 11:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: RIAA Says "Don't Expect DRMed Music To Work Forever" References: Message-ID: "Bar0" wrote in message news:h51mbm$1po$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : news:h50619$fn4$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : > : > "Buying DRMed content, then having that content stop working later, is : > fair, : > writes Steven Metalitz, the lawyer who represents the MPAA, RIAA in a : > letter : > to the top legal advisor at the Copyright Office. 'We reject the view that : > copyright owners and their licensees are required to provide consumers : > with : > perpetual access to creative works.' In other words, if it stops working, : > too : > bad. Not surprisingly, Metalitz also strongly opposes any exemption that : > would : > allow users to legally strip DRM from content if a store goes dark and : > takes : > down its authentication servers." : > : > RIAA Says "Don't Expect DRMed Music To Work Forever" : > http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/07/30/1736209/RIAA-Says-Dont-Expect-DRMed-Music-To-Work-Forever?from=rss : > : > Big Content: ludicrous to expect DRMed music to work forever : > http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/07/big-content-ridiculous-to-expect-drmed-music-to-work-forever.ars : > : : It's time to blow the Digital Millennium act off the books. Some elements yes, others are doing what was intended with amusing results. From joegill at removethis Sat Aug 1 13:41:44 2009 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Sat Aug 1 13:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Craigslist....oh my god... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h3oe7f$8cv$1@news.spamcop.net... > Put an ad up for free stuff leftover from the garage sale. That was an > hour ago. Since then I've had dozens of calls and dozens of emails. 6 > people already stopped by and took half the stuff. When the ad went up, I > got one call per minute literally as soon as the ad went live. I feel > like a switchboard, working my cell phone to death. :-/ I put a car up on Craigslist as my first venture.... I took the email route, where they provided the email address which forwards to me. In the first hour, I had a spam from a robot. 12 hours later, I had a real email.. Exchanged a few emails with the people. Made an appointment to meet them at a shopping center.... They viewed.. we dickered.... They met what I was looking for... 20 hours after that, I had my money $4K in cash, and they had their car and title.... Zero spam after that.... I was REALLY impressed with using Craigslist! From dfmanno at mail.com Sat Aug 1 14:35:35 2009 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Sat Aug 1 14:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: women References: Message-ID: In article , "Mike Easter" wrote: > Or if you were to walk up and speak to the lady and look down into her > baby buggy instead of at her breasts or legs. Why would I want to look at the baby? -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com "When the fate of so many rests in the hands of so few, can the failure to be accountable ever be forgiven?" - Stephen Hawking From MikeE at ster.invalid Sat Aug 1 15:18:15 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sat Aug 1 15:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: women References: Message-ID: D.F. Manno wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> Or if you were to walk up and speak to the lady and look down into her >> baby buggy instead of at her breasts or legs. > > Why would I want to look at the baby? I tho't the standard for social discourse between anyone and a mother with child was to direct their attention to the child/infant and converse about that; how cute s/he/it is, how old s/he/it is, how (whatever) s/he/it it is. Whatever similar infants/children you relate to, etc. ... as opposed to "Hey, honey. Why don't you ditch that kid so we can go somewhere and you can wrap those beautiful legs around me?" -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 1 16:45:03 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sat Aug 1 16:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Thank god for neighbors and small delicious favors. References: Message-ID: "Bill" wrote in message news:h4urev$pd5$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Heidi" wrote in message > news:h3q9rl$2j3$1@news.spamcop.net... >> >> "Kenneth Brody" wrote in message news:h3q178> Now, >> all you need is some fresh mozzarella ("fresh", as in "if you wait a >>> few minutes, we're making up a new batch in the back"), garlic, basil, >>> salt, and olive oil, and you're all set. >> >> Stop it, you evil man!! :D >> > > LMAO, but doesn't that sound sooooooo good? Does, and I have no tomatoes yet, so he's killin' me..... I do have beans though, lots and LOTS of beans.... From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 1 20:26:45 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Aug 1 20:30:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Palins to Divorce References: Message-ID: AlaskaReport has learned this morning that Todd Palin and former Alaska governor Sarah Palin are to divorce. Multiple sources in Wasilla and Anchorage have confirmed the news. http://alaskareport.com/news39/x71283_divorce_palins.htm A National Enquirer story exposing previous affairs on both sides led to a deterioration of their marriage and the stress from that led to Palin's resignation as governor of Alaska. From MikeE at ster.invalid Sat Aug 1 21:45:11 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sat Aug 1 21:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Palins to Divorce References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > AlaskaReport has learned this morning that Todd Palin and former > Alaska governor Sarah Palin are to divorce. Multiple sources in > Wasilla and Anchorage have confirmed the news. > > http://alaskareport.com/news39/x71283_divorce_palins.htm > > A National Enquirer story exposing previous affairs on both sides led > to a deterioration of their marriage and the stress from that led to > Palin's resignation as governor of Alaska. Alaska Report gets credit for previous scoops; I can't find anything in the Enquirer currently about this; Meg Stapleton sez no. For now, I'm going with her spokesperson's denials on facebook of all places http://snipr.com/oick2 Sarah Palin: No Truth to Latest Rumors Sarah Palin's Notes No Truth to Latest Rumors Today at 11:50am Yet again, some so-called journalists have decided to make up a story. There is no truth to the recent "story" (and story is the correct term for this type of fiction) that the Palins are divorcing. The Palins remain married, committed to each other and their family, and have not purchased land in Montana (last week it was reported to be Long Island). Less than one week ago, Governor Palin asked the media to "quit making things up." We appreciate that the more professional journalists decided to question this story before repeating it. Meg Stapleton -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From me at privacy.net Sun Aug 2 11:35:55 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sun Aug 2 12:05:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Brokeback Mountain, the sequel References: Message-ID: South Carolina man charged with horse buggery. For a second time. http://tinyurl.com/n4s36l http://www.examiner.com/x-15540-New-Orleans-Top-News-Examiner~y2009m7d31-South-Carolina-man-charged-with-having-sex-with-a-horseAGAIN From me at privacy.net Sun Aug 2 19:43:03 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sun Aug 2 19:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] U.S. Health care, examined from an insider Message-ID: This is not meant to be a partisan post, Wendell Potter tells it like it is, speaking from the position of an industry insider. It's revealing: http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html WRT CIGNA it reflects accurately my personal experience. From joegill at removethis Sun Aug 2 20:18:51 2009 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Sun Aug 2 20:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: U.S. Health care, examined from an insider In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h558a9$m05$1@news.spamcop.net... > This is not meant to be a partisan post, Wendell Potter tells it like it > is, > speaking from the position of an industry insider. It's revealing: > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > > WRT CIGNA it reflects accurately my personal experience. > For the opposing view, not a politcal one, but rather a news broadcast.... http://bit.ly/12jm4e From me at privacy.net Sun Aug 2 21:16:31 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sun Aug 2 21:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: U.S. Health care, examined from an insider References: Message-ID: "Joe Gill" wrote in message news:h55adn$v2p$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : news:h558a9$m05$1@news.spamcop.net... : > This is not meant to be a partisan post, Wendell Potter tells it like it : > is, : > speaking from the position of an industry insider. It's revealing: : > : > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html : > : > WRT CIGNA it reflects accurately my personal experience. : > : : : For the opposing view, not a political one, but rather a news broadcast.... : http://bit.ly/12jm4e I've watched too much of Stossel's work to give anything he does much credence. Regardless I don't have audio on this machine so it there is no text transcript I'm out of luck. From me at privacy.net Sun Aug 2 22:35:20 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sun Aug 2 22:40:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Palins to Divorce References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h52r32$2lr$1@news.spamcop.net... : Frog Prince wrote: : > AlaskaReport has learned this morning that Todd Palin and former : > Alaska governor Sarah Palin are to divorce. Multiple sources in : > Wasilla and Anchorage have confirmed the news. : > : > http://alaskareport.com/news39/x71283_divorce_palins.htm : > : > A National Enquirer story exposing previous affairs on both sides led : > to a deterioration of their marriage and the stress from that led to : > Palin's resignation as governor of Alaska. : : Alaska Report gets credit for previous scoops; I can't find anything in : the Enquirer currently about this; Meg Stapleton sez no. : : For now, I'm going with her spokesperson's denials on facebook of all : places http://snipr.com/oick2 Sarah Palin: No Truth to Latest Rumors : : : Sarah Palin's Notes : No Truth to Latest Rumors : Today at 11:50am : Yet again, some so-called journalists have decided to make up a story. : There is no truth to the recent "story" (and story is the correct term : for this type of fiction) that the Palins are divorcing. The Palins : remain married, committed to each other and their family, and have not : purchased land in Montana (last week it was reported to be Long Island). : : Less than one week ago, Governor Palin asked the media to "quit making : things up." We appreciate that the more professional journalists decided : to question this story before repeating it. : : Meg Stapleton : >From another post: "Thomas Van Flein, Sarah Palin's lawyer, threatened Saturday to serve libel papers at a kindergarten to the owner of the highly trafficked "ImmoralMinority" blog for a divorce story on the Palins. The blog was given until 3pm Saturday to remove the story and post a retraction. The blogger stands by the story. This is now the fourth threat on behalf of Sarah Palin, including one to AlaskaReport.com, that Van Flein has made to bloggers in Alaska in the past few weeks. None of which he has carried out." I'm wondering why nothing has been filed on this or the rest of the 'stop or we'll sue'. Still I am reminded that discovery is a bitch. From MikeE at ster.invalid Mon Aug 3 08:40:06 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Mon Aug 3 08:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Palins to Divorce References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > I'm wondering why nothing has been filed on this or the rest of the > 'stop or we'll sue'. Still I am reminded that discovery is a bitch. Some people call those who threaten to sue 'cartooneys' -- that real attorneys either sue or they don't sue -- or they write a nice (or not quite so nice) letter informing someone of what they are doing wrong (just) before they sue. Public figures including politicians mostly don't get to sue people about what they say about them. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 3 16:26:18 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 3 16:30:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] If you have noting better to do ... Message-ID: http://www.rdmag.com/ShowPR.aspx?PUBCODE=014&ACCT=1400000101&ISSUE=0908&RELTYPE=PSC&PRODCODE=00000000&PRODLETT=E&CommonCount=0 From MikeE at ster.invalid Mon Aug 3 18:01:03 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Mon Aug 3 18:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: If you have noting better to do ... References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > they're investigating what goes on in flies' brains while they're flying. Their goal is to put similar capabilities in human hands - for example, to aid in developing robots that can independently apprehend and learn from their surroundings. That sounds like a good plan to me, especially considering how complex the flies' flight is and how small their brains are. I was watching and comparing (not side-by-side) videos of the Toyota robot running vs the Honda robot, which is somewhat slower. The Toyota video also showed a human pushing the robot as if to push him over, which he was able to recover from. Pretty neat. He? The Honda 'bot can do more stuff I think, but I like that running. I believe the Honda one was the one that went/walked up and down the stairs, which seemed pretty complicated to me. Maybe more than running - but maybe running and stopping is even harder. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 3 19:11:01 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 3 19:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] A picture is worth a thousand words Message-ID: http://img.timeinc.net:80/time/cartoons/20090626/cartoons_01.jpg From MikeE at ster.invalid Mon Aug 3 20:33:37 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Mon Aug 3 20:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > http://img.timeinc.net:80/time/cartoons/20090626/cartoons_01.jpg Scal Pal? scalpel -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 3 20:43:29 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 3 20:45:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > http://img.timeinc.net:80/time/cartoons/20090626/cartoons_01.jpg > > > > So what are most people's opinions about the health care reform? My neighbor (right-wing conservative) is scared shitless, he says. Me, I see big problems with it...but it doesn't look any worse than what we currently have overall. From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 3 21:56:17 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 3 22:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C5CDBA1782B7TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was Borgholio ! : : > So what are most people's opinions about the health care reform? : : Well... Wyden's version scares me the most, I guess. I scares me 'cause I : have 100%, choose my own provider coverage. He proposes to take all of : that away and given everyone something or other. The something or other : can't possibly be as good as what I already have. : : The prez's bill seems outlandishly huge. : : The theory of universal healthcare works for me. Totally. I've been the : little guy (uninsured student with nasty accident) more times than I'd like : to admit. And yet, you know, that experience showed me something in and of : itself... It showed me that this universal healthcare thing already : exists, to some extent. I had my (expensive enough) wounds treated. I : didn't have to go into debt for the rest of my life or whatever. You were very lucky to get treatment. As to medical debt it goes away after 4 years and off the full record after 7 but for far too many coverage is too limited and often denied until it's too late. : But, yeah. That's annecdotal evidence. I guess I don't have any other on : the subject. It's my annecdote or the one they publish in the paper about : some guy's life being ruined. Well, shucks. : : I guess that it seems to me like they're trying to put a MA-type system in : place - force employers to insure workers. Well, golly, it doesn't take a : Nobel winner in economics to know that this will have a deleterious effect : on business/the economy. : : It's a tough call. Doing away with the insurance companies altogether and : going to a totally socialixed system seems the best way to do things. But, : well, those companies have a lot of pull (bling) in Congress so that will : never happen. So, basically, you're screwed. Much of the problem with insurance companies could be addressed by removing their anti trust status and doing away with their ERISA exemption to accountability. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 3 23:25:05 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Mon Aug 3 23:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV References: Message-ID: "Bill" wrote in message news:h4urb9$odr$1@news.spamcop.net... > > > well, maybe better late than never, but if you've still not decided on a > solution, I've had Dish for 3 or 4 years now and outside of a couple of > somewhat *minor* issues, i've been happy with them.. I had direct TV many > years ago and while they weren't bad, i wasn't totally impressed by them > enough to go back to them when my cable bill started climbing beyond what > I felt was a good price because I wanted to have a single channel that > wasn't in their "base" package... > > Bill Well, I've made a decision not to make a decision, because I've just found out that my landlords have put this property on the market so they can buy into an assisted living place. So if they get their price, (too much for what it is, everyone says unlikely but with my luck someone will come along next week) after being here 20 years, I will have to move, which is really bad in terms of "I can't afford to live anywhere around here", and piss poor timing with my mother deteriorating by the day and having to spend most of my free time with her. I don't think I'll need cable if I'm living in my car... :( From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 4 00:58:17 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 4 01:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-381EBE.19405503082009@killface.local... : In article , : Charles wrote: : : > I had my (expensive enough) wounds treated. I : > didn't have to go into debt for the rest of my life or whatever. : : Acute care for relatively poor isn't going to bankrupt or kill you. At one time that was more true than not but of late the hospitals have gotten quite creative in dealing with expensive treatments. One case I know of personally the patient presented at ER with chest pains. Patient's family gave the admitting desk the insurance info and the patient was processed through to ICU and scheduled for a group of normal protocols for the DX including a by pass. The patient's insurance erroneously informed the hospital there was no coverage. the hospitalist (doc working for the hospital to control cost) determine that the patient was no longer critical and sent him home (this before any test were run). Patient subsequently came back to the ER with more chest pains. This time the insurance verified coverage. Patient had an emergency 3X by pass that was scheduled then determined as unnecessary only a few days before. : It's the lack of preventative care, or the bills for the middle class : without insurance that is the problem. Depending on which source you chose the bankruptcy court data reports that 50 to 70% of bankruptcy cases are either direly cased by medical bills or contributed to signifantly by insurance companies failure to approve/pay legitimate bills. According to the GAO a significant number of disability and resultant SSA claims are the result of denial of treatment by the insurance industry. : Most hospitals have charity programs or just write off accounts where : the payer doesn't have assets, but they will hunt you down and sue you : if you have tangible assets. (I worked in the billing department of a : hospital) They will harass even those without the means to pay as well. : My anecdote of nearly dying from lack of preventative care when I had : no insurance has already been told here at least once. : -- : -David From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 4 07:33:41 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Steven Underwood) Date: Tue Aug 4 07:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: How did that work for you? I know personally of one person who went bankrupt due to a severe injury (~$30,000) just after he got out of school (and was no longer on his parents insurance). "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C5CDBA1782B7TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > > The theory of universal healthcare works for me. Totally. I've been the > little guy (uninsured student with nasty accident) more times than I'd > like > to admit. And yet, you know, that experience showed me something in and > of > itself... It showed me that this universal healthcare thing already > exists, to some extent. I had my (expensive enough) wounds treated. I > didn't have to go into debt for the rest of my life or whatever. > From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 4 09:02:39 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 4 09:05:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > "Steven Underwood" >> "Charles" >>> I had my (expensive enough) wounds treated. >>> I didn't have to go into debt for the rest of my life or whatever. > >> How did that work for you? > > I don't know. I hear all of these other horror stories and I just can't > relate. I mean, I went to the hospital. They did a thorough job > checking things out (MRI, etc). I went to the hospital social worker > (before leaving) and filled out some "I can't pay" paperwork and that > was the end of it. In CA, a person such as a student or anyone else who doesn't have assets is/becomes eligible for Medi-Cal based on their medical expenses. That is; here's an ordinary young person who doesn't want or need insurance because they don't think they are going to get sick or hurt and because they can't afford it - the high cost of 'regular' insurance other than student insurance. Lo! and behold. They get sick or hurt and end up in the hospital. The hospital's case worker comes to them and sez 'how are you planning on paying for all this?' and of course they say they have no idea. Then the process/application for medi-cal begins. What it comes down to is that when your assets are depleted, which for the student living on hir parents' dole is immediately and the car, if any, is in the parents' name, then that person is (only) responsible for a 'spend down' portion of the medical bills. Even an employed worker who can deplete their assets and has an income is eligible for the 'spend down'. The spend-down is some modest amount of money, say a couple of hundred dollars per month that they have to pay for their medical care. Everything else is picked up by the state of CA which is who the hospital and the doctors are going to be going to for their reimbursement. If this medical care needs extends beyond the month of August (medi-cal spend-down is adjudged month by month), then they have to spend another couple of hundred for Sep. That is, they have to spend if they have any income. If they have no income or other eligibility concepts, then they don't have to spend at all. They get their medi-cal 'stickers' each month that they are eligible. Providers get paid with a sticker. There is no 'debt' involved for a person such as that. It is regular people with assets which aren't structured for moving into eligibilty for Medi-Cal who have to worry about somehow being responsible for large medical expenses. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 4 12:16:56 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Tue Aug 4 12:20:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h59bh5$suk$1@news.spamcop.net... > Charles wrote: >> "Steven Underwood" >>> "Charles" > ... > There is no 'debt' involved for a person such as that. It is regular > people with assets which aren't structured for moving into eligibilty > for Medi-Cal who have to worry about somehow being responsible for large > medical expenses. No they needn't worry, they just need to go destitute, which isn't that hard to accomplish with medical bills. At least in California, the Med-Cal bill is shared among all state residents. But in many states, it is the uninsured who have assets that foot the bill for the "indigent". This is normally the group that either can't afford private insurance, or gambles with their health. (Try paying the premium for Charles' insurance from an unemployment cheque, I suspect Charles' and his employers contribution for his insurance together exceed an unemployment cheque) The insurers manage to negotiate rates that don't pay unfunded health care, the sick individual withoutt insurance does not have that bargaining power. For many, the choice is food and shelter or health insurance. As an observation on the incredible BS we are fed by the Republicans, Fox and the insurance industry. In Canada I was complete free to choose my doctors, and hospitals. In the US with pertty nicely plated insurance I need to use "in-plan" doctors , face a higher total deductible and copays. I need to use in-plan hospitals or foot the difference between negotiated rates and the fees. I need to have all procedures beyond office visits vetted by the insurer. I never had to go through all that BS in Canada, even out of province. (Health plans are provincial, with federal subsidy) Most of the public criticisms of "public" health plans are outright lies, but just like the Germans fell fot the big lie, Americans fall for it too. The big lie in this case is accusing some nonexistant (at this point theoretical) public health plan of having the failings that are actually those of most private plans, without also admitting to the same failings. The Health Industry (Insurance, Pharma, Doctors and Hospitals) has managed to gouge out over 20% of the GDP for itself. None of those on that gravy train want to give any of it up, and their shareholders want them to grow it. There will be blood. Please excuse misspellings and typos, my spillchucker decided I was French, and can't locate my English dictionaries. From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 4 13:11:52 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 4 13:15:11 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: David Dean wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> In CA, a person such as a student or anyone else who doesn't have >> assets is/becomes eligible for Medi-Cal based on their medical >> expenses. > > I suspect that you are oversimplifying this Well I'm certainly oversimplifying it, as it is a gigantic bureaucratic morass and monster. > and exaggerating a great > deal. Noooo... I don't know of anything that was 'exaggerated' - more like described sparingly - just the opposite. If anything the explanation was inadequate or even inaccurate by its brevity, but not exaggerated. > I applied for Medicaid after college because I knew I'd need > something to cover my asthma treatment Medicaid being the federal program which I know considerably less about than the CA state medi-cal program. > and was denied medicaid, but I > was given food stamps, which I didn't think I needed. (I had a slightly > better than minimum wage job) I applied again shortly after I got > married. I was again denied any medical benefits. My employer's benefits > were set to kick in in 90 days, which turned out to be just under a week > too late. In CA, each month you would be eligible to be evaluated for medi-cal. In the application process they would consider your income against your medical expenses. Let's say you might have a 'zero' spend-down if you had no income. Then you get medi-cal stickers from the gitgo. If you had income, then you don't get stickers until you have spent X dollars on medical expenses. If you had income and a wife, the formula would be adjusted. I don't know much about those relative values. Each month you have to try again to get medi-cal, because the stickers 'go away' at the end of the month. It isn't like the medi-cal system puts you on an insurance program with medical benefits. You only get medi-cal when - the month - you 'qualify'. If you have income, you don't qualify (unless as below). If you have income and medical expenses, you still don't qualify. You only qualify when you have 'spent down' the assigned number of medical expense dollars required under the program. After you qualify, you get stickers for the rest of the month. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Aug 4 13:44:59 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Aug 4 13:45:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > I make my builder nervous. Of course, he just told me that it will cost > $120k more than budget for my house. Like, what? How did we get to this > point. I'm very frustrated. Did he explain why the sudden increase in price? From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 4 13:53:09 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 4 13:55:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: David Dean wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> Each month you have to try again to get medi-cal, because the stickers >> 'go away' at the end of the month. > There seems to be far too much overhead in that system and very > limited benefit. It almost seems orchestrated to fail to provide the > needed services. It is a bureacracy. It has huge overhead and expenses. It is besieged with people who spend their lives gaming systems -- people on both ends of it and in the middle. People abusing the system to 'get stuff' they want, people/corporations abusing the system to get medi-cal reimbursement from it. It tries to cut expenses wherever it can. The tiny little stickers are pretty economical. The 'online' system of databases can be accessed in numerous ways besides a computer such as touchtone phones by even the most backward of practioners. It is designed to try to provide the funds to enable patients/clients to access medical care which they need and can't afford and to attempt to deter the abuses while trying to provide the minimum reimbursement to medical care providers to keep them willing to participate in the system at all. Everyone acts like this business of 3rd party payers and government oversight of the healthcare delivery and reimbursement system is going to be 'easy' and work right. It isn't working right now and it is going to get way way way more complicated and have all kinds of ways it isn't going to work in the future, but maybe better we all hope. Certainly vastly more expensive for everyone -- everyone being 'us' who pays the bills for the gummit -- and us who has been paying the overhead for the insurance and the delivery systems and the private pay and the gummit in the past. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 4 15:28:48 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 4 15:30:11 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > Charles wrote: >> I make my builder nervous. Of course, he just told me that it will >> cost $120k more than budget for my house. Like, what? How did we get >> to this point. I'm very frustrated. > > Did he explain why the sudden increase in price? Chas leaves a lot of mileage in between statements like "I make my builder nervous." and "He just told me .... $120k more.." It's as if someone tore down most of the Burma Shave signs... If daisies/ Are your/ ... ... ... Burma Shave -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 4 16:10:02 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 4 16:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> If daisies/ Are your/ ... ... ... Burma Shave > > They are, oh, are they ever! ... Favorite flower/ Keep pushin' up those/ Miles per hour I never saw any other color but white on red, but apparently a few other places they did it differently because of a state's rules. 1963 Philip Morris bought the company and dc/ed the signs Burma-Vita had started in the '20s and flourished for decades. The name rose again from the ashes; 1996 American Safety Razor bought the name and started putting it on shaving brush and mug sets. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Aug 4 16:14:12 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Aug 4 16:15:10 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > It wasn't me! It was Borgholio ! >> Charles wrote: > >>> I make my builder nervous. Of course, he just told me that it will >>> cost $120k more than budget for my house. Like, what? How did we >>> get to this point. I'm very frustrated. >> Did he explain why the sudden increase in price? > > He wasn't paying attention. No, he didn't say that - he blamed the > architect. Like he hasn't seen the plans all along. Give me a break! Well jeez, IANAL, but that almost sounds like breach of contract. I would reasonably expect the construction cost to go up a little bit due to unforeseen circumstances, but 120k? That's outrageous. From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 4 16:39:07 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 4 16:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > Charles wrote: >> He wasn't paying attention. No, he didn't say that - he blamed the >> architect. Like he hasn't seen the plans all along. Give me a break! > > Well jeez, IANAL, but that almost sounds like breach of contract. I > would reasonably expect the construction cost to go up a little bit due > to unforeseen circumstances, but 120k? That's outrageous. Not everyone builds a house the same way. Some people make a contract for a particular house for a particular price with a lot of details and specifications, but not nearly all of the possible details can be imagined/spec/ed. Some people enter into a 'trust but verify' relationship with the builder/contractor, in which the builder is guaranteed his profit (basically) and the homeowner gets the house built for cost (of building) plus that profit. The homeowner is trusting the builder to make the smartest decisions for how to spend money most wisely and get the best prices out of the subs. Naturally the owner should be controlling the payout chunks all along the way. In the case of mistakes and such, the owner and the builder should be reasonable men or women and work that out as to whose ox will get gored. A builder cannot possibly imagine all of the glitches and extra costs and unextra savings which will come up along the way. When he bids a fixed contract, he has to put plenty of cushion in there and plenty of wiggle room in the contract so that he can make his profit - which profit is reasonable and expected. Why not negotiate the profit up front!? Why not wrestle with these issues of what surprises arise along the way and be able to make wise adjusted decisions. What happens to the people who make fixed contracts is that the fixed contract goes out the window as soon as the owner starts modifying earlier decisions along the way. Let's don't do this. Let's do that. Let's do this instead of that; it would be better and cheaper. Building a house is not like ordering a new car. There are a ton of unpredictable variables that should be worked out between the builder and the owner working as partners, not adversaries. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 4 18:00:02 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Aug 4 18:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C5DAA6956A3ETheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > We're not even into construction yet - just trying to establish the > contract. But I'm amazed that we could be this far into the process and > still have numbers that are this wrong. And the builder keeps telling me > that he just wants me to leave the job to him - to let him take care of > everything. No fricking way, dude! Yeah hello, let him write his own paycheck with no interference from you?? Um, just no, Mr. Scam Artist. Why don't you advertise for bids, get several contractors bidding the same items and see what happens? From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 4 18:33:13 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 4 18:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > We're sick of it all for right now and we're going to go and > look at some houses for sale. Yeah. That way you don't have to see all the things that went wrong in the process of someone working for the lowest bid. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 4 18:46:35 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 4 18:50:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: Mike Easter wrote: > Charles wrote: > >> We're sick of it all for right now and we're going to go and >> look at some houses for sale. > > Yeah. That way you don't have to see all the things that went wrong in > the process of someone working for the lowest bid. Or in the case of the bid business, take something like ceramic tile work in the pool or bathroom or kitchen area. Look at the work by this-that-or-theother guy. Then look at the work by *this* guy. The craftsman's work is way better; but if you get the low bid tiler and his results don't look like that wonderful job you saw in that demo model, you can't say "Hey, you tile like a drunk . Rip all of that tile out and get me a real tiler like Mrs. Jones had!" Your contractor will say; "I'm very sorry. If you want to hire a destructor and a new tiler to make this look like you think it could, you are on your own. If you think you are going to make me pay for some kind of ethereal visions you have in your head, you're crazy. This *is* a bid business, you know." Multiply that by everything from the knock-down texture on the wall to whatever else can't be put into a spec and you will see what I mean. Specs don't actually say what something really looks like. There is a *lot* of work - subcontracting - that goes into the building of a house which should *not* be done by the low bidder. If you were the contractor and you knew what he knows from his experience building houses and seeing the results of many many different subcontractors over the years and you were doing your own subbing, you would pick *those* guys (that he would pick) instead of the low bidders. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 4 19:20:10 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 4 19:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> you would pick *those* >> guys (that he would pick) instead of the low bidders. > > Right. No problem. It's just that the price is a surprise - he should > have known we were leading up to this. He should have stopped things a > lot earlier in the process. Getting our hopes all up for months and > then dashing them just like that is nuts. As usual, we are missing the essential meaningful details; but if you said, "How much would it cost to build me a house 'roughly' like this?' Then he sez - 'Roughly this.' Then you say, 'Well OK then. That sounds good. Now lets go over some of these details.' Then he sez OK fine. Then he also later sez, 'Well considering who I'm working with and what your tastes and demands are like, this price right here is a lot closer to what I'm (now) thinking about.' -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 4 19:30:36 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 4 19:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > $120k more than budget for my house. Some people in the neighborhood did some interior work on their house. With laborers of their own choosing who have worked for them doing such things in the past; no contractor. No remodeling, per se. All the walls stayed right where they were. It's not a very big house at all probably a bit over 2000 sf. Some new stuff on the floors, carpeting and a little bit of wood flooring. Some new or resurfaced kitchen cabinets and appliances and such. Paint some walls and ceilings, maybe all of them. No roofing, no infrastructure HVAC, no plumbing except for the applicance install. They told me the other day (in response to my thoughtless remark about how at least they didn't spend any serious money remodeling - oops) that they spent well over a hundred grand touching things up. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From joegill at removethis Wed Aug 5 00:14:23 2009 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Wed Aug 5 00:15:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C5DC034B278TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "Mike Easter" ! > >> you would pick *those* >> guys (that he would pick) instead of the low bidders. > > Right. No problem. It's just that the price is a surprise - he should > have known we were leading up to this. He should have stopped things a > lot > earlier in the process. Getting our hopes all up for months and then > dashing them just like that is nuts. Just as a warning too, I have heard that once you agree on a price, allow yourself 20% more! What happens is that sometimes the person spec'd 'standard' items, like you would see in a commercial bathroon/restaurant, and you had planned on more 'upscale'. Also, there was a story on TV here, how some builder are using a different (cheaper) type of wood, that goes up like balsa wood when there is a fire! Make sure to spec out exactly what you want. On the other hand, I don't know about your area, but times are tough for builders too. You might be able to squeeze him/her more!! From MikeE at ster.invalid Wed Aug 5 09:54:42 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Wed Aug 5 09:55:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> they spent well over a hundred grand touching things up. > > Wow. I didn't see the bills; people exaggerate. But the workmen were there a lot longer than it seems that they should have been. Maybe they were milking the job. I do expect some bucks were spent in the kitchen and the baths. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From kenbrody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 5 12:48:10 2009 From: kenbrody at spamcop.net (Kenneth Brody) Date: Wed Aug 5 12:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: [...] > Well jeez, IANAL, but that almost sounds like breach of contract. I > would reasonably expect the construction cost to go up a little bit due > to unforeseen circumstances, but 120k? That's outrageous. And I assume it's not 120K added onto a 12M original price. -- Kenneth Brody From me at privacy.net Wed Aug 5 16:38:21 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Aug 5 16:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C5EA0F73C302TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : It wasn't me! It was Kenneth Brody ! : : > fios : : Ooh. How's that treating you? They've been sending out flyers in the : neighborhood trying to get people to sign up... We have it and it works well for our needs. Two points: Record and document all your dealings with them (does the term 'Lies like rugs' have any meaning?) Support sucks. Most don't have a clue, the rest don't seem to Give a sh|t From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 6 09:11:19 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 6 09:15:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: arg References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > Little sleep and high stress => fricking chest pains again. Grr. There need to be better ways to positively diagnose some of the exterior causes of chestpain from the ribs and muscles and gristle. The problems with the standard strategy is that the doctor has an obligation to try to remove cardiac sources from the differential, such as EKG and bloodtests, which are crude and imperfect in doing such removal - or go to even more trouble than that, advancing greatly the costs and risks such as thallium scans and physical stresstests. Then the typical results so far as it goes with any suboptimal strategy are negative, meaning that even more invasive or dangerous tests /could/ be done, because it is still possible to be cardiac, but in reality way back at the beginning when the first EKG and bloodtest was done, if there were a handy dandy test that could demonstrate the exterior cause in a positive way instead of by impossible elimination of the inside organs, then the wrong pony wouldn't have been being chased around from the gitgo. Also, there's lots of stuff inside the chest besides the heart. There's lungs and lung wrappers, esophagus and its interior, and so forth. And the medical specialists like to do the kinds of tests that involve organs that they deal with. 'These' docs like to do lots of cardiac related tests. These docs over here like to do all kinds of intestinal related tests, blood tests for stomach bacteria, look at your stomach with a scope. It is too bad the fine art of physical diagnosis by astute examination and clinical history has been largely lost. That's where the Sherlock Holmes stories came from. The Sherlock Holmes or Professor John Bell of Doyle's background wouldn't make any money these days, whereas the fee for service process that likes to do and interpret all of these tests is in the *bu$ine$$' of practicing financially rewarding and also tort-defensive medicine. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 6 10:25:38 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 6 10:30:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: arg References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> or go to even more trouble than that, advancing greatly the >> costs and risks such as thallium scans and physical stresstests. > > Been there, Done those. Last round of these. They didn't find nuthin'. That's my point. The way to diagnose a common condition is not to do a thousand tests which negative results fail to positively diagnose other different conditions. > And thus I'm not very inclined to seek out there services. But it is > bugging me... Grr. I'm not going to go and waste my day in the er > again. Grr... Oh, but, hey, that was a weird one. I was there for 6 > hours and had all kinds of tests and stuff done and the only bill they > sent me was for $25 for a chest xray. Very strange, I say. Maybe it was a mistake in the billing. However, just because one diagnostician was not astute doesn't mean that some other more astute diagnostician cannot figure out the right way to make the best diagnosis. Imagine some kind of potentially ruinous process going on - a warning light comes on. The mechanic investigates and finds nothing. The next time the warning light comes on I guess you should just ignore it because it has already been fruitlessly investigated? Or, does it mean that it should be investigated 'better' the next time -- better doesn't mean a whole lot more stupidity. Better means less stupidity and more smart. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 6 12:01:11 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 6 12:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: arg References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> Or, does it mean >> that it should be investigated 'better' the next time -- better doesn't >> mean a whole lot more stupidity. Better means less stupidity and more >> smart. > > I hear you. I don't know where to start the process. My doc looked and > sent me to the local cardiologist who looked and said, "You're fine." > Well, trust me, I don't feel fine. If your doc doesn't do a thorough, insightful history and an 'integrated' (with the history) careful physical examination, then you should find a primary care doctor who knows how to do that very well. Going to a doctor who is 'too busy' (or whatever) to know how to do that - and to actually do that - instead of ordering tests and making referrals is a waste of your time, someone's money, and potentially your health's management. *You* are the one responsible for your health and its managment. The doctors you spend your money or your time or your diagnostic risks on are just the alleged experts which you have directly or indirectly chosen to guide you in doing that health care management. If you are making bad healthcare choices because you made other bad healthcare management choices, then it is time for *you* to start making some better choices and better management of your health and its risks. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 6 12:13:01 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 6 12:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: arg References: Message-ID: Mike Easter wrote: > *You* are the one responsible for your health and its managment. Also; I don't know why people should feel so *constrained* by something or other that has to do with some kind of business decisions which were made in the name of insurance or other 3rd party payer arrangements. "I'm making stupid (ill-advised if you prefer) decisions because of some other (or someone else's) stupid insurance decisions." You do *not* have to go see some particular physician because they are on your insurance plan - which is a weird concept if you think about it. This is the US and you are a free agent to hire any doctor you want to hire to see you and examine you. You (also) should not expect that every single thing you do medically is going to be covered by some kind of particular previous contractual arrangment. Another advantage of paying for a doctor's visit with your own money is that if they get ready to order some kind of test, you are properly motivated to say, "Hey! Wait a minute! I'm going to be paying for everything we do here -- let's not be making any health dollar expenditure decisions willy nilly." What is the point of ordering a test for which the result is expected to be negative? How much closer to the real answer does that negative result bring you? Imagine that the doctor and the patient are trying to arrive at a proper diagnosis as if it were a software algorithm tree, if/then ifnot/thenwhat? Draw out the tree and a thousand or so sub-branches before taking a single Yes/No labtest result order. You will see how stupid some of the decisions are for ordering tests. It is as if they never saw such a tree. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 6 12:20:50 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 6 12:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h58f5k$jco$1@news.spamcop.net... > : Most hospitals have charity programs or just write off accounts where > : the payer doesn't have assets, but they will hunt you down and sue you > : if you have tangible assets. (I worked in the billing department of a > : hospital) The dumbest thing I've heard hospitals accused of doing is charging full price for patients without insurance. "Full Price" is about 2-3 times what they know they will get back from insurance companies, but they expect the indigent/uninsured to pay 3 times what they'd accept as payment from insurance? That is so ludicrous it's not even funny. Speaking of which, I still haven't gotten any insurance since my COBRA coverage ended on July 31. I have 63 days (why the weird number?) to get get my application in for new insurance with the state of MD before my COBRA rollover benefits end (coverage for existing conditions etc.). I'm pushing it by not applying until close to the end of the period, I'll end up saving almost $1000, at the risk of being in an accident (non-auto) that sends me to the ER or doc. I paid all of my medical bills for this year out of pocket because I didn't meet the max out-of-pocket, so it's not like it's costing me any money by not having insurance. Only bugaboo is no scrip coverage -- my nice doc was kind enough to write double scrips for me in my last month of coverage so I wouldn't have to pay for scrip meds out of pocket for at least a month. I joined CVS's no-insurance scrip benefit plan and the prices are pretty damn good, except for my Benicar, which will cost $187 to refill. I've been skipping doses every couple of days for a couple of reasons: 1) make the current scrip last longer, and 2) my BP got so low at times (91/54 for instance) that I was almost fainting when getting up off the couch after sitting down for a while. It's kind of ironic that right after the stress of facing another FCE test (the one that totally fscked up my left elbow, neck, and right wrist) was removed my BP dropped like a rock (high BP was the reason I couldn't finish the first FCE test). I stopped taking my second BP med, a calcium channel blocker, almost a month ago, and my BP still gets really low at times. It's a real problem, because my other BP med Benicar was prescribed by my lyme doc as part of the Marshall Protocol for fighting my CWD problem, which was likely caused by my past lyme infection. One of his patients takes 4-5 40 mg tabs per DAY, and I can barely tolerate 2 40 mg tabs per day right now. So it's either slow down my rate of recovery from CWD, which is coming along pretty well, or deal with the possible fainting/injury from falling problem. From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 6 13:06:36 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 6 13:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > The dumbest thing I've heard hospitals accused of doing is charging full > price for patients without insurance. That is a huge understatement. It isn't just hospitals -- it is everything that you can imagine that has anything to do with medical care; (where I say all, I mean almost all) -- all doctors, all laboratories, all pharmacies, all durable medical goods, all everything. A private patient who has cash in their hand pays some number of mulitples of what everyone else pays. Sometimes it is 10x as much. The doctor/hospital/laboratory may have to wait months and months and fill out piles and piles of paperwork to get the greatly reduced reimbursement from the 3rd party payer. Worst of all, they may also be denied reimbursement payment altogether. The private patient with cash in their hand requires no paperwork, no waiting, no denial -- so they sometimes pay 10x as much; guaranteed to be 2-3x as much. Every provider should have a policy called 'cash discount'. The idea being that the provider has a price they can call 'usual and customary' and that is the retail price they bill the insurance company (or a patient who wants to charge it; or the patient who sez 'bill my insurance company' - the charge is full retail, approximately triple the 'wholesale' cost). The 3rd party payor isn't going to reimburse them anything like their retail fee. The same provider (according to my policy recommendation) should/*must* give the cash paying patient the same price as the lowest reimbursement rate they are willing to contract for with some/any 3rd party payer. Why should the slow poor paying paperwork requiring 3rd party get a cheaper price? It makes no sense. Cash-paying, BTW, means real payment that clears such as greenbacks or pre-approved plastic; not 'charge it' or a bad check. A bad check or charge it service is charged at the full retail price -- the cash discount is lost for anything other than transacted dollars at the time of service. That is, there is tremendous expense and losses associated with anything other than the equivalent of real cash. The providers say that the reimbursements from the 3rd party payors are so low that they can't afford to give those same prices to everyone -- if that gives you a clue to how things are going to work in the future. They have to make up the losses on the 3rd party reimbursements on the backs of the private payors. And the private payors are sometimes -- very very frequently -- some of the working poor, while the wealthy all have insurance. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 6 13:38:44 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 6 15:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: arg References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5ekpm$dpd$1@news.spamcop.net... : Charles wrote: : > Little sleep and high stress => fricking chest pains again. Grr. : : There need to be better ways to positively diagnose some of the exterior : causes of chestpain from the ribs and muscles and gristle. : : The problems with the standard strategy is that the doctor has an : obligation to try to remove cardiac sources from the differential, such : as EKG and bloodtests, which are crude and imperfect in doing such : removal - or go to even more trouble than that, advancing greatly the : costs and risks such as thallium scans and physical stresstests. : : Then the typical results so far as it goes with any suboptimal strategy : are negative, meaning that even more invasive or dangerous tests /could/ : be done, because it is still possible to be cardiac, but in reality way : back at the beginning when the first EKG and bloodtest was done, if : there were a handy dandy test that could demonstrate the exterior cause : in a positive way instead of by impossible elimination of the inside : organs, then the wrong pony wouldn't have been being chased around from : the gitgo. : : Also, there's lots of stuff inside the chest besides the heart. There's : lungs and lung wrappers, esophagus and its interior, and so forth. : : And the medical specialists like to do the kinds of tests that involve : organs that they deal with. 'These' docs like to do lots of cardiac : related tests. These docs over here like to do all kinds of intestinal : related tests, blood tests for stomach bacteria, look at your stomach : with a scope. : : It is too bad the fine art of physical diagnosis by astute examination : and clinical history has been largely lost. That's where the Sherlock : Holmes stories came from. : : The Sherlock Holmes or Professor John Bell of Doyle's background : wouldn't make any money these days, whereas the fee for service process : that likes to do and interpret all of these tests is in the *bu$ine$$' : of practicing financially rewarding and also tort-defensive medicine. Long time back there were portable EKG machines (first use a common stereo tape recorder) one channel was the pilot to sync the timing the other had heart data. New machines are multi--track and use digital recording. Ones used for patients that are out and about are independent. Ones used in hospital have a radio link to the cardiac nurses station. Might see if one is available as it could either pin point the problem or eliminate the heart as a source. From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 6 16:00:05 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 6 16:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h5evt2$n2i$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : news:h58f5k$jco$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : Most hospitals have charity programs or just write off accounts where : > : the payer doesn't have assets, but they will hunt you down and sue you : > : if you have tangible assets. (I worked in the billing department of a : > : hospital) : : The dumbest thing I've heard hospitals accused of doing is charging full : price for patients without insurance. "Full Price" is about 2-3 times what : they know they will get back from insurance companies, but they expect the : indigent/uninsured to pay 3 times what they'd accept as payment from : insurance? That is so ludicrous it's not even funny. : : Speaking of which, I still haven't gotten any insurance since my COBRA : coverage ended on July 31. I have 63 days (why the weird number?) to get get : my application in for new insurance with the state of MD before my COBRA : rollover benefits end (coverage for existing conditions etc.). I'm pushing : it by not applying until close to the end of the period, I'll end up saving : almost $1000, at the risk of being in an accident (non-auto) that sends me : to the ER or doc. I paid all of my medical bills for this year out of pocket : because I didn't meet the max out-of-pocket, so it's not like it's costing : me any money by not having insurance. Get a low low ball coverage just so you can maintain the continuity. My son did this and he's on the short list a new that has a 90 day wait. : : Only bugaboo is no scrip coverage -- my nice doc was kind enough to write : double scrips for me in my last month of coverage so I wouldn't have to pay : for scrip meds out of pocket for at least a month. I joined CVS's : no-insurance scrip benefit plan and the prices are pretty damn good, except : for my Benicar, which will cost $187 to refill. I've been skipping doses : every couple of days for a couple of reasons: 1) make the current scrip last : longer, and 2) my BP got so low at times (91/54 for instance) that I was : almost fainting when getting up off the couch after sitting down for a : while. Get back to me back channle I may have a solution (complicated forms but it does work) : : It's kind of ironic that right after the stress of facing another FCE test : (the one that totally fscked up my left elbow, neck, and right wrist) was : removed my BP dropped like a rock (high BP was the reason I couldn't finish : the first FCE test). I stopped taking my second BP med, a calcium channel : blocker, almost a month ago, and my BP still gets really low at times. It's : a real problem, because my other BP med Benicar was prescribed by my lyme : doc as part of the Marshall Protocol for fighting my CWD problem, which was : likely caused by my past lyme infection. One of his patients takes 4-5 40 mg : tabs per DAY, and I can barely tolerate 2 40 mg tabs per day right now. So : it's either slow down my rate of recovery from CWD, which is coming along : pretty well, or deal with the possible fainting/injury from falling problem. : From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 6 17:17:05 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 6 17:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: arg References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > Might see if one is available as it could either pin point the problem > or eliminate the heart as a source. The/OneBig problem is that no matter how many channels it has or how great the level of expertise at looking at a bunch of needle squiggles, a negative cardiogram doesn't eliminate the heart as a source of pain; and it (negative) most certainly and spectacularly doesn't answer the patient's and the doctor's question, 'why does my chest (seem to) hurt?' -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 6 17:51:50 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 6 17:55:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: arg References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5fh8f$fh4$1@news.spamcop.net... : Frog Prince wrote: : : > Might see if one is available as it could either pin point the problem : > or eliminate the heart as a source. : : The/OneBig problem is that no matter how many channels it has or how : great the level of expertise at looking at a bunch of needle squiggles, : a negative cardiogram doesn't eliminate the heart as a source of pain; : and it (negative) most certainly and spectacularly doesn't answer the : patient's and the doctor's question, 'why does my chest (seem to) hurt?' : The point is to eliminate a potential problem or at least identify the source. Way back when (mid 60's) use used AD converts and an IBM 360 to run Fourier analysis of various data and yes the process does work. Again much depends on the skill of the cardiologist but without real time data when the problem presents. Not unlike taking your car to a mechanic with a 'funny noise' that is not present when the mechanic is there. One of the devices I designed would continuously monitor the patient with a 10 min loop. If the patient had an incident the last 2 min before the incident was preserved as well as the following 7 or 8 min. Currently EMS can real time transmit that data on the way to ER. An interesting aside. 10 or so years back when I had my by pass there was another patient in ICU that was moved to on the ICU floor but real time monitoring. All hell broke lose at the nursures station and they busted into the room with the crash cart and 6 or 8 people only to find the old boy actively engaged in prohibited activity with a woman that was not his wife. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 6 20:02:16 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Aug 6 20:05:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: arg References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5ep53$f3s$1@news.spamcop.net... > Maybe it was a mistake in the billing. > > However, just because one diagnostician was not astute doesn't mean that > some other more astute diagnostician cannot figure out the right way to > make the best diagnosis. > > Imagine some kind of potentially ruinous process going on - a warning > light comes on. The mechanic investigates and finds nothing. The next > time the warning light comes on I guess you should just ignore it > because it has already been fruitlessly investigated? Or, does it mean > that it should be investigated 'better' the next time -- better doesn't > mean a whole lot more stupidity. Better means less stupidity and more > smart. My opinion after seeing a lot of them is that doctors just plain suck - they're mostly lazy and don't want to be involved in anything that isn't easy to figure out. God forbid we should ever think outside the box.... From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 6 20:22:21 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 6 20:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: arg References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > The point is to eliminate a potential problem or at least identify the > source. Hello, MrEKG. I would like to hook you up to the patient so that you can tell me what is causing his chest pain. -- I'm afraid I can't do that Dave. What do you mean? -- I mean I can tell you a multitude of other informations and data based on my highly sophisticated and progressively developed and digitally transmitted and recorded multichannel output with enhanced sensor inputs and algorithmically overseen logic circuits, but... But, what, MrEKG? -- ...but I can't *actually* answer the target question as you have defined it, 'What is causing the subject's chest pain?' I wasn't programmed for that, Dave. Would you like for me to answer some other questions about the subject's status, such as what his heart rate is, does his heart have any arrythmias, does his heart have any ongoing or past evidence of myocardial damage, such as that? No, Hal errrm MrEKG. My question is 'what is causing the subject's chest pain?' -- Perhaps you should ask a human who has actually conversed with and examined the patient, Dave. I'm just a very fancy machine with a lot of sensors and electronics and screens and output recorders and alarm algorithms. I make output which is delivered to highly specialized humans sometimes thousands of miles away who have never even talked to the subject or put their hands on him to touch him where it hurts. We only want to record and tabulate and evaluate one very very specific kind of information, that obtained by reading tiny electrical impulses acquired from outside the subject's body which reflect very limited bits of information about the electrical activity of the myocardium, dynamically. -- However, if you are going to pay for me and my upkeep, Dave, I recommend that we do an EKG, preferably very detailed. Maybe we can put a Holter monitor on him and record data for 24 hours. Some other machines can take care of the billing for us. Besides, everyone likes to hear about some fancy test which gave a negative result. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Fri Aug 7 00:42:21 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Fri Aug 7 00:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: women References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > "Mike Easter" > ROFL, that is easily the funniest thing you ever wrote. Well, then, good for me. :-) > Really, although somewhat odd and in appropriate, a woman should be able > to dress as she pleases without being branded as this or that. If she > plainly has no underwear on then ok, she's slutty. If she has nice legs > and wants to show them off... well good for her! I'm rather surprised at the nature of this whole thread. First of all, no one with the exception of Chas actually saw this woman who was apparently showing some leg in a short skirt. What *is* the big deal with that!? Maybe if - this - that - or - theother - person here saw her walking down the street in her neighborhood, they might hardly notice her or find her particularly 'sexually alluring' on the basis of a couple of legs. It seems to me that no one would be driven to lusting madly for her on the basis of being so configured. And yet, it seemed that so many respondents automatically jumped to the conclusion that she was the temptress of the year that no one would be able to resist, lusting and drooling and forsaking their wives or lovers for her on sight, and driving the women/wives of the neighborhood mad with envious hatred. And, yet, Chas didn't paint a very extensive word picture - of course. Why did everyone complete all of the missing pixels that he left out into such an extreme image and effects. Very baffling. Very baffling indeed. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 7 13:06:11 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Aug 7 13:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: bra none References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C5FD7CF088EAsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "Mike Easter" wrote in news:h3e1l5$57v$1 > @news.spamcop.net: > > >> >> Now I'll go look up some of this information so that when I come back >> I'll know some of the answers to my own questions. >> >> >> > > I assume by now you've found out the facts. Britain has private and public > healthcare. Elective surgery is just that - if you want it, you pay for > it. > BUT, if it went wrong you could go to the NHS and get free treatment, as > far as I'm aware anyway. AFAIK Elective surgery is postponable surgery, not necessarily frivolous surgery, and much of it would be covered, albeit, perhaps not in a desired timeframe, where private pay, or insurance, may come into the picture From MikeE at ster.invalid Fri Aug 7 13:23:14 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Fri Aug 7 13:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: bra none References: Message-ID: Bar0 wrote: > AFAIK Elective surgery is postponable surgery, not necessarily frivolous > surgery, and much of it would be covered, albeit, perhaps not in a > desired timeframe, where private pay, or insurance, may come into the > picture There are a great many surgical procedures which could be considered elective and safe; but not entirely without risk. And alternative treatment courses could be managed, also with significant risks and inconveniences including more lost work or lost schooldays or lost homemaker days of being incapacitated than would be the case if managed surgically instead of non-surgically or so-called 'conservatively'. Many obstetrical problems could be managed with or without a c-section. Many gynecologic problems could be managed with or without a hysterectromy. Many chronic tonsil problems could be managed with or without a tonsillectomy. Many chronic joint problems could be managed with or without arthroscopic or other joint procedures. Many chronic pain problems could be managed with or without spinal narcotic infusion pump installations. I wonder how all of those medical management decision trees should best be achieved. The doctor and the patient make the decision? The 3rd party payor makes the decision? A government bureaucratic employee makes the decision? Should a patient with plenty of money be able to have a higher level of care than one who isn't employed? That is, be allowed to choose a surgical procedure over a nonsurgical management. What about one who is employed at low wages? Or a homemaker/housewife? If there were universal insurance coverage, what should be the level of coverage? Plastic surgery? Of course - some plastic surgery is 'indicated' or 'imperative' while other plastic surgery is frivolous and ill-advised. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 7 13:58:41 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 7 14:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You have to be paranoid In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h37t8h$eld$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Not to get racist or anything but she's Indian...a property owning >> Indian. >> Most working-class Indians I've met are quite decent people, the >> rich >> ones are assholes though. And she's somewhat rich. Thus, she likes >> to flaunt it. >> > > ahh.. so tasteful fountains in the front yard? No...bright orange house, faux Greek / Roman pillars on her porch... From kenbrody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 7 14:00:02 2009 From: kenbrody at spamcop.net (Kenneth Brody) Date: Fri Aug 7 14:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > It wasn't me! It was Kenneth Brody ! > >> fios > > Ooh. How's that treating you? They've been sending out flyers in the > neighborhood trying to get people to sign up... Works great here. I now have business-class 20/5 MBPS throughput, plus unlimited domestic telephone, for less than my previous regular 4/2 MBPS cable internet and unlimited local / bring your own Vaseline long distance, even with taxes, fees, etc. And, my company pays for it, rather than I pay for it and get reimbursed eventually. I've had it for over 2 years, and I believe there has only been one or two outages that lasted long enough for me to even notice. Of course, it only became available after 5 or 6 years of "DSL will be available in your area soon". (So we went with satellite for a couple of years until Cablevision made cable Internet available.) -- Kenneth Brody From kenbrody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 7 14:20:39 2009 From: kenbrody at spamcop.net (Kenneth Brody) Date: Fri Aug 7 14:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > "Charles" wrote in message > news:Xns9C5EA0F73C302TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > : It wasn't me! It was Kenneth Brody ! > : > : > fios > : > : Ooh. How's that treating you? They've been sending out flyers in the > : neighborhood trying to get people to sign up... > > We have it and it works well for our needs. > > Two points: Record and document all your dealings with them (does the term > 'Lies like rugs' have any meaning?) What sort of problems did you have? The only pre-sale contact I had with them was "what is this $X package actually going to cost, _after_ all the fees/taxes/etc. are added in", and the price she calculated was pretty much the actual cost (it may have been off a couple of bucks). > Support sucks. Most don't have a clue, the rest don't seem to Give a sh|t Fortunately, I have only needed to call support once. However, my biorhythms must have been all at peak, the planets must have been in alignment, and the goat must have been properly sacrificed, because not only did I get a knowledgeable tech, but I apparently said the right thing to him to skip over most of the "are you sure it's plugged in" script, and got right to the "why, yes, there does appear to be a problem with our DHCP server, TYVM". -- Kenneth Brody From kenbrody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 7 14:22:21 2009 From: kenbrody at spamcop.net (Kenneth Brody) Date: Fri Aug 7 14:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > "Frog Prince" wrote in message > news:h58f5k$jco$1@news.spamcop.net... >> : Most hospitals have charity programs or just write off accounts where >> : the payer doesn't have assets, but they will hunt you down and sue you >> : if you have tangible assets. (I worked in the billing department of a >> : hospital) > > The dumbest thing I've heard hospitals accused of doing is charging full > price for patients without insurance. "Full Price" is about 2-3 times > what they know they will get back from insurance companies, but they > expect the indigent/uninsured to pay 3 times what they'd accept as > payment from insurance? That is so ludicrous it's not even funny. That way, they can "settle" for less, and take a writeoff for the difference. [...] -- Kenneth Brody From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 7 17:06:34 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 7 17:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me References: Message-ID: "Kenneth Brody" wrote in message news:h5hrac$jbs$1@news.spamcop.net... : Frog Prince wrote: : > "Charles" wrote in message : > news:Xns9C5EA0F73C302TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : > : It wasn't me! It was Kenneth Brody ! : > : : > : > fios : > : : > : Ooh. How's that treating you? They've been sending out flyers in the : > : neighborhood trying to get people to sign up... : > : > We have it and it works well for our needs. : > : > Two points: Record and document all your dealings with them (does the term : > 'Lies like rugs' have any meaning?) : : What sort of problems did you have? The only pre-sale contact I had with : them was "what is this $X package actually going to cost, _after_ all the : fees/taxes/etc. are added in", and the price she calculated was pretty much : the actual cost (it may have been off a couple of bucks). My bill had numerous errors, ALWAYS in VZN's favor. As the neighbors had given me a heads up I documented everything. Nothing lile being able to produce a recording of the agent maing all sorts of promisis and affermation to use as a responce 'we did say that'. : : > Support sucks. Most don't have a clue, the rest don't seem to Give a sh|t : : Fortunately, I have only needed to call support once. However, my : biorhythms must have been all at peak, the planets must have been in : alignment, and the goat must have been properly sacrificed, because not only : did I get a knowledgeable tech, but I apparently said the right thing to him : to skip over most of the "are you sure it's plugged in" script, and got : right to the "why, yes, there does appear to be a problem with our DHCP : server, TYVM". I've had a number of problems all without resolution by VZN (I manages to figure them out myself) biggest problem is VZN is using a spam filter system that no one is allowed to know the name of, who own/operates the service or who to contact about problems. One email from support instructed me to answer in line and reply with ALL text of the original email. VZN blocked the message being set to support as spam. Support could not white list either the address or the message. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 7 17:14:29 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 7 17:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: bra none References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5hntv$1ko$1@news.spamcop.net... : Bar0 wrote: : : > AFAIK Elective surgery is postponable surgery, not necessarily : frivolous surgery, and much of it would be covered, albeit, perhaps not in a : > desired timeframe, where private pay, or insurance, may come into the : > picture : : There are a great many surgical procedures which could be considered : elective and safe; but not entirely without risk. And alternative : treatment courses could be managed, also with significant risks and : inconveniences including more lost work or lost schooldays or lost : homemaker days of being incapacitated than would be the case if managed : surgically instead of non-surgically or so-called 'conservatively'. : : Many obstetrical problems could be managed with or without a c-section. : Many gynecologic problems could be managed with or without a : hysterectromy. Many chronic tonsil problems could be managed with or : without a tonsillectomy. Many chronic joint problems could be managed : with or without arthroscopic or other joint procedures. Many chronic : pain problems could be managed with or without spinal narcotic infusion : pump installations. : : I wonder how all of those medical management decision trees should best : be achieved. The doctor and the patient make the decision? The 3rd : party payor makes the decision? A government bureaucratic employee : makes the decision? : : Should a patient with plenty of money be able to have a higher level of : care than one who isn't employed? That is, be allowed to choose a : surgical procedure over a nonsurgical management. What about one who is : employed at low wages? Or a homemaker/housewife? If there were : universal insurance coverage, what should be the level of coverage? : Plastic surgery? Of course - some plastic surgery is 'indicated' or : 'imperative' while other plastic surgery is frivolous and ill-advised. Breast augmentation for a cancer patient who's had a mastectomy is one thing. Someone wanting a new set of boobs to join the Dallas Cowboy cheer leaders squad is quite another. Down grading services based on cost is risky as exampled by Keiser Permente's allowing only a cheaper treatment for the postal workers exposed to Anthrax. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 7 17:24:28 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Aug 7 17:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: bra none References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5hntv$1ko$1@news.spamcop.net... > Bar0 wrote: > >> AFAIK Elective surgery is postponable surgery, not necessarily > frivolous >> surgery, and much of it would be covered, albeit, perhaps not in a >> desired timeframe, where private pay, or insurance, may come into the >> picture .... > Should a patient with plenty of money be able to have a higher level of > care than one who isn't employed? That is, be allowed to choose a > surgical procedure over a nonsurgical management. What about one who is > employed at low wages? Or a homemaker/housewife? If there were > universal insurance coverage, what should be the level of coverage? > Plastic surgery? Of course - some plastic surgery is 'indicated' or > 'imperative' while other plastic surgery is frivolous and ill-advised. Should raises a philosophical question. As a practical matter a patient with money can command more resources if s/he wishes to have a costlier or timelier treatment. No health care inurance system with finite premiums can do for anyone whatever they want and perhaps even need for health care. In practice all kinds of "bureucrats" and medical personnel are involved in "rationing" insured healthcare all the time. In countries with so called socialized medicine the health care is ultimately rationed by what the premium payer and the taxpayer are willing to pay into the system, and what the providers want to receive for thier services. Gee, sounds like private insurers do the same thing. In the us these are entirely economic choices, in countries with "socialized" medicine they become political choices. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 7 17:29:01 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Aug 7 17:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: "Kenneth Brody" wrote in message news:h5hrdi$jbs$2@news.spamcop.net... > indigo wrote: >> >> "Frog Prince" wrote in message >> news:h58f5k$jco$1@news.spamcop.net... >>> : Most hospitals have charity programs or just write off accounts >>> where >>> : the payer doesn't have assets, but they will hunt you down and sue you >>> : if you have tangible assets. (I worked in the billing department of a >>> : hospital) >> >> The dumbest thing I've heard hospitals accused of doing is charging full >> price for patients without insurance. "Full Price" is about 2-3 times >> what they know they will get back from insurance companies, but they >> expect the indigent/uninsured to pay 3 times what they'd accept as >> payment from insurance? That is so ludicrous it's not even funny. > > That way, they can "settle" for less, and take a writeoff for the > difference. > Never thought of that. Gives one a bit of bargaining power perhaps. I guess it's just like those costs of stolen long distance calls back in the 60's and seventies... Well we like to charge $25.00 per minute for those calls and so many minutes stolen are a $X*25 loss. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 7 17:32:32 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 7 17:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C5FD973CE775sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : "Heidi" wrote in : news:h3rcmq$dku$1@news.spamcop.net: : : : >> Surprise, not available. It's Comcast, or satellite, and they like : >> it that way. : > I correct myself - apparently Fairpoint Fast internet is getting : > close, but the prices are hilarious. : > http://www.fairpoint.com/northern_ne/residential/internet/fast/resident : > ial_fiber_service_plans.jsp : > : > : > : : hold on.. they ADD $5 if you don't want VOIP?! wtf? It's to get you to give up copper. Once copper is gone you're screwed. Local telco tried it with one of my daughter's neighbors. Guy had a business installing short haul microwave links. He pulled a spare from the shop and bypassed the local telecom. Big stink with the county and the FCC. End result the guy could do what he wanted and to keep him from signing up the neighbors the local Telco gave him is copper back. From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 7 17:51:09 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 7 17:55:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You have to be paranoid In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > Sylvesterthekat wrote: >> Borgholio wrote in >> news:h37t8h$eld$1@news.spamcop.net: >> >>> Not to get racist or anything but she's Indian...a property owning >>> Indian. Most working-class Indians I've met are quite decent >>> people, the >>> rich ones are assholes though. And she's somewhat rich. Thus, she >>> likes >>> to flaunt it. >>> >> >> ahh.. so tasteful fountains in the front yard? > > No...bright orange house, faux Greek / Roman pillars on her porch... Oh and marble floors in the living room, granite floor in the kitchen... From MikeE at ster.invalid Fri Aug 7 17:59:49 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Fri Aug 7 18:00:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: bra none References: Message-ID: Bar0 wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> Should a patient with plenty of money be able to have a higher level of >> care than one who isn't employed? > No health care inurance system with finite premiums can do for anyone > whatever they want and perhaps even need for health care. > Gee, sounds like private insurers do the same thing. In the us these are > entirely economic choices, in countries with "socialized" medicine they > become political choices. The problem is that the US strongly believes in capitalism and market economics -- but that doesn't work properly for health care. It barely works properly within narrow niches. If a system like Kaiser, which does not pay any of its provider processes fee for service, presents a health care contract to an employer, that system works. Kaiser has 3 branches; the insurance branch, the hospital/facility branch, and the doctor provider branch. The insurance branch contracts with the two provider branches to provide them and contracts with employers to provide for them. The doctor branch hires doctors who work 'by the shift', not fee for service. The doctors make decisions based on doctor type thought processes, not fee type thought processes. However, a doctor that can't work 'efficiently' in the system isn't going to keep a job in the doctor branch. The employee patients are not high utilizers of services. They don't want to be missing work. They are young enough and healthy enough - if they weren't they wouldn't have a job. So Kaiser the insurance co's ability to project the cost of providing care isn't too bad/difficult - or bad/costly. Once upon a time, the state of CA went to Kaiser to see if they were interested in providing care for the Medi-Cal patients. First Kaiser said, "No way!" but the state insisted on getting a bid. Finally Kaiser gave them an astronomical bid - great multiples of what the costs were for an employer with so many employees. When the state wanted to know 'What's up with this monster bid?' Kaiser had to explain to them how vastly different the health care costs of these unemployed disabled sickly healthcare-abusing subset of the population was. Insuring the unemployed is not something a capitalistically motivated company would want to do. There are going to be some impossible problems to solve with this idea that anything you want to put together which involves capitalism and market economics is going to work for health care. In fact; to me the whole concept of health care being managed by insurance doesn't quite work right. I think that if you are going to take over management of health care, that it should be managed as if it were a public utility, not as an insurable risk. The key element of the legislature's ideas involves insurance, which insurance process is as b0rken as anything else in the system. It should not be the linchpin. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 7 18:20:41 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Aug 7 18:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: bra none References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5i84j$8i1$1@news.spamcop.net... > Bar0 wrote: >> "Mike Easter" > ..... > > When the state wanted to know 'What's up with this monster bid?' Kaiser > had to explain to them how vastly different the health care costs of > these unemployed disabled sickly healthcare-abusing subset of the > population was. Interesting, In Canada, I don;t think that those on UI (now EI) are any costlier to the plans than those working, except those on UI for medical reasons. But that would be like figuring costs only for the sick. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 7 21:25:58 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 7 21:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: Eariler today I spoke wth with a frail and gentle lady (Sunday school teacher and retired CPA with 40 years in the health care industry). Seems she attended one of the health care town hall meeting that has been targeted by aggressive protesters., While speaking (recognized by the moderator) she was hooted down. One (or more) of the protesters got a bit more then vocal in their efforts. End result this lady ended up on the floor. No apparent physical damage but she's mad a hell. Those that pushed her disappeared in the crowd and their IDs shielded by the rest of their 'team'. Watched the History Channel this evening and the actions she reports are akin to what was done by the Brown Shits (sic) in Germany and by the Bund (rhymes with goon) (German sympathizes) in the USA before WWII. If WeThePeople don't get a handle on this I expect someone will get seriously injured or worse. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 7 21:36:07 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 7 21:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: bra none References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5i84j$8i1$1@news.spamcop.net... : Bar0 wrote: : > "Mike Easter" : : >> Should a patient with plenty of money be able to have a higher level : of : >> care than one who isn't employed? : : > No health care inurance system with finite premiums can do for anyone : > whatever they want and perhaps even need for health care. : : > Gee, sounds like private insurers do the same thing. In the us these : are : > entirely economic choices, in countries with "socialized" medicine : they : > become political choices. : : The problem is that the US strongly believes in capitalism and market : economics -- but that doesn't work properly for health care. : : It barely works properly within narrow niches. If a system like Kaiser, : which does not pay any of its provider processes fee for service, : presents a health care contract to an employer, that system works. : : Kaiser has 3 branches; the insurance branch, the hospital/facility : branch, and the doctor provider branch. The insurance branch contracts : with the two provider branches to provide them and contracts with : employers to provide for them. The doctor branch hires doctors who work : 'by the shift', not fee for service. The doctors make decisions based : on doctor type thought processes, not fee type thought processes. : However, a doctor that can't work 'efficiently' in the system isn't : going to keep a job in the doctor branch. : : The employee patients are not high utilizers of services. They don't : want to be missing work. They are young enough and healthy enough - if : they weren't they wouldn't have a job. So Kaiser the insurance co's : ability to project the cost of providing care isn't too bad/difficult - : or bad/costly. : : Once upon a time, the state of CA went to Kaiser to see if they were : interested in providing care for the Medi-Cal patients. First Kaiser : said, "No way!" but the state insisted on getting a bid. Finally Kaiser : gave them an astronomical bid - great multiples of what the costs were : for an employer with so many employees. : : When the state wanted to know 'What's up with this monster bid?' Kaiser : had to explain to them how vastly different the health care costs of : these unemployed disabled sickly healthcare-abusing subset of the : population was. : : Insuring the unemployed is not something a capitalistically motivated : company would want to do. : : There are going to be some impossible problems to solve with this idea : that anything you want to put together which involves capitalism and : market economics is going to work for health care. : : In fact; to me the whole concept of health care being managed by : insurance doesn't quite work right. I think that if you are going to : take over management of health care, that it should be managed as if it : were a public utility, not as an insurable risk. : : The key element of the legislature's ideas involves insurance, which : insurance process is as b0rken as anything else in the system. It : should not be the linchpin. Insurance is not your typical capitalist bases system as they have game the law, the courts and the legislature to their advantages. Kaiser is one of the more aggressive abusers. BTW there is a forth element as key players are also stake holders in the companies that are providers to Kaiser. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 7 21:38:08 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 7 21:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You have to be paranoid References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h5i7k1$e4p$1@news.spamcop.net... : Borgholio wrote: : > Sylvesterthekat wrote: : >> Borgholio wrote in : >> news:h37t8h$eld$1@news.spamcop.net: : >> : >>> Not to get racist or anything but she's Indian...a property owning : >>> Indian. Most working-class Indians I've met are quite decent : >>> people, the : >>> rich ones are assholes though. And she's somewhat rich. Thus, she : >>> likes : >>> to flaunt it. : >>> : >> : >> ahh.. so tasteful fountains in the front yard? : > : > No...bright orange house, faux Greek / Roman pillars on her porch... : : Oh and marble floors in the living room, granite floor in the kitchen... Back ache city not to mention slip and fall. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 7 23:49:40 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Fri Aug 7 23:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: women References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C5FDAF33B983sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > Really, although somewhat odd and in appropriate, a woman should be able > to dress as she pleases without being branded as this or that. If she > plainly has no underwear on then ok, she's slutty. If she has nice legs > and wants to show them off... well good for her! Youuuuuuuuu, youuuuuuuuu youuuuuuuuur one of them, you slut........ ;D From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 8 00:58:44 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Aug 8 01:00:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: women References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:h5iskl$97v$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message : news:Xns9C5FDAF33B983sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : > Really, although somewhat odd and in appropriate, a woman should be able : > to dress as she pleases without being branded as this or that. If she : > plainly has no underwear on then ok, she's slutty. If she has nice legs : > and wants to show them off... well good for her! : : Youuuuuuuuu, youuuuuuuuu youuuuuuuuur one of them, you slut........ ;D Reminds me of the old joke. How do you tell when a woman is not wearing underwear? A: by the dandruff on her shoes. : : From user at domain.invalid Sat Aug 8 01:16:00 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Sat Aug 8 01:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Quirky love stories In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: ... > > Anyway, hey, In July was great. Wriscutters (a love story) wasn't bad. > There you go. But not a patch on Briscutters. No, no, seriously, Wristcutters is better than Baa baa blacksheep then? SWMBO didn't cry once during the latter. From bcs1 at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 08:38:58 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Sat Aug 8 08:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:h589mj$m61$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Well, I've made a decision not to make a decision, because I've just found > out that my landlords have put this property on the market so they can buy > into an assisted living place. So if they get their price, (too much for > what it is, everyone says unlikely but with my luck someone will come > along next week) after being here 20 years, I will have to move, which is > really bad in terms of "I can't afford to live anywhere around here", and > piss poor timing with my mother deteriorating by the day and having to > spend most of my free time with her. I don't think I'll need cable if > I'm living in my car... :( > Hi Heidi, I hate hearing that.. I certainly hope things work out well for you... *hugz* Bill From bcs1 at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 08:41:34 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Sat Aug 8 08:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Thank god for neighbors and small delicious favors. References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:h529gh$ksm$1@news.spamcop.net... >> LMAO, but doesn't that sound sooooooo good? > Does, and I have no tomatoes yet, so he's killin' me..... I do have beans > though, lots and LOTS of beans.... > haha... From bcs1 at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 08:55:53 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Sat Aug 8 09:00:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A picture is worth a thousand words References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h584g4$r1b$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Charles" wrote in message > news:Xns9C5CDBA1782B7TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > : No way it was me! It was Borgholio ! > : > : > So what are most people's opinions about the health care reform? > : > : Well... Wyden's version scares me the most, I guess. I scares me > 'cause > I > : have 100%, choose my own provider coverage. He proposes to take all of > : that away and given everyone something or other. The something or other > : can't possibly be as good as what I already have. > : > : The prez's bill seems outlandishly huge. > : > : The theory of universal healthcare works for me. Totally. I've been > the > : little guy (uninsured student with nasty accident) more times than I'd > like > : to admit. And yet, you know, that experience showed me something in and > of > : itself... It showed me that this universal healthcare thing already > : exists, to some extent. I had my (expensive enough) wounds treated. I > : didn't have to go into debt for the rest of my life or whatever. > > You were very lucky to get treatment. As to medical debt it goes away > after 4 years and off the full record after 7 but for far too many > coverage > is too limited and often denied until it's too late. > > : But, yeah. That's annecdotal evidence. I guess I don't have any other > on > : the subject. It's my annecdote or the one they publish in the paper > about > : some guy's life being ruined. Well, shucks. > : > : I guess that it seems to me like they're trying to put a MA-type system > in > : place - force employers to insure workers. Well, golly, it doesn't take > a > : Nobel winner in economics to know that this will have a deleterious > effect > : on business/the economy. > : > : It's a tough call. Doing away with the insurance companies altogether > and > : going to a totally socialixed system seems the best way to do things. > But, > : well, those companies have a lot of pull (bling) in Congress so that > will > : never happen. So, basically, you're screwed. > > > > Much of the problem with insurance companies could be addressed by > removing > their anti trust status and doing away with their ERISA exemption to > accountability. > > > I agree with you two, I don't like having a freedom taken away from me, the thing is bloated beyond and sensible level, it places burdens on business and on the taxpayer even if you have your own coverage too, I do think that the insurance companies should be held accountable... From bcs1 at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 11:06:30 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Sat Aug 8 11:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Hubble captures afer-effects of meteor collision with Jupiter References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h4o97s$nru$1@news.spamcop.net... > Amazing how often amateur astrometers discover things first......this > image is from the newest instrument installed on HST, the one I spent > almost 10 years working on before lyme disease felled me prior to the > final testing/checkouts and post launch calibration activities. > > http://hubblesite.org/newscenter/archive/releases/2009/23/image/a/ Nice pic though... and you still had a part in making it happen :) From user at domain.invalid Sat Aug 8 11:17:57 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Sat Aug 8 11:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Quirky love stories In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: ... > > Um. What's baa baa blacksheep? That was that Kiwi (New Zealand) horror/spoof about the mutant carnivorous sheep strewing an excess of corpses and body parts about the greensward that you utterly loathed and for which you saw absolutely no point or justification other than to gross-out any reasonable human being. Though I believe it was popular with sheep. Anyway, thanks for the recommendation on Wristcutters. I was mostly having a little play with the missing "t" in your op which I'm sure you "got" but feel obligated to mention should you have not. From joegill at removethis Sat Aug 8 14:58:31 2009 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Sat Aug 8 15:00:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h5ik6v$jhk$1@news.spamcop.net... > Eariler today I spoke wth with a frail and gentle lady (Sunday school > teacher and retired CPA with 40 years in the health care industry). > > Seems she attended one of the health care town hall meeting that has been > targeted by aggressive protesters., > > While speaking (recognized by the moderator) she was hooted down. One (or > more) of the protesters got a bit more then vocal in their efforts. > > End result this lady ended up on the floor. No apparent physical damage > but > she's mad a hell. > > Those that pushed her disappeared in the crowd and their IDs shielded by > the > rest of their 'team'. > > Watched the History Channel this evening and the actions she reports are > akin to what was done by the Brown Shits (sic) in Germany and by the Bund > (rhymes with goon) (German sympathizes) in the USA before WWII. > > If WeThePeople don't get a handle on this I expect someone will get > seriously injured or worse. > A LOT of people are really fried by the mis-information being doled out of Washington. It's affecting them, their pocket books and the next generation! This can get very political and it is not really my point. What really openned my eyes is when the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) and the OMB (Office of management and Budget) issued ugly reports on the financing of this debacle. BOTH of these offices are and have been NON-Political.. and have been for years... Suddenly when they rain on the parade, they are called liars by the administration! Strange.... OK maybe where you are, there is not the anger and frustration over the health care, but in many parts of the country there IS. And the outrage is a blend of people of both sides of the aisle. Washington NEEDS to feel the heat of the people back home. You brought up the subject of "Brown Shits (sic) in Germany and by the Bund (rhymes with goon) (German sympathizes) in the USA before WWII" Well commrade, 'da furher' in Washington want us to spy on our fellow citizens and report to him 'fishy' information @ flag@whitehouse.gov . Even the ALCU says the White House blog is "bad idea that could send a troublesome message." From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 8 16:38:10 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Aug 8 16:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Joe Gill" < : > Earlier today I spoke wth with a frail and gentle lady (Sunday school : > teacher and retired CPA with 40 years in the health care industry). : > : > Seems she attended one of the health care town hall meeting that has been : > targeted by aggressive protesters., : > : > While speaking (recognized by the moderator) she was hooted down. One (or : > more) of the protesters got a bit more then vocal in their efforts. : > : > End result this lady ended up on the floor. No apparent physical damage : > but : > she's mad a hell. : > : > Those that pushed her disappeared in the crowd and their IDs shielded by : > the : > rest of their 'team'. : > : > Watched the History Channel this evening and the actions she reports are : > akin to what was done by the Brown Shits (sic) in Germany and by the Bund : > (rhymes with goon) (German sympathizes) in the USA before WWII. : > : > If WeThePeople don't get a handle on this I expect someone will get : > seriously injured or worse. : > : : A LOT of people are really fried by the mis-information being doled out of : Washington. It's affecting them, their pocket books and the next generation! : : This can get very political and it is not really my point. What really : opened my eyes is when the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) and the OMB : (Office of management and Budget) issued ugly reports on the financing of : this debacle. BOTH of these offices are and have been NON-Political.. and : have been for years... Suddenly when they rain on the parade, they are : called liars by the administration! : Strange.... : : OK maybe where you are, there is not the anger and frustration over the : health care, but in many parts of the country there IS. And the outrage is a : blend of people of both sides of the aisle. : : Washington NEEDS to feel the heat of the people back home. : : You brought up the subject of "Brown Shits (sic) in Germany and by the Bund : (rhymes with goon) (German sympathizes) in the USA before WWII" : Well comrade, 'da furher' in Washington want us to spy on our fellow : citizens and report to him 'fishy' information @ flag@whitehouse.gov . Even : the ALCU says the White House blog is "bad idea that could send a : troublesome message." My direct concern is with what I see happening in the town hall environment. If discussion is stopped there, by either side, WeThePeople lose and lose big time. The woman I mentioned had decades of direct experience inside the insurance and medical industry both professionally as a CPA and in management. I expect what she would have to say would hammer both sides of the issue but in the act of shouting down comment and then physically putting a 70+ (I'm guessing on her age she may well be in her 80s as her husband was a tail gunner on a B17 over Germany) frail woman on the ground to stop her from commenting bodes badly for the USA. A town hall meeting is unique in that that venue is specifically intended for the citizen discussion of the issues. It's the best place and perhaps the last place that WeThePeople will have to address the concerns and ID the false data and propaganda. I live in a mixed senior community. Folk there get together one or twice a week to discuss (ok argue about) anything and everything. These folk are on both sides of the political landscape. They all have decades of real world experience. A quick inventory from memory. A surgeon, a GP, RN with a MBA, a few lawyers some practiced others who stayed in business. Engineers, SAHM (stay at home moms), entrepreneurs, labors. Pretty much a cross section of the USA. Many of these folk lived thought WWII, the McCarthy era and all that followed. They have a vested interest in what's going on and diverse points of view as well. Many are now physically afraid show up to voice their views on any subject. I, for one, would not take my grand kids to such a gathering even though they would learn what America is not suppose to be about as I'd be fearful of their safety. Is that the America we are to view as acceptable? I fully expect that, short of some community sense entering the neo-con psyche there will be violence and possible some deaths as a result of what's happening. One element that stands out to me and more so to my wife (she's a professional graphic designer) is that some of the signage used have all the elements of professional design that are typically use to make a poster look spontaneous. Add to that my observations that some of the spontaneous signs appear in multiple locations on the same day. I can't tell from the photos how these were produced but I would hazard a good guess that a bit of close inspection would show more than a few were done by the same artist. The America I grew up was built on the premise that you have the right to voice your opinion, I, OTOH, am not required to listen to what you say but no one has the right to stop you from voicing your opinion. This is especially so in a public forum such as a town hall meeting. Recall the pro Germany Bund of the late 30's and the rhetoric of McCarthyism in the 50's, do you think Limbaugh and the rest are any different in the hate they spread? Claims that 'they do it or they did it' (who ever they might be) is no justification to continue the abuse. As a teen I watched as life long friends were washed to the curb (and worse) by fire hoses because some 'theys' were told by the other 'theys' that THOSE 'theys' could not be allowed ... Our health care system is broken an observation I've come to over 40+ years as an entrepreneur. We're not unlike a group of people who have taken refuge from an angry flood on a sand bar, staying were we are is not a viable option. Blocking meaningful discussion of the issues will not somehow stop the sandbar from washing away. Whatever the outcome we, all will have to live with the result. What's the wisdom of allowing circumstances and vested interest set the direction? From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 16:59:31 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Steven Underwood) Date: Sat Aug 8 17:00:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C60BA0D145A6sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > > Anyone who thinks about it won't get VOIP as their only telephone > option. It relies on the power being on and it doesn't sound too great. > If you live somewhere, as I do, that may require you to have a working > land line to survive (ie in a quake situation) there's no way in hell > I'm giving that up! > I thought about it and use VOIP as my only home telephone. I have a UPS on my entire cable modem/VOIP router/Wireless router more to condition the power but I have no problem in a power outage. I also have a spare cordless phone plugged into that UPS, since the main phones in the house are out if I lose power. As for the sound, I have never had anyone notice a difference, and I have 5MB download/0.5MB upload (last tested to a local test at 4.5MB/0.48MB). We also each have cell phones but in the house, we use the VOIP. I will be transferring from AT&T CallVantage to Vonage shortly because CallVantage is closing down in September. I checked out the local cable offering, but it did not offer a FindMe (AT&T) or SimulRing (Vonage) service which we use because our school system will only accept one number for the reverse 911 system. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 17:19:38 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 8 17:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Bill" wrote in message news:h5jrl2$loc$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Heidi" wrote in message > news:h589mj$m61$1@news.spamcop.net... >> > >> Well, I've made a decision not to make a decision, because I've just >> found out that my landlords have put this property on the market so they >> can buy into an assisted living place. So if they get their price, (too >> much for what it is, everyone says unlikely but with my luck someone will >> come along next week) after being here 20 years, I will have to move, >> which is really bad in terms of "I can't afford to live anywhere around >> here", and piss poor timing with my mother deteriorating by the day and >> having to spend most of my free time with her. I don't think I'll need >> cable if I'm living in my car... :( >> > > Hi Heidi, > I hate hearing that.. I certainly hope things work out well for you... > Damn, that sucks Hiedi! I haven't been following .social very closely, missed this post. I assume moving in with Mum would be a no go? From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 17:47:00 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Sat Aug 8 17:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h5knnc$a4s$1@news.spamcop.net... > "Joe Gill" < ... > I fully expect that, short of some community sense entering the neo-con > psyche there will be violence and possible some deaths as a result of > what's > happening. It's not neo-cons per se, follow the money. Most of the protest is against straw men. Where has Congress proposed euthanasia for the elderly? Where has Congress proposed suicide counseling for the elderly? Where has Congress proposed denying anyones right to see the doctor they want and can afford? Where has Congress proposed taking over medical practices (socialized medicine)? Where has Congress denying medical treatment to those who can pay? From MikeE at ster.invalid Sat Aug 8 18:48:25 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sat Aug 8 18:50:06 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: bar0 wrote: > Where has Congress proposed Unfortunately you/I/we don't know exactly *what* congress has proposed since none of us have actually read this stuff. We have turned that process over to others to read and interpret for us. Normally I never listen to what the media sez/interprets about anything important; I can always get my hands on the original. Sometimes that amounts to my reading hundreds of pages of .pdf dug up from somewhere. Sometimes only scores of pages. I confess that I have not put my hands on this original, nor do I look forward to it. Nor do I suppose have the numerous pundits for and against what is being 'proposed' who are talking to us and leading us around and influencing us about it. Now (again) we really have the situation where the politicalization of everything - the dominance of the two-party system in which the content of what is being 'said' -- such as in the media -- is either according to the Democrats or according to the Republicans and the media that parrots that party's perspective on the news and the events and the 'meaning' of this impending legislation. The media pretends to give a balanced view, but it really doesn't. And the viewers and listeners, who would have to get their 'unbiased' opinion from the media, would have to listen to both the Republican media and the Democrat media. But they don't. Those who are dem oriented listed to dem media and those who are rep oriented listed to rep media and each of them completely reject the media output of the opposing party's media output. In reality, a lot of the public is more independent than party oriented, but the power is in the hands of the political parties. Our leadership is in the hands of the political parties. Obama is a democrat; he isn't a republican. What Obama sez about what he wants for the health care situation isn't what is in the congress. Congress is making and passing the legislation and Obama is going to be signing it. Obama isn't writing it. Obama isn't in control of this process. Obama is talking to the people about what he thinks would make a good healthcare system. What does that have to do with anything about this process? -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 8 20:44:41 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Aug 8 20:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5kvbo$sq5$1@news.spamcop.net... : bar0 wrote: : : > Where has Congress proposed : : Unfortunately you/I/we don't know exactly *what* congress has proposed : since none of us have actually read this stuff. Me Me (well most of it anyway and that the early stuff) I'll get back to it when my eyes uncross. Most of the protest is against straw men. }Where has Congress proposed euthanasia for the elderly? The staw men on this is part and parcle of the following. }Where has Congress proposed suicide counseling for the elderly? What has been proposed is an expansion of what Hospice has been doing for decades. Which is a frank and detailed discussion of the patients personal circumstance and what they need to do to protect their rights and wishes. I can cite many many postitive outcomes of this process and few horror stories where the family worked to counter those directives. }Where has Congress proposed denying anyones right to see the doctor they want and can afford? Its a talking point on the part of some in Congress, mostly Republicans and sadly on the part of Republicans that are physican and should know better. Where has Congress proposed taking over medical practices (socialized medicine)? There is discussion of that process as it is practiced by the private insurance industry. It is also part of what Medicare/Medicade does now. Where has Congress denying medical treatment to those who can pay? : We have turned that process over to others to read and interpret for us. That's one of my concerns about the shout down process being followed by those that would block public debate. : Normally I never listen to what the media sez/interprets about anything : important; I can always get my hands on the original. Sometimes that : amounts to my reading hundreds of pages of .pdf dug up from somewhere. : Sometimes only scores of pages. : : I confess that I have not put my hands on this original, nor do I look : forward to it. Nor do I suppose have the numerous pundits for and : against what is being 'proposed' who are talking to us and leading us : around and influencing us about it. : : Now (again) we really have the situation where the politicalization of : everything - the dominance of the two-party system in which the content : of what is being 'said' -- such as in the media -- is either according : to the Democrats or according to the Republicans and the media that : parrots that party's perspective on the news and the events and the : 'meaning' of this impending legislation. : : The media pretends to give a balanced view, but it really doesn't. And : the viewers and listeners, who would have to get their 'unbiased' : opinion from the media, would have to listen to both the Republican : media and the Democrat media. But they don't. : : Those who are dem oriented listed to dem media and those who are rep : oriented listed to rep media and each of them completely reject the : media output of the opposing party's media output. : : In reality, a lot of the public is more independent than party oriented, : but the power is in the hands of the political parties. Our leadership : is in the hands of the political parties. Obama is a democrat; he : isn't a republican. What Obama sez about what he wants for the health : care situation isn't what is in the congress. Congress is making and : passing the legislation and Obama is going to be signing it. Obama : isn't writing it. Obama isn't in control of this process. : : Obama is talking to the people about what he thinks would make a good : healthcare system. What does that have to do with anything about this : process? : I'm seeing may parallels in this process as what was done and by who with regard to the Part D drug plan. And I've no doubt that everyone involved is gaming the numbers in order to get their ducks in a row to be top on the list. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 20:46:39 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Sat Aug 8 20:50:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5kvbo$sq5$1@news.spamcop.net... > bar0 wrote: ... > Those who are dem oriented listed to dem media and those who are rep > oriented listed to rep media and each of them completely reject the > media output of the opposing party's media output. > > In reality, a lot of the public is more independent than party oriented, > but the power is in the hands of the political parties. Our leadership > is in the hands of the political parties. Obama is a democrat; he > isn't a republican. What Obama sez about what he wants for the health > care situation isn't what is in the congress. Congress is making and > passing the legislation and Obama is going to be signing it. Obama > isn't writing it. Obama isn't in control of this process. > > Obama is talking to the people about what he thinks would make a good > healthcare system. What does that have to do with anything about this > process? I don't hjave a problem with either Democrat, or Republican media, I do have a problem with Murdoch Media. Perhaps it should be called Morlock Media. Most Mainstream (Fox is not mainstream, although it has a big audience) media seems to tend to Democratic but not all are, But they are not propaganda machines. Not like Murdochs media. Unfortunately mainstream media is failing us, they're not reading congressional bills or proposals, they're not breaking them down into digestible pieces so we can talk intelligently about them. And now, should anyone try, the birthers, and the don't wanna be incarcerated inna hospice groups make sure no one can hear. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 23:16:48 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 8 23:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's just me In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5agah$5q9$1@news.spamcop.net... > They told me the other day (in response to my thoughtless remark about > how at least they didn't spend any serious money remodeling - oops) that > they spent well over a hundred grand touching things up. > I'm not surprised -- a typical kitchen upgrade can cost between $20-$30k all by itself. Several years ago I was looking into bumping out JUST me my main bedroom by 4-6 feet and adding a new master bath, changing my current tiny master bath into the originally designed walk in closet. I priced out all of the components/fixtures I wanted, and the contractor wanted $80K just to add about 100 sq ft of floor space to my master bedroom! He said extending the plumbing for the re-located master bath beyond the foundation was a huge part of the gigantic cost -- $800/sq ft! From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 23:25:43 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 8 23:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: women In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C5FDAF33B983sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "Mike Easter" wrote in news:h4r3r4$61m$1 >> >> In the future she should wear proper Victorian style dress and >> shoes/boots and definitely not expose her ankles. The face and eyes > are >> still OK here. >> >> >> > > ROFL, that is easily the funniest thing you ever wrote. Funny, when I read it I immediately thought of a burka, and Islamic extremists that insist that no piece of female flesh be exposed the any male... From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 8 23:37:02 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 8 23:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hey indi... how bout schumi? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C5FDFF90E968sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... >i was horribly reminded of senna's accident when i saw massa's crash (talk > about freak luck being hit by that spring!). but now it appears he's going > to be fine, i'm looking forward to seeing how schumi does in the ferrari, > could be verrrrry interrrresting. I caught a replay of the view from Massa's car cam showing the spring flying straight into his head....ugh.....I'm sure Schumacher will do fine, probably beat the pants off of Kimi. When's the next race anyway? And didn't someone get battered with a huge fine because a tire became loose and fell of the car in the last race? What happened to the wheel tethers? From me at privacy.net Sun Aug 9 15:38:03 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sun Aug 9 15:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Charles" : : > Earlier today I spoke with a frail and gentle lady : : They glazed over it on NPR today. 15 seconds - "Democrats are trying to : hold townhalls on healthcare. x, y and z were among those shouted down by : opponents." x, y and z all being our duly elected representatives. : My personal take (more a fear) is that the process for town hall meetings is quickly getting out of control. Many of my acquaintance are avoiding any involvement with the process out of fear of their physical safety. Those I know with conservative and liberal leanings are jointly concerned that there will be a major incident with the possibility if not likely hood of someone being killed. The word from the underground (neocon? I don't know if that's an accurate tag any more) is 'we need to kill some of those (union) thugs' The one glimmer of positives I see is that many of the people I know personally be they of my age group or that of my kids is that people are becoming more independent in their review of politics. Still have leanings toward the democrats or republican party but asking a lot of pointed questions and not settling for feel good PR spin. More and more are taking the time to read what's on the table and follow up. The question comes will they be enough? will their efforts be noticed? their input heeded? From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Aug 9 17:07:56 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Sun Aug 9 17:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h5n8j2$3vv$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Charles" > : > : > Earlier today I spoke with a frail and gentle lady > : > : They glazed over it on NPR today. 15 seconds - "Democrats are trying to > : hold townhalls on healthcare. x, y and z were among those shouted down > by > : opponents." x, y and z all being our duly elected representatives. > : > > My personal take (more a fear) is that the process for town hall meetings > is > quickly getting out of control. Many of my acquaintance are avoiding any > involvement with the process out of fear of their physical safety. It's really not that different from taking on the Colombian or Mexican Cartels. The latter are one of the fruits of enhanced border security after 911. There's a lot of money involved, more than in the illegal drug trade. From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 10 02:23:24 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 10 02:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You have to be paranoid In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in news:h5i7k1$e4p$1 > @news.spamcop.net: > > >> Oh and marble floors in the living room, granite floor in the kitchen... >> > > granite FLOOR? isn't that rather dangerous? slip and fall here i come! Well granite floors often have a bit of scoring in the surface to rough them up. But yeah it's not what I would choose for a kitchen. From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 10 17:40:38 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 10 17:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Proposed Ayatollah System for USA References: Message-ID: Some claim support for a "faith-based" system of government: http://theskunk.org/2009/06/republicans-propose-ayatollah-system-for-u-s I wonder if this is a predecessor to a 'faith based healing' protocol? From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 10 18:26:15 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Mon Aug 10 18:30:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Proposed Ayatollah System for USA References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h5q4jb$n0b$1@news.spamcop.net... > Some claim support for a "faith-based" system of government: > > http://theskunk.org/2009/06/republicans-propose-ayatollah-system-for-u-s > > I wonder if this is a predecessor to a 'faith based healing' protocol? > > Nope, Just the Perry Platform, From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 11 02:14:50 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 11 02:15:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Cash for clunkers Message-ID: Somehow, something seems wrong about subsidies and wastefulness. That seems like the kind of thing that leads to unintended consequences. How can it be a good thing, a good lesson, a good 'message' - if you are into messages - to be destroying perfectly good automobiles by seizing their engines? Something just seems unhealthy or wrong or against some ethic about that. Billions for destroying operational cars. It is a strange subsidy. We used to cry about a few millions for some kind of agricultural subsidies. Now that is all chickenfeed, so to speak. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From joegill at removethis Mon Aug 10 21:59:36 2009 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Tue Aug 11 02:40:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Steven Underwood" wrote in message news:h5kovi$gq4$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message > news:Xns9C60BA0D145A6sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... >> >> Anyone who thinks about it won't get VOIP as their only telephone >> option. It relies on the power being on and it doesn't sound too great. >> If you live somewhere, as I do, that may require you to have a working >> land line to survive (ie in a quake situation) there's no way in hell >> I'm giving that up! >> > I thought about it and use VOIP as my only home telephone. I have a UPS > on my entire cable modem/VOIP router/Wireless router more to condition the > power but I have no problem in a power outage. I also have a spare > cordless phone plugged into that UPS, since the main phones in the house > are out if I lose power. What about the other 'points' in the cable system from your home/business to the point that the cable co. integrates with the phone system? I thought many of the neighborhood units in the cable system, relied on power, or you service goes down. From fiyntyd02 at sneakemail.com Tue Aug 11 07:15:12 2009 From: fiyntyd02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K. Mean) Date: Tue Aug 11 07:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles said the following on 11/08/09 20:01: > No way it was me! It was "Mike Easter"! > >> Somehow, something seems wrong about subsidies and wastefulness. > > What bugs me about this one is claiming that it's to help the env't and > then giving the monies to people buying cars that get 22 mpg. Obviously > they set the bar so low to benefit 'merican car manufacturers 'cause that's > nothing like an improvement. From afar, I didn't really hear enough to make a valid judgement about it, but mostly it smacked of channelling money to Detroit and just trying to get people buy big things, any things. It seems like that sort of money could have been used in a much more sensible way. Where are the subsidies to buy everybody a bike? I imagine that Amtrak could use some more money to finally build some high speed lines. Or nice things like solar panels, water tanks, home insulation, LPG conversions, and stuff like that. The Australian government has been handing out rebates for things like that for a while. Throw a few billion dollars at that, could be a good way to become more energy independent. From jwjr at poSPAMSUCKSbox.com Tue Aug 11 07:50:54 2009 From: jwjr at poSPAMSUCKSbox.com (J. Weaver Jr.) Date: Tue Aug 11 07:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mike Easter wrote: > How can it be a good thing, a good lesson, a good 'message' - if you are > into messages - to be destroying perfectly good automobiles by seizing > their engines? Something just seems unhealthy or wrong or against some > ethic about that. ...except they're not "perfectly good". Oh, they _run_, but they're gas guzzlers, and can only be traded for cars that show a certain level of MPG improvement. You're replacing older, less efficient, less _safe_ vehicles, and creating a job or two (and some actual consumer activity) in the process. Not a bad thing. -JW From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 11 08:45:46 2009 From: me at privacy.net (magus kent) Date: Tue Aug 11 08:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in news:h5r28l$2nk$1@news.spamcop.net: > Somehow, something seems wrong about subsidies and wastefulness. That > seems like the kind of thing that leads to unintended consequences. > > How can it be a good thing, a good lesson, a good 'message' - if you > are into messages - to be destroying perfectly good automobiles by > seizing their engines? Something just seems unhealthy or wrong or > against some ethic about that. > > Billions for destroying operational cars. It is a strange subsidy. > We used to cry about a few millions for some kind of agricultural > subsidies. Now that is all chickenfeed, so to speak. > > The cars that I've seen being scrapped looked better than the '91 Escort (187K miles, 30 MPG around town) that I finally had to let go because of terminal rust. I had read that the only parts that had to be scrapped (and not re-used) were the engines and drivetrains. Law might have gotten changed along the way. If you buy a new car and the government kicks in $4500.00, then the various governments get a healthy share of that back. Six percent state sales tax on a 20K car would be $1200.00 back into the (hurting) state coffers. The salesman gets to pay income tax on his cut, the dealer also. Driver of the transport pays income tax, the worker at the manufacturer pays income tax, the corporation pays tax. The companies making sub-assemblies like engines, gas tanks, etc pay income tax. The shipping companies that move this stuff keep their people working. And lets not forget those nice people at the insurance company and banks! Income tax is both Federal and State, possibly local. So how much does each taxing-levying entity make on the deal? I dunno but I'm sure it ain't chicken feed. Plus if we are keeping people employed we are not paying them unemployment, another cost-saving measure to the government. And the above mentioned people get to spend their paychecks unless they are already rich then they just worry about the stock market, thus keeping other people employed. Beats the hell out of bailing-out finacial institutions that got us in this mess in the first place! From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 11 10:48:55 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Steven Underwood) Date: Tue Aug 11 10:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C644B5AA8CEsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "Joe Gill" wrote in > news:h5r3lh$ca2$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> What about the other 'points' in the cable system from your >> home/business to the point that the cable co. integrates with the >> phone system? I thought many of the neighborhood units in the cable >> system, relied on power, or you service goes down. >> >> > > Unfortunately, UPS's don't last all that long, certainly not several days. > If you have your own generator then fine but as Joe points out, an outage > could cause problems further down the line. Although that could just as > easily affect the telco too I guess, in a severe situation like a big > quake, tornado or hurricane. I have lived in my current house for the last 13+ years. Of those 13 years, we have had VOIP for about 5 years now. We have not have many power outages (my neighborhood is all underground services) but we have had a few lasting an hour or 2 when most of the town was out and I have never lost internet access or VOIP phone service. I have a fairly large UPS, however, 1200VA with only a small load of the cable modem, VOIP router, wireless router, and cordless phone. I suppose it is possible that eventually, it would have a problem, but as you mention, that is likely to affect the telco's as well. I also have cell phones if needed, which many people I know have gone to exclusively. From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Aug 11 13:31:09 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Aug 11 13:35:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > > the cell networks get overloaded far sooner than the land lines when > something happens. even the moderate quakes that i've gone through, the > cell networks were not much use except for sending texts which get thru > eventually i'm told. i'm not concerned about the occasional small outage > though, it's when things go on for days and you're left with no phone > service at all if you're relying on electricity. i have an ups for the > modem and router so if we're off for a few hours i could get online if > need be! > Yeah it's actually recommended that, in an emergency, you use your cell phone to text loved ones instead of call...takes up far less of the circuit that way and it's much more likely to get through. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 11 14:37:08 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Tue Aug 11 14:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C644C1D7F25Fsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "Mr K. Mean" wrote in > news:h5rjs6$mc$1@news.spamcop.net: > > > >I imagine that Amtrak could >> use some more money to finally build some high speed lines. >> >> Or nice things like solar panels, water tanks, home insulation, LPG >> conversions, and stuff like that. The Australian government has been >> handing out rebates for things like that for a while. Throw a few >> billion dollars at that, could be a good way to become more energy >> independent. >> > > Exactly. LA seriously needs to build a rail system. That'd save so much > gas > (and related pollution) and time but oh no, it's too expensive. What? the Interurban again? that's what was responsible for the LA sprawl. (Ok I'm gonna duck now) From kenbrody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 11 14:43:37 2009 From: kenbrody at spamcop.net (Kenneth Brody) Date: Tue Aug 11 14:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Renting sucks... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: David Dean wrote: > My landlady was going to sell the condo I'm living in last October. > (At the time, I thought she was trying to scare me into buying it) Well, > I wasn't going to be able to make the payments for what she was asking, > so I started to look for another place. We found one and they called to > check my references. At which point the landlady panicked about losing > us before she sold the house, so we talked her into a two year lease. > (So that I could continue saving to buy a house) > Well it turns out she must have wanted to sell because she was having > trouble paying the mortgage. We got some mail for her here that looked > suspiciously like pre-foreclosure notices. I dropped them off for her > and started to check the legal notices in the local paper to see if a > foreclosure was imminent. She called me yesterday to tell me that she > was going to have to sell the house at a short sale to satisfy the bank > and avoid foreclosure. > Anyone know if the lease is still binding on the new owner? How long > I'll have? or what my options might be? I still don't think I can afford > the mortgage for what she's asking. IANAL, but... I would suspect that if she were to sell the house, the contract would be binding on the purchaser. However, if it were to go to foreclosure, I would suspect the contract would be null and void. Of course, I would highly recommend you speak to someone who can say "IAAL". Finally, if she (and the bank) are talking short sale, you can always make a lowball offer that you can afford. -- Kenneth Brody From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Aug 11 15:02:55 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Aug 11 15:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Renting sucks... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Kenneth Brody wrote: > David Dean wrote: >> My landlady was going to sell the condo I'm living in last October. >> (At the time, I thought she was trying to scare me into buying it) >> Well, I wasn't going to be able to make the payments for what she was >> asking, so I started to look for another place. We found one and they >> called to check my references. At which point the landlady panicked >> about losing us before she sold the house, so we talked her into a two >> year lease. (So that I could continue saving to buy a house) >> Well it turns out she must have wanted to sell because she was >> having trouble paying the mortgage. We got some mail for her here that >> looked suspiciously like pre-foreclosure notices. I dropped them off >> for her and started to check the legal notices in the local paper to >> see if a foreclosure was imminent. She called me yesterday to tell me >> that she was going to have to sell the house at a short sale to >> satisfy the bank and avoid foreclosure. >> Anyone know if the lease is still binding on the new owner? How >> long I'll have? or what my options might be? I still don't think I can >> afford the mortgage for what she's asking. > > IANAL, but... > > I would suspect that if she were to sell the house, the contract would > be binding on the purchaser. However, if it were to go to foreclosure, > I would suspect the contract would be null and void. > > Of course, I would highly recommend you speak to someone who can say > "IAAL". > > Finally, if she (and the bank) are talking short sale, you can always > make a lowball offer that you can afford. > I am also not a lawyer, but I would think that if the house forecloses, that means the bank owns it, yes? Thus the contract would be binding between you and the bank as it would with any private owner. From dfmanno at mail.com Tue Aug 11 15:30:56 2009 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Tue Aug 11 15:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: In article , "Frog Prince" wrote: > Eariler today I spoke wth with a frail and gentle lady (Sunday school > teacher and retired CPA with 40 years in the health care industry). > > Seems she attended one of the health care town hall meeting that has been > targeted by aggressive protesters., > > While speaking (recognized by the moderator) she was hooted down. One (or > more) of the protesters got a bit more then vocal in their efforts. > > End result this lady ended up on the floor. No apparent physical damage but > she's mad a hell. > > Those that pushed her disappeared in the crowd and their IDs shielded by the > rest of their 'team'. > > Watched the History Channel this evening and the actions she reports are > akin to what was done by the Brown Shits (sic) in Germany and by the Bund > (rhymes with goon) (German sympathizes) in the USA before WWII. > > If WeThePeople don't get a handle on this I expect someone will get > seriously injured or worse. The usual wingnut suspects are urging the "protesters" to carry weapons to the meetings, and to assault people who speak in favor of Obama's plan. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com "Faith is a cop-out. If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits." (Dan Barker) From dfmanno at mail.com Tue Aug 11 15:41:04 2009 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Tue Aug 11 15:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: In article , "Joe Gill" wrote: > Well commrade, 'da furher' in Washington want us to spy on our fellow > citizens and report to him 'fishy' information @ flag@whitehouse.gov That's an outright lie. The request was to forward misinformation in ads and the media to the White House so that it could be countered with accurate information. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com "Faith is a cop-out. If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits." (Dan Barker) From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 11 15:48:22 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Tue Aug 11 15:50:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "D.F. Manno" wrote in message news:dfmanno-C696DA.15305611082009@news.cesmail.net... > In article , > "Frog Prince" wrote: > > The usual wingnut suspects are urging the "protesters" to carry weapons > to the meetings, and to assault people who speak in favor of Obama's > plan. Defense against their right to choose their own doctors. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 11 15:51:33 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Tue Aug 11 15:55:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Renting sucks... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h5sf97$j8s$1@news.spamcop.net... > Kenneth Brody wrote: >> David Dean wrote: >>> My landlady was going to sell the condo I'm living in last October. .... > I am also not a lawyer, but I would think that if the house forecloses, > that means the bank owns it, yes? Thus the contract would be binding > between you and the bank as it would with any private owner. I suspect that may not be true, at least not universally, but only because there was discussion some time back about allowing renters to continue to lease foreclosed homes. ie renter protection from forclosure on the owner. From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Aug 11 16:22:16 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Aug 11 16:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Renting sucks... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Bar0 wrote: > > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h5sf97$j8s$1@news.spamcop.net... >> Kenneth Brody wrote: >>> David Dean wrote: >>>> My landlady was going to sell the condo I'm living in last October. > .... >> I am also not a lawyer, but I would think that if the house >> forecloses, that means the bank owns it, yes? Thus the contract would >> be binding between you and the bank as it would with any private owner. > > I suspect that may not be true, at least not universally, but only > because there was discussion some time back about allowing renters to > continue to lease foreclosed homes. ie renter protection from forclosure > on the owner. Hmm, I could see how that would be a glaring loophole. Definitely a real lawyer should be contacted. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 11 17:19:08 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 11 17:30:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C643D4D8347TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was "Mike Easter" ! : : > Somehow, something seems wrong about subsidies and wastefulness. : : What bugs me about this one is claiming that it's to help the env't and : then giving the monies to people buying cars that get 22 mpg. Obviously : they set the bar so low to benefit 'merican car manufacturers 'cause that's : nothing like an improvement. My son has a HD truck he uses in his business. he gets 12-13 mpg. in town and slight better on the interstate. I drive the thing and I get 16-18 around town and 22 on the HW with just people. Pulling a 7000# tandem trailer @ full load he gets 8 to 10 I get 12-14. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 11 17:25:16 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 11 17:30:06 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "D.F. Manno" wrote in message news:dfmanno-06B2F9.15410411082009@news.cesmail.net... : In article , : "Joe Gill" wrote: : : > Well commrade, 'da furher' in Washington want us to spy on our fellow : > citizens and report to him 'fishy' information @ flag@whitehouse.gov : : That's an outright lie. The request was to forward misinformation in ads : and the media to the White House so that it could be countered with : accurate information. : And you think there would to be an all out effort to spin that? BTW when GWB was gov of Texas he signed (and to my memory) promoted a bill that would allow hospitals to stop treatment to chronically ill (aka terminally ill) patients. Want to guess who got to make the determination? ( A program brought to you by the medical industrial complex, a wholly owned subsidiary of the military industrial complex) So much for 'kill your grandma' as a Democratic idea. From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Aug 11 17:36:05 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Aug 11 17:40:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > "Charles" wrote in message > news:Xns9C643D4D8347TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > : No way it was me! It was "Mike Easter" ! > : > : > Somehow, something seems wrong about subsidies and wastefulness. > : > : What bugs me about this one is claiming that it's to help the env't and > : then giving the monies to people buying cars that get 22 mpg. Obviously > : they set the bar so low to benefit 'merican car manufacturers 'cause > that's > : nothing like an improvement. > > My son has a HD truck he uses in his business. he gets 12-13 mpg. in town > and slight better on the interstate. I drive the thing and I get 16-18 > around town and 22 on the HW with just people. Pulling a 7000# tandem > trailer @ full load he gets 8 to 10 I get 12-14. > > My old 87 F-150 got 22mpg on the highway if I drove it gently...cruise control at 55, windows up, etc... Often times it got half that in the city. My new car, 2005 Focus, gets 45 on the highway with cruise at 60, and it gets more mileage in the city than my truck got on the highway. From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 11 19:09:00 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 11 19:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > My son has a HD truck he uses in his business. he gets 12-13 mpg. in > town and slight better on the interstate. I drive the thing and I get > 16-18 around town and 22 on the HW with just people. Pulling a 7000# > tandem trailer @ full load he gets 8 to 10 I get 12-14. Maybe you should buy him a vacuum pressure gauge and teach him how to drive while using it. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 11 20:03:09 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Aug 11 20:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Renting sucks... References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-60E008.11224111082009@killface.local... > My landlady was going to sell the condo I'm living in last October. > (At the time, I thought she was trying to scare me into buying it) Well, > I wasn't going to be able to make the payments for what she was asking, > so I started to look for another place. We found one and they called to > check my references. At which point the landlady panicked about losing > us before she sold the house, so we talked her into a two year lease. > (So that I could continue saving to buy a house) > Well it turns out she must have wanted to sell because she was having > trouble paying the mortgage. We got some mail for her here that looked > suspiciously like pre-foreclosure notices. I dropped them off for her > and started to check the legal notices in the local paper to see if a > foreclosure was imminent. She called me yesterday to tell me that she > was going to have to sell the house at a short sale to satisfy the bank > and avoid foreclosure. > Anyone know if the lease is still binding on the new owner? How long > I'll have? or what my options might be? I still don't think I can afford > the mortgage for what she's asking. > -- > -David In NH if there is an existing lease, the new purchaser has to honor it (or I imagine can buy it out). I asked my landlord to write me a lease if he got close to selling to give me some extra time (I've been a tenant at will for 20 years) and the real estate agent told him not to (bitch). Doesn't want any strings if she can snag a buyer. Whether that applies to forclosure, you'll have to check the state laws. So call the bank, make your lowball offer, maybe the bank, seeing as your already occupying the space, will see fit to take a bird in the hand and be done with it. But since when have banks ever been logical........ From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 11 20:07:29 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Aug 11 20:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h5kq5a$ngv$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Damn, that sucks Hiedi! I haven't been following .social very closely, > missed this post. I assume moving in with Mum would be a no go? No, she lives in a one bedroom granny flat attached to my sister's house, and my sister has taken an leave from her job to care for her. What's going to happen after that leave is over is quite worrisome. I have had an offer from one of my very dear 'horsey' friends to come live with her if I need a place to stay between homes - she is a fairly recent widow, and has rheumatoid, so that would be a help to her and I think enjoyable, except for the location - commuting would be a nightmare. But at least it's a safety net if I need one. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 11 20:23:41 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 11 20:25:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5stm6$7cn$1@news.spamcop.net... : Frog Prince wrote: : : > My son has a HD truck he uses in his business. he gets 12-13 mpg. in : > town and slight better on the interstate. I drive the thing and I get : > 16-18 around town and 22 on the HW with just people. Pulling a 7000# : > tandem trailer @ full load he gets 8 to 10 I get 12-14. : : Maybe you should buy him a vacuum pressure gauge and teach him how to : drive while using it.\ I gave up control of his sh|t when he got out of dippers. kibitzer, not SC admin : From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 11 20:50:46 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Aug 11 20:55:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Bar0" wrote in message news:h5shu7$3jn$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Defense against their right to choose their own doctors. Who is saying you can't choose your own doctors? I find all this right wing shrieking kind of hilarious, that's their MO, bellow a lot of bullshit and shout everyone else down. I saw one guy leaving the Portsmouth meeting today on my way home - "Nobama" on his license plate and all sorts of crap plastered all over his car about socialism and American rights. Like the one to free speech that they seem to be intent on denying anyone who wants to be heard at the town meetings.... I wanted to write a note and stick it on my window. "You lost. Deal with it". Can't do that while I'm driving though. I guess they're doing the only thing they can do, make up lies, shriek nonsense at a volume where no one else can be heard, it's truly pathetic. From aunt.jemima at pancake.box Wed Aug 12 16:53:21 2009 From: aunt.jemima at pancake.box (dwacon) Date: Wed Aug 12 16:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: Does Cash for clunkers mean I can get a refund on my ticket for the G.I. Joe movie? -- If your outgo is more than your income, your upkeep will be your downfall http://blog.dwacon.com http://www.twitter.com/dwacon From me at privacy.net Wed Aug 12 17:45:36 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Aug 12 17:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] "Yeah, I read the signs, but..." References: Message-ID: "Why do we have alligators in a public lake....?" Said the Florida man whose off-leash Dalmatian was gobbled up by an alligator in a park lake as the dog went for a drink. http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/crime/2009-08-11/story/gator_kills_dalmatian_at_jacksonvilles_hanna_park Assuming the man's question is not rhetorical, the answer is: "Because the alligator LIVES there?" Good thing he does not live in parts of Louisiana...when it rains hard enough gators swim in the streets. From kenbrody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 12 18:06:58 2009 From: kenbrody at spamcop.net (Kenneth Brody) Date: Wed Aug 12 18:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Renting sucks... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > Kenneth Brody wrote: >> David Dean wrote: >>> My landlady was going to sell the condo I'm living in last >>> October. (At the time, I thought she was trying to scare me into >>> buying it) Well, I wasn't going to be able to make the payments for >>> what she was asking, so I started to look for another place. We found >>> one and they called to check my references. At which point the >>> landlady panicked about losing us before she sold the house, so we >>> talked her into a two year lease. (So that I could continue saving to >>> buy a house) >>> Well it turns out she must have wanted to sell because she was >>> having trouble paying the mortgage. We got some mail for her here >>> that looked suspiciously like pre-foreclosure notices. I dropped them >>> off for her and started to check the legal notices in the local paper >>> to see if a foreclosure was imminent. She called me yesterday to tell >>> me that she was going to have to sell the house at a short sale to >>> satisfy the bank and avoid foreclosure. >>> Anyone know if the lease is still binding on the new owner? How >>> long I'll have? or what my options might be? I still don't think I >>> can afford the mortgage for what she's asking. >> >> IANAL, but... >> >> I would suspect that if she were to sell the house, the contract would >> be binding on the purchaser. However, if it were to go to >> foreclosure, I would suspect the contract would be null and void. >> >> Of course, I would highly recommend you speak to someone who can say >> "IAAL". >> >> Finally, if she (and the bank) are talking short sale, you can always >> make a lowball offer that you can afford. >> > > I am also not a lawyer, but I would think that if the house forecloses, > that means the bank owns it, yes? Thus the contract would be binding > between you and the bank as it would with any private owner. Well, thinking about it further, the contract is between the current owner and the renter. It is not like a lien which is attached to the property. It may be that the new owner has no obligation to abide by the contract, and that the most you could do is sue the previous owner for breach. It may be possible to have the contract someone attached to the property, and any sale must satisfy it, just like it must satisfy a secondary mortgage or a mechanics lien. However, you have to remember that, even with liens, a foreclosure erases all subordinate liens. (Except, I believe, tax liens.) But, as I said, IANAL. -- Kenneth Brody From kenbrody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 12 18:11:13 2009 From: kenbrody at spamcop.net (Kenneth Brody) Date: Wed Aug 12 18:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Renting sucks... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > Bar0 wrote: >> >> "Borgholio" wrote in message >> news:h5sf97$j8s$1@news.spamcop.net... >>> Kenneth Brody wrote: >>>> David Dean wrote: >>>>> My landlady was going to sell the condo I'm living in last October. >> .... >>> I am also not a lawyer, but I would think that if the house >>> forecloses, that means the bank owns it, yes? Thus the contract >>> would be binding between you and the bank as it would with any >>> private owner. >> >> I suspect that may not be true, at least not universally, but only >> because there was discussion some time back about allowing renters to >> continue to lease foreclosed homes. ie renter protection from >> forclosure on the owner. > > Hmm, I could see how that would be a glaring loophole. Definitely a > real lawyer should be contacted. Consider this scenario: Owner knows they are about to be foreclosed on. (But, no papers have been filed, and no notices have been sent yet.) Owner writes a 99-year lease to a friend, for $1/month, all utilities included. -- Kenneth Brody From kenbrody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 12 18:19:41 2009 From: kenbrody at spamcop.net (Kenneth Brody) Date: Wed Aug 12 18:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Renting sucks... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > No way it was me! It was Kenneth Brody ! > >> Finally, if she (and the bank) are talking short sale, you can always >> make a lowball offer that you can afford. > > The short sale may be as on this house I visited Sunday. The "sale" was > that the owners just signed it over to the bank. That's called "deed in lieu of foreclosure". http://www.hud.gov/offices/hsg/sfh/nsc/faqdil.cfm > Now it's for sale for > what the bank was owed. So it works out OKish for all parties: > - the former owners avoid bankruptcy > - in theory the bank doesn't lose any money "In theory", since the bank may not get what it was owed. And banks would often rather sell it at a loss ("short sale") than hold onto an REO. (They lose less that way.) > - in theory some new person gets a bargain on a house > > Still, living in the place as a renter? I hear the fear... -- Kenneth Brody From kenbrody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 12 18:29:22 2009 From: kenbrody at spamcop.net (Kenneth Brody) Date: Wed Aug 12 18:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Yeah, I read the signs, but..." In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > "Why do we have alligators in a public lake....?" > > Said the Florida man whose off-leash Dalmatian was gobbled up by an > alligator in a park lake as the dog went for a drink. > > http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/crime/2009-08-11/story/gator_kills_dalmatian_at_jacksonvilles_hanna_park > > Assuming the man's question is not rhetorical, the answer is: "Because the > alligator LIVES there?" [...] "Rust said if there was a danger from alligators, he would have expected park officials to periodically clear the lake of them." You mean like they clear the oceans of jellyfish and man-of-war, and National Parks of bears? -- Kenneth Brody From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 12 18:49:05 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Wed Aug 12 18:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Yeah, I read the signs, but..." References: Message-ID: "Kenneth Brody" wrote in message news:h5vfo5$2dm$1@news.spamcop.net... > Frog Prince wrote: >> "Why do we have alligators in a public lake....?" >> >> Said the Florida man whose off-leash Dalmatian was gobbled up by an >> alligator in a park lake as the dog went for a drink. >> >> http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/crime/2009-08-11/story/gator_kills_dalmatian_at_jacksonvilles_hanna_park >> >> Assuming the man's question is not rhetorical, the answer is: "Because >> the >> alligator LIVES there?" > [...] > > "Rust said if there was a danger from alligators, he would have expected > park officials to periodically clear the lake of them." > > You mean like they clear the oceans of jellyfish and man-of-war, and > National Parks of bears? They don't? All these taxes I pay, and they don't? From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 12 19:19:41 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Wed Aug 12 19:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C65A1AD55E17sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "Bar0" wrote in news:h5sdol$d8k$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> What? the Interurban again? that's what was responsible for the LA >> sprawl. >> >> (Ok I'm gonna duck now) >> >> > > The goddamn freeways are to blame for the sprawl. The 405 is a loathsome > road, especially between I5 and I10! Actually the original sprawl was thanks to the interurban railway system in LA, In the 40's and 50's GM convinced LA to ditch trains for buses, which need roads, which led to freeways. And that's why GM practically gave away the buses. Back in the late 70's someone unearthed and publicised the GM Plan to make LA dependent upon cars. From me at privacy.net Wed Aug 12 19:24:55 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Aug 12 19:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Yeah, I read the signs, but..." References: Message-ID: "Bar0" wrote in message news:h5vgt2$9r3$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Kenneth Brody" wrote in message : news:h5vfo5$2dm$1@news.spamcop.net... : > Frog Prince wrote: : >> "Why do we have alligators in a public lake....?" : >> : >> Said the Florida man whose off-leash Dalmatian was gobbled up by an : >> alligator in a park lake as the dog went for a drink. : >> : >> http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/crime/2009-08-11/story/gator_kills_dalmatian_at_jacksonvilles_hanna_park : >> : >> Assuming the man's question is not rhetorical, the answer is: "Because : >> the : >> alligator LIVES there?" : > [...] : > : > "Rust said if there was a danger from alligators, he would have expected : > park officials to periodically clear the lake of them." : > : > You mean like they clear the oceans of jellyfish and man-of-war, and : > National Parks of bears? : : They don't? All these taxes I pay, and they don't? Some places they pay to reinstall bears. As to gatores not too many years back they were stocking the everglades as well as the coastal areas of Louisiana and Texas.: From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 12 22:00:11 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Wed Aug 12 22:05:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:h5t3l7$fnl$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Bar0" wrote in message > news:h5shu7$3jn$1@news.spamcop.net... >> >> Defense against their right to choose their own doctors. > > Who is saying you can't choose your own doctors? I find all this right > wing shrieking kind of hilarious, that's their MO, bellow a lot of > bullshit and shout everyone else down. I saw one guy leaving the > Portsmouth meeting today on my way home - "Nobama" on his license plate > and all sorts of crap plastered all over his car about socialism and > American rights. Like the one to free speech that they seem to be intent > on denying anyone who wants to be heard at the town meetings.... I wanted > to write a note and stick it on my window. "You lost. Deal with it". > Can't do that while I'm driving though. I guess they're doing the only > thing they can do, make up lies, shriek nonsense at a volume where no one > else can be heard, it's truly pathetic. > Well I agree with the part of the bill that wants to require a tribunal decide whether you get treatment or not after retirement, and sick people over 65 should all be moved into hospices. They should also be forced to use whatever cheapest doctors that cheapskate faceless bureaucrats in Washington can find for them. We should support this reform bill. /Ducking But seriously, whatever comes out of Congress is going to be pretty much crap, they're letting the big lobbyists write msjor portions of the bill to enlist their support. Well, I guarantee, if you get the support of big pharma and the health insurers, the rest of us will be screwed worse than we are today. The only thing they support, and rightly so, as for profit corporations, is their bottom line. You don't want a major health bill pandering to them. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 12 22:01:13 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Wed Aug 12 22:05:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Yeah, I read the signs, but..." References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h5vj1b$mva$1@news.spamcop.net... > > > "Bar0" wrote in message > news:h5vgt2$9r3$1@news.spamcop.net... > : > : "Kenneth Brody" wrote in message > : news:h5vfo5$2dm$1@news.spamcop.net... > : > Frog Prince wrote: > : >> "Why do we have alligators in a public lake....?" > : >> > : >> Said the Florida man whose off-leash Dalmatian was gobbled up by an > : >> alligator in a park lake as the dog went for a drink. .... > : > "Rust said if there was a danger from alligators, he would have > expected > : > park officials to periodically clear the lake of them." > : > > : > You mean like they clear the oceans of jellyfish and man-of-war, and > : > National Parks of bears? > : > : They don't? All these taxes I pay, and they don't? > > Some places they pay to reinstall bears. As to gatores not too many years > back they were stocking the everglades as well as the coastal areas of > Louisiana and Texas.: I must've sounded like I was serious. From me at privacy.net Wed Aug 12 22:08:20 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Aug 12 22:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Yeah, I read the signs, but..." References: Message-ID: "bar0" < : > : >> "Why do we have alligators in a public lake....?" : > : >> : > : >> Said the Florida man whose off-leash Dalmatian was gobbled up by an : > : >> alligator in a park lake as the dog went for a drink. : .... : > : > "Rust said if there was a danger from alligators, he would have : > expected : > : > park officials to periodically clear the lake of them." : > : > : > : > You mean like they clear the oceans of jellyfish and man-of-war, and : > : > National Parks of bears? : > : : > : They don't? All these taxes I pay, and they don't? : > : > Some places they pay to reinstall bears. As to gatores not too many years : > back they were stocking the everglades as well as the coastal areas of : > Louisiana and Texas.: : : I must've sounded like I was serious. I know I'm good but not THAT good ... but then I've sold sand to the Saudis. (and that's not a joke) From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 13 00:08:33 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 13 00:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C644C1D7F25Fsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > Exactly. LA seriously needs to build a rail system. That'd save so much > gas > (and related pollution) and time but oh no, it's too expensive. They're right, you know (the detractors).....building a light rail system in LA would cost $10's of billions at this point. I should know, I've lived thru the entire design and build stage of the Baltimore area light rail commuter transport system. The costs are staggering here, so I can't even begin to imagine how much things would cost in that precious LA real estate market. And although the system may save gas, it certainly doesn't save oneself time, a crucial concern these days. A path the would normally take 15-20 minutes to drive under ideal conditions takes 40-45 minutes on light rail because of all the stops, and the system stops at a certain time at night, just like the DC metro subway. So it has it's pros and cons usage-wise...but the costs are ENORMOUS. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 13 00:22:24 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 13 00:25:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C65A1AD55E17sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "Bar0" wrote in news:h5sdol$d8k$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> What? the Interurban again? that's what was responsible for the LA >> sprawl. >> >> (Ok I'm gonna duck now) >> >> > > The goddamn freeways are to blame for the sprawl. The 405 is a loathsome > road, especially between I5 and I10! I dunno if our MD "inter county connector" road, in the works for almost 30 years to connect the high tech I-270 corridor north of DC with I-95 by bypassing the DC beltway, is similar to that road you despise, but I've been hopefully waiting for many years for it to get built, even though it's going to be a toll road. For me to get east at an almost equivalent latitude I have to drive all the way down to the DC beltway, circumnavigate it, then go north on I-270 to get to my destination. It's a hellish drive under any conditions, and horrific at rush hour. The new toll road will cut off more than 2/3rds of that drive, going straight east to west slightly south of me. It will be a godsend, but the enviro-terrorists that held it up for damn near 15 years, and the "anti-elitist" crowd are still up in arms over it's construction (only the rich will be able to afford the toll, blah blah blah). Nobody bitches about the toll on I-66 to get to the Dulles airport and northern VA region (at least anymore). That new road (with limited access to halt suburban sprawl) will literally cut over 1/2 hour from my drive from my house (point A) to point B when it's finished. How great is THAT for the environment, let alone our dependence on foreign oil? From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 13 00:28:04 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 13 00:30:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:h5t142$spq$1@news.spamcop.net... > > No, she lives in a one bedroom granny flat attached to my sister's house, > and my sister has taken an leave from her job to care for her. What's > going to happen after that leave is over is quite worrisome. I have had > an offer from one of my very dear 'horsey' friends to come live with her > if I need a place to stay between homes - she is a fairly recent widow, > and has rheumatoid, so that would be a help to her and I think enjoyable, > except for the location - commuting would be a nightmare. But at least > it's a safety net if I need one. Well, at least you have an "inconvenient" safety net there if you need it, that's better than a lot of folks have. Whycome your mum isn't in some medicare constant care facility by now? From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 13 00:50:00 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 13 00:55:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h603k2$1t6$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message : news:Xns9C644C1D7F25Fsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : > Exactly. LA seriously needs to build a rail system. That'd save so much : > gas : > (and related pollution) and time but oh no, it's too expensive. : : They're right, you know (the detractors).....building a light rail system in : LA would cost $10's of billions at this point. I should know, I've lived : thru the entire design and build stage of the Baltimore area light rail : commuter transport system. The costs are staggering here, so I can't even : begin to imagine how much things would cost in that precious LA real estate : market. : : And although the system may save gas, it certainly doesn't save oneself : time, a crucial concern these days. A path the would normally take 15-20 : minutes to drive under ideal conditions takes 40-45 minutes on light rail : because of all the stops, and the system stops at a certain time at night, : just like the DC metro subway. So it has it's pros and cons usage-wise...but : the costs are ENORMOUS. Dallas has a long term plan for light rail and it will be a good one only difficulty is it's design for into and out of down town. If you want to go a few miles east or west you have to go all the way down town the same distance out on another leg. From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 13 00:52:26 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 13 00:55:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h604e1$8hq$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message : news:Xns9C65A1AD55E17sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : > "Bar0" wrote in news:h5sdol$d8k$1@news.spamcop.net: : > : > : >> What? the Interurban again? that's what was responsible for the LA : >> sprawl. : >> : >> (Ok I'm gonna duck now) : >> : >> : > : > The goddamn freeways are to blame for the sprawl. The 405 is a loathsome : > road, especially between I5 and I10! : : I dunno if our MD "inter county connector" road, in the works for almost 30 : years to connect the high tech I-270 corridor north of DC with I-95 by : bypassing the DC beltway, is similar to that road you despise, but I've been : hopefully waiting for many years for it to get built, even though it's going : to be a toll road. For me to get east at an almost equivalent latitude I : have to drive all the way down to the DC beltway, circumnavigate it, then go : north on I-270 to get to my destination. It's a hellish drive under any : conditions, and horrific at rush hour. The new toll road will cut off more : than 2/3rds of that drive, going straight east to west slightly south of me. : : It will be a godsend, but the enviro-terrorists that held it up for damn : near 15 years, and the "anti-elitist" crowd are still up in arms over it's : construction (only the rich will be able to afford the toll, blah blah : blah). Nobody bitches about the toll on I-66 to get to the Dulles airport : and northern VA region (at least anymore). That new road (with limited : access to halt suburban sprawl) will literally cut over 1/2 hour from my : drive from my house (point A) to point B when it's finished. How great is : THAT for the environment, let alone our dependence on foreign oil? Dallas has a monopoly toll system and they are jumping fees right and left. Last jump caused a drop in usage, so the mental giants decided to raise rates to make up the difference. Opps net income went down... again. From avoozl at spamcop.net Thu Aug 13 07:27:56 2009 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Thu Aug 13 07:30:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: What's wrong with it? "dwacon" wrote in message news:h5va4b$fre$1@news.spamcop.net... > Does Cash for clunkers mean I can get a refund on my ticket for the G.I. > Joe movie? > > From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 13 09:03:53 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 13 09:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) Message-ID: Video: Dean Kamen Unplugged Segway inventor Dean Kamen has taken his private island off the grid. He has replaced every lightbulb on the island with an LED as part of a larger effort to popularize zero-net-energy living. He and his lighting guru, Fritz Morgan, take IEEE Spectrum on a behind-the-scenes tour of the island’s energy infrastructure, which includes solar and wind generators, a Web-based control system, and a basement full of backup batteries. For more http://spectrum.ieee.org/video/green-tech/buildings/dumpling-island http://newsmanager.commpartners.com/ieeesta/issues/2009-08-13-email.html From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 13 09:26:30 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 13 09:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "bar0" wrote in message news:h5vs3c$i6h$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Heidi" wrote in message : news:h5t3l7$fnl$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : > "Bar0" wrote in message : > news:h5shu7$3jn$1@news.spamcop.net... : >> : >> Defense against their right to choose their own doctors. : > : > Who is saying you can't choose your own doctors? I find all this right : > wing shrieking kind of hilarious, that's their MO, bellow a lot of : > bullshit and shout everyone else down. I saw one guy leaving the : > Portsmouth meeting today on my way home - "Nobama" on his license plate : > and all sorts of crap plastered all over his car about socialism and : > American rights. Like the one to free speech that they seem to be intent : > on denying anyone who wants to be heard at the town meetings.... I wanted : > to write a note and stick it on my window. "You lost. Deal with it". : > Can't do that while I'm driving though. I guess they're doing the only : > thing they can do, make up lies, shriek nonsense at a volume where no one : > else can be heard, it's truly pathetic. : > : : Well I agree with the part of the bill that wants to require a tribunal : decide whether you get treatment or not after retirement, and sick people : over 65 should all be moved into hospices. They should also be forced to use : whatever cheapest doctors that cheapskate faceless bureaucrats in Washington : can find for them. : : We should support this reform bill. : : /Ducking : : But seriously, whatever comes out of Congress is going to be pretty much : crap, they're letting the big lobbyists write msjor portions of the bill to : enlist their support. Well, I guarantee, if you get the support of big : pharma and the health insurers, the rest of us will be screwed worse than we : are today. The only thing they support, and rightly so, as for profit : corporations, is their bottom line. You don't want a major health bill : pandering to them. Bout sums it up! http://drawn.ca/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/8039907343jpg.jpeg From nobody at invalid.invalid Thu Aug 13 09:47:08 2009 From: nobody at invalid.invalid (Fred) Date: Thu Aug 13 09:50:07 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: In news:h5vs3c$i6h$1@news.spamcop.net "bar0" wrote: > But seriously, whatever comes out of Congress is going to be pretty > much crap, they're letting the big lobbyists write msjor portions of > the bill to enlist their support. Well, I guarantee, if you get the > support of big pharma and the health insurers, the rest of us will be > screwed worse than we are today. Remember, the "big lobbyists" aren't all from the business world; big labor pretty much owns the Democrats. From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 13 11:02:49 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 13 11:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Fred" wrote in message news:h615gs$16h$1@news.spamcop.net... : In news:h5vs3c$i6h$1@news.spamcop.net "bar0" wrote: : : > But seriously, whatever comes out of Congress is going to be pretty : > much crap, they're letting the big lobbyists write msjor portions of : > the bill to enlist their support. Well, I guarantee, if you get the : > support of big pharma and the health insurers, the rest of us will be : > screwed worse than we are today. : : Remember, the "big lobbyists" aren't all from the business world; big : labor pretty much owns the Democrats. Big lobbyists own both sides of the isle with an iron clad lease on the carpet between. From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 13 15:35:23 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 13 15:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Just for Charles Message-ID: I'm not a real fan of beer in the can. But likely as not when the summer is hot I'll still be doing the can-can-can. Burma Shave From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 13 16:16:04 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Thu Aug 13 16:20:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Fred" wrote in message news:h615gs$16h$1@news.spamcop.net... > In news:h5vs3c$i6h$1@news.spamcop.net "bar0" wrote: > >> But seriously, whatever comes out of Congress is going to be pretty >> much crap, they're letting the big lobbyists write msjor portions of >> the bill to enlist their support. Well, I guarantee, if you get the >> support of big pharma and the health insurers, the rest of us will be >> screwed worse than we are today. > > Remember, the "big lobbyists" aren't all from the business world; big > labor pretty much owns the Democrats. > Not so I've noticed. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 13 17:27:53 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Thu Aug 13 17:30:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-81EA6B.13511513082009@killface.local... > In article , "Bar0" > wrote: > >> > Remember, the "big lobbyists" aren't all from the business world; big >> > labor pretty much owns the Democrats. >> > >> >> Not so I've noticed. > > When was the last any of you worked at a company that was unionized? > "big labor" doesn't exist. There are three and a half times more people > with no health insurance than are members of unions. > -- > -David Also, a union is a more or less free association of people with more or less democratic rules. They (members) can turf their stewards and bosses, and tell them how to lobby. A corporation is not, furthermore shareholders are not equal, and largely have little or no say on the conduct of the corporation. Some very few institutions have that say in most cases, and they are also not representative of their stakeholders. So, yeah I'd rather unions had stroke with my representatives than corporations and wealthy individuals. From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 13 18:56:29 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 13 19:00:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C66BB4EFD6BETheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! : : > Video: Dean Kamen Unplugged : : Yah, I could go off the grid if I had millions, too. I've a friend in west Texas that has done just that and he's no millionaire. From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 13 20:05:36 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 13 20:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > Hmm. Maybe I need a beer. You are way behind on the beer and way ahead on the timezone offset. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 13 20:11:00 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 13 20:15:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > Summer is hot. I've been drinking the 28% beer. I can't exactly say > that it's refreshing but it is pretty crazy. When I want the alcohol and beer, I drink my beer with tequila shooters and such. Well, I shouldn't say shooters, I don't shoot my tequila, I just drink it. When I want to drink wine, I drink wine. They make it out of grapes you know. And it has a whole bunch of 'drugs' - chemical intoxicants - in there, especially those red ones. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 13 21:32:27 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Thu Aug 13 21:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C66CBE74FDB2TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! > >> when the summer is hot >> I'll still be doing the can-can-can. > > Summer is hot. I've been drinking the 28% beer. I can't exactly say that > it's refreshing but it is pretty crazy. 28? or 2.8? and if 28, how do you ferment anything to 28? From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 13 21:33:20 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Thu Aug 13 21:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h62a2j$gi3$1@news.spamcop.net... .... > When I want to drink wine, I drink wine. They make it out of grapes you > know. And it has a whole bunch of 'drugs' - chemical intoxicants - in > there, especially those red ones. not intoxicants, heart medication and antioxidants From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Thu Aug 13 21:51:45 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Thu Aug 13 21:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mike Easter wrote: > Charles wrote: >> Hmm. Maybe I need a beer. > > You are way behind on the beer and way ahead on the timezone offset. I think I might finally be caught up enough with my life, got the motorcycle handled. Although I have a lovely replacement frame for my bicycle now which I need to start building, need to get lots of new parts and start putting things together. The job has stabilized but I'll see how long I end up staying here. But this weekend I'm off to the brew shop to accumulate some equipment. I guess I'll start off easy and just do a mix first, just to see how it all works. From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 13 22:11:08 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 13 22:15:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles References: Message-ID: bar0 wrote: > "Charles" >> Summer is hot. I've been drinking the 28% beer. I can't exactly say >> that it's refreshing but it is pretty crazy. > > 28? or 2.8? and if 28, how do you ferment anything to 28? I think that some of the yeast strains that are developed for high alcohol production (turbos) refer to their 'potency' in terms of how high the sugar concentration (and temperature)can go, which would include such numbers as 28% (sucrose concentration or equivalent). I think you might get those up to maybe 18% alcohol or so. But that wouldn't make anything I would call beer or drink. Or you could go the route of 'beer brandy' - beer schnapps, distilled beer, bierlikor. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Thu Aug 13 22:15:01 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Thu Aug 13 22:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > No way it was me! It was Mr K Mean ! > >> I have a lovely replacement frame for my >> bicycle now which I need to start building, need to get lots of new >> parts and start putting things together. > > I found an amazing price on dura-ace cranks. Um. If that's your gig. I've been looking around. Shipping costs are not pretty. Nor the exchange rate. Although that is a little better than it was six months ago. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 13 22:27:45 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Aug 13 22:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h604ok$a9i$1@news.spamcop.net... > > > Well, at least you have an "inconvenient" safety net there if you need it, > that's better than a lot of folks have. Whycome your mum isn't in some > medicare constant care facility by now? Because my mother wants to be at home, and my sister made the noble if somewhat misguided promise that we would care for her at home. It's always easy to say the 'right' thing but if you don't have a plan to accomplish it, it's kind of a hollow sentiment, so it's going to be extremely challenging to figure out what next when my sister's leave is over. There isn't any facility that takes medicare that we know of, hospice is a pay situtation if you go to their center, and unfortunately, my mother didn't plan for this. Who could, really. Someone came to look at the property today, and I caught the agent on the way out. She said they got out of their cars, looked at my beautiful gardens and said "oh my gosh, would the tenant want to stay?", and I said "yes PLEASE". We'll see if they make an offer. If only it would be that easy.... From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Aug 13 22:44:31 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Aug 13 22:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional_freezing My favorite eutectic concoction is 'automatic' daiquiri/s. You put together the correct ratios of water and limeade and rum and whatever other stuff you like and just put it into the freezer for a while. If you do it right, it won't freeze, but it will just turn into a slush, a consistency like a blended margarita, ergo 'eutectic-ish' if you're into thermodynamics and phase changes of alcohol water mixtures. I have no experience making margaritas like that because I prefer my margaritas on the rocks and not blended. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 14 01:48:13 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Fri Aug 14 01:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:h62i34$31n$1@news.spamcop.net... > Someone came to look at the property today, and I caught the agent on the > way out. She said they got out of their cars, looked at my beautiful > gardens and said "oh my gosh, would the tenant want to stay?", and I said > "yes PLEASE". We'll see if they make an offer. If only it would be that > easy.... > Good that you made a good first impression on how you care for your rental! Is your mom's house payed for? She might consider a reverse mortgage to pay for in-home health care. From bcs1 at spamcop.net Fri Aug 14 10:05:19 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Fri Aug 14 10:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h5r28l$2nk$1@news.spamcop.net... > Somehow, something seems wrong about subsidies and wastefulness. That > seems like the kind of thing that leads to unintended consequences. > > How can it be a good thing, a good lesson, a good 'message' - if you are > into messages - to be destroying perfectly good automobiles by seizing > their engines? Something just seems unhealthy or wrong or against some > ethic about that. > > Billions for destroying operational cars. It is a strange subsidy. We > used to cry about a few millions for some kind of agricultural > subsidies. Now that is all chickenfeed, so to speak. > > > -- > Mike Easter > kibitzer, not SC admin > Hi Mike, you know I wrote a poll about this over on the Sodahead site.. about the only thing that i didn't mention was the charity donation of cars from people.. of course some of the proponents of this tried to make my post look like it was deceiving, but i sourced everything when I wrote it and applied common sense to the rest.. http://www.sodahead.com/question/548801/ Cash for clunkers (pros and cons) is this really a "good" thing?, I say it's not, read this and tell me what you think... After burning through 1 billion dollars in a little over a week, many proponents of the "CARS" program say that it helped the economy... And there is another 2 billion dollars newly allocated for t... After burning through 1 billion dollars in a little over a week, many proponents of the "CARS" program say that it helped the economy... And there is another 2 billion dollars newly allocated for this program... also before anyone gets to the cons and thinks that I'm going to list the privacy statement that was supposed to allow the government total access to your system and or files, it won't be there. there was a rather poorly worded (and since changed) agreement on the site, but it was NOT for consumers, it was for dealers, and even then it was still poorly worded. With that said, let's look at the pros and Cons of the cars program. Pros: 1. About 250,000 new cars were sold. 2. The Average gas mileage difference between the old vs New vehicles was 9/10 miles per gallon. Data from the U.S. Department of Transportation shows people are snapping up fuel-sipping cars, led by the Ford Focus and followed by models from Honda and Toyota. The average mileage of the clunkers was 15.8; the new cars average 25.4 miles a gallon. 3. this gas mileage difference will save us approx 56 million gallons of gas a year. 4. People were able to get a $3500.00 to $4500.00 price break on a new vehicle 5. About 250,000 cars will be recycled. (crushed) 6. The showroom traffic at participating dealers increased. (see #1) 7. Automobile industry related lay-offs were slowed based on the influx of funds precipitated by the CARS program. Cons: 1. About 250,000 cars will be crushed: Many of which ran and drove fine, but simply got an average of 9 miles to the gallon less than the new cars get. These vehicles will be "out of the market" now which means several things. 1. auto part manufacturers will have less of a demand for their products 2. auto parts stores like auto-zone, pep boys and such will have a reduction in the amount of sales 3. Garages will have less vehicles coming in for repair since the new vehicles will likely not require repairs for a period of 3 to 5 years outside of normal maintenance. 4. Car dealerships that normally resell trade-ins will not have access to this inventory and neither will people who wish to purchase a used vehicle as opposed to spending the cost of a new one, or people buying their kid their first car (IE. no trade-in) 5. Car dealership "used Car sales" has fallen and often, there's not that much markup in new car sales to begin with, so in effect, the car dealership now loses income that they were once able to make. 6. buy here pay here car lots loose access to inventory where people who could not qualify for a regular car loan can still go and get financed for a car, without product, those car lots and the people who would normally be able to go there for a car can no longer do so. 7. the yearly gas savings is only equal to approx 1/400th of one percent of our total fuel consumption any way, and speculation has it that most people will drive more miles now because not only is the vehicle new and less subject to breakdowns, but also that they can go further on a gallon of gas, so even the 1/400th of 1 percent saving may be just a "statistical", but not "actual" saving. 8. Cars that are traded in to dealerships and do not sell or are not salable usually end up in a junkyard where remaining good parts are sold off of the vehicle to people who are willing to buy a used part for their vehicle and do the work themselves to save money. Neither the junkyards, nor their customers will have access to these parts. 9. while new car sales have risen, not all of these sales were limited to American car companies and even understanding that some Americans do work for foreign car companies, much of the money on the sales of foreign cars is not staying in the USA. 10. Car companies have not ramped up building of cars to counter the recent surge in sales, in fact, one dealership here in Cincinnati stated to me personally that it's going to be at least two months before they will have the more popular cars back in stock, basically, all that's happened so far is the car companies have dumped as much inventory as they were able to. 11. Most of the traded in cars were "PAID FOR" and the people had no car payment each month, yet now, another 250,000 Americans have gained a $200.00 to $400.00 car payment during this time of economic troubles. 12. no one who got the new cars in the first round were people who could not have otherwise qualified for a new car loan, so basically, this did not help the part of the population who could have really "used" the help. Interestingly enough during the debates over the 2 Billion dollar refill, this point was brought up... 13. people who would have normally car-pooled, or ridden a bus to work because of fuel costs will now probably drive themselves creating more congestion in the high traffic areas. 14. Not all of the funds for the program are even going to consumer car purchases, the fact is that out of that money the government also puts the cost of administering the program against the total amount of funds. 15. with the addition of the new funds, the sales of new cars under this program should slow down now that there's no "urgency" to it, this means that the temporary positive effects of the program (if any) will fall off markedly as people will not be "rushed" to get their new vehicle. I could sit here and think of many, many many more Cons about this issue, but I think that most readers will understand the scope of the real damage done by this program to not only our economy as a whole, but the people who burdened themselves further with more debt in this time of economic uncertainty... Now there are a couple of places that benefited/benefits from the CARS program, and I intentionally didn't include them in the "Pros" of the issue and there's a reason for that.. they are as follows: 1. Finance companies now have more clients who "owe" them money which is a good thing right?, what if some of those people lose their jobs when things pick up their normal pace (slow down) again, what are the finance companies going to do with repossessed cars and the losses on their books? Will the government bail them out again like they did during the home mortgage crisis? 2. who is the REAL winner in this? The Government is and here's how... a. Taxes still have to be paid on the purchase of a new car, those taxes range from $1,000 to $2,000 depending on the purchase price of the vehicle BEFORE any rebates or credits. yup, City, state and federal taxes, also, let's not forget licensing fees and title fees. all of those go right back to the government through the various chains and in the end, the government gets a windfall from it's "gesture of kindness" to the people. b. "The love of the people" for their generosity... all bought and paid for, wrapped up with a real pretty bow... c. The government is out nothing in this since it is the "taxpayer" who will be paying this money back for the government, not anyone else... well, the tax payer and their grandchildren..... d. See number 14 in the Cons, the government actually created a few jobs in the only way it ever can... by creating "government" jobs... anyway, I wanted to present this for your consideration... and remember, "Everything is not always as it seems" comments and discussion is welcome, personal attacks against the respondents to the poll is not. Please feel free to share, and thanks in advance for participating... Bill http://www.sodahead.com/group/3652/ http://bcs-bcs.com/img/bvote2.jpg http://images.sodahead.com/images/profiles/0/0/0/2/6/6/3/3/0/profiles_BAFlag1_4652_249824.jpeg From bcs1 at spamcop.net Fri Aug 14 10:28:29 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Fri Aug 14 10:30:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Brokeback Mountain, the sequel References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h54deq$qg6$1@news.spamcop.net... > South Carolina man charged with horse buggery. For a second time. > > http://tinyurl.com/n4s36l > > http://www.examiner.com/x-15540-New-Orleans-Top-News-Examiner~y2009m7d31-South-Carolina-man-charged-with-having-sex-with-a-horseAGAIN > > LMAO... sad, but funny.. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 14 11:30:41 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 14 11:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h62j2e$961$1@news.spamcop.net... : Charles wrote: : : > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional_freezing : : My favorite eutectic concoction is 'automatic' daiquiri/s. : : You put together the correct ratios of water and limeade and rum and : whatever other stuff you like and just put it into the freezer for a : while. : : If you do it right, it won't freeze, but it will just turn into a slush, : a consistency like a blended margarita, ergo 'eutectic-ish' if you're : into thermodynamics and phase changes of alcohol water mixtures. : : I have no experience making margaritas like that because I prefer my : margaritas on the rocks and not blended. Long time back I had a friend (physics prof at Tulane) that moon lighted as a bar tender @ Pat O'Brien's in NOLA (pay was better). In any case he ran a bar show based on physics where his close was something with the signature Hurricane. Some how super-cooled the mix and had a bar patron (usually a woman that was, basically, the life of the party) 'plunk' the container and the thing would freeze up, solid with a resounding, loud CRACK. As most were well soused and in a party mood he cleaned up on tips. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 14 12:04:59 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Aug 14 12:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h62h3q$t8b$1@news.spamcop.net... > bar0 wrote: >> "Charles" > >>> Summer is hot. I've been drinking the 28% beer. I can't exactly say >>> that it's refreshing but it is pretty crazy. >> >> 28? or 2.8? and if 28, how do you ferment anything to 28? > > I think that some of the yeast strains that are developed for high > alcohol production (turbos) refer to their 'potency' in terms of how > high the sugar concentration (and temperature)can go, which would > include such numbers as 28% (sucrose concentration or equivalent). > > I think you might get those up to maybe 18% alcohol or so. But that > wouldn't make anything I would call beer or drink. > > Or you could go the route of 'beer brandy' - beer schnapps, distilled > beer, bierlikor. Nevermind, just give me a good Rye. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 14 13:49:26 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 14 13:50:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Comcast vs. Dish vs. Direct TV References: Message-ID: "Heidi" < There isn't any facility that takes Medicare that we know of, hospice is a pay situation if : you go to their center, and unfortunately, my mother didn't plan for this. : Who could, really. : Check around some Hospice have programs that are needs based. BTW there are for profit as well as pro bono Hospice groups. You need to check on the status of the one you are interested in using. Look to see if there is a senior advocacy group in your area. Last there are some program where there are paid subsidies to low income seniors that may be able to stay with your mom while your sister is out of the house. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 14 16:57:11 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 14 17:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] 50 ways to lose your lunch Message-ID: http://www.rdmag.com/News/2009/08/Software-New-movie-theater-puts-viewers-in-immersive-dome/ From user at domain.invalid Sat Aug 15 01:05:28 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Sat Aug 15 01:10:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: 50 ways to lose your lunch In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > http://www.rdmag.com/News/2009/08/Software-New-movie-theater-puts-viewers-in-immersive-dome/ > Oh goody - one step closer to the world of E.M. Forster's "The Machine Stops". Hmmm ... that was written in 1909, why's it taking so long? Not for it to stop of course (that becomes inevitable), but for it to start. I first read that one in about 1959 (school library out in 'the bush') - it seemed a little far-fetched then ... From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 15 11:00:47 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sat Aug 15 11:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Someone finally had the balls to say it out loud.. Message-ID: Longtime Democratic strategist Paul Begala hammered former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin on Friday - calling her "flaky and an intellectual lightweight." Begala was asked on CNN's "The Situation Room with Wolf Blitzer" to respond to a Politico story in which former House Speaker Newt Gingrich outlined several ways for Palin to repair her image. Although Begala called Gingrich "a brilliant political strategist," he said giving advice to Palin is an exercise in futility. "Here's the problem," said Begala, a CNN contributor. "He is trying to treat her like a serious person. She is not. OK? She is about half a whack job. She does not have the intellectual heft of Newt Gingrich or almost anyone else in the Republican Party, and I think she has proved that." http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2009/08/14/begala-calls-palin-about-half-a-whack-job/ From bert at iphouse.com Sat Aug 15 11:07:08 2009 From: bert at iphouse.com (Bert Hyman) Date: Sat Aug 15 11:10:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Someone finally had the balls to say it out loud.. References: Message-ID: In news:h66ij0$irj$1@news.spamcop.net "Heidi" wrote: > Longtime Democratic strategist Paul Begala hammered former Alaska Gov. > Sarah Palin on Friday - calling her "flaky and an intellectual > lightweight." Gee whiz... One career politician questions the abilities of a career politician from the other party? STOP THE PRESSES! -- Bert Hyman St. Paul, MN bert@iphouse.com From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 15 11:12:46 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Sat Aug 15 11:15:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Someone finally had the balls to say it out loud.. References: Message-ID: "Bert Hyman" wrote in message news:Xns9C6866EFB7BCEVeebleFetzer@216.154.195.61... > In news:h66ij0$irj$1@news.spamcop.net "Heidi" > wrote: > >> Longtime Democratic strategist Paul Begala hammered former Alaska Gov. >> Sarah Palin on Friday - calling her "flaky and an intellectual >> lightweight." > > Gee whiz... > > One career politician questions the abilities of a career politician > from the other party? > > STOP THE PRESSES! well I don't know Mr. Begala from a Bagel, and he may be just a pot calling the kettle black, but I don;t find Newt to be such a heavyweight either. Newt and Sarah are both quite happy to flog various rumours they know to be untrue about the health care bill and Obamas citizenship. From MikeE at ster.invalid Sat Aug 15 11:20:53 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sat Aug 15 11:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Someone finally had the balls to say it out loud.. References: Message-ID: bar0 wrote: > I don;t find Newt to be such a > heavyweight either. Are you referring to Newt's Center for Health Transformation or some other source of commentary? http://www.healthtransformation.net/ The Center for Health Transformation is a high-impact collaboration of private and public sector leaders committed to creating a 21st Century Intelligent Health System that saves lives and saves money for all Americans. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 15 15:54:12 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 15 15:55:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] HAH! IT'S ALIVE! Message-ID: A while ago I wrote in .geeks that I wouldn't be posting any more questions about how to fix my PC problems after receiving a multitude of (sometimes well deserved, sometimes not) criticisms about how I use/abuse my computer. Most suggested that I start from scratch again, something I refused to face because of all the work involved. After banging my head against the screen for a couple of months trying to solve this problem and that, I made the decision to stop all efforts to "fix" my PC issues and just use OpenOffice Calc for the time being to keep track of my IRA accounts. I then took the last 4 weeks "off" and spent my time doing useful things around the house. The amount of work I got done inside and out was unbelievable, I finished jobs that I had started as far back as last November! At the end of that month (last week), the change in me was incredible -- mentally, I was on a high from doing all the various enjoyable woodworking necessary to do all the repairs and jobs, and I had a great sense of pleasure from seeing jobs well done and FINISHED, as opposed to my previous moodiness over the continous lack of progress in fixing my PC. And physically, I dropped 11 lbs from all of the activity, I'm now at the lightest weight I've been at in years and can actually fit back into my "skinny" pants and shorts. My muscles/joints held up well for the most part, partly because of always wearing my left elbow brace, my right wrist brace, and my new(ish) back brace. Most importantly, a month ago I discovered that out of my 4 pairs of orthotics, 2 pairs were 1/8" high on the right foot, and 2 pairs were 1/8" high on my LEFT foot -- around the year 2000 my chiropractor did a strength test on me and determined that my right leg was shorter than my left, ergo the lifts in the right orthotics. How/why/when I put those extra lifts to the 2 left orthotics is a mystery. Anyway at my last chiro visit I asked her to redo the strength test, and this time I was strongest barefoot. She took out a tape measure and measured various points from my hip bones to bones in my legs and ankles, and my right leg is no longer shorter, if it indeed ever was. I then ripped off those strange left orthotic 1/8" lifts and matched up each pair so that they were the same height. Throughout all of the physical activity of the last month, my back and hips held up extremely well, not much pain at all. No wonder -- for god knows how many years, depending on which pair of shoes I was wearing, I was raising either my left or right side -- no wonder my hips and lower back were always out of whack and refused to stay in place after repeated adjustments by my chiropractor! I also bought a good sturdy pair of low-cut work shoes to wear instead of the beat up pair of sneakers that I've been wearing for years to do yardwork, they helped to provide a good stable platform for my feet, the effects of which rippled up through my body all the way to my neck. Near the middle of last week my body and stamina finally gave out and I crashed pretty hard (I'm fully recovered as of today), so I'm still not ready to return to work fulltime, but it's apparent that my health has improved tremendously since I started a new drug therapy 3 months ago, I used to only be able to go full bore for a 2-3 days before I crashed. Now the really interesting part: have you ever faced a problem that you worked on for weeks (or months) on end and still couldn't find the solution so you gave up trying, then later came back to try again and this time, brain refreshed, you solved the problem rather easily? Well here's my HAH! During my "down time" last week I decided to revisit my computer problems. After doing some more research, attacking from a different angle this time, I've managed to fix ALL of my problems in just 4 days! Office 2003 is back and working fine, I can now download and install Windows updates, and all the other niggling issues are gone too. I won't go into the gory details of how I fixed everything, but I will mention the primary two methods of how I did it -- I downloaded and tried multiple "Uninstall" applications until I found the ones I needed (had to pay for one, used the trial periods for the others) and managed to unsinstall all but two of the problematic apps and updates that were causing my problems, using "forced" unistall at times (bypassing Vista's uninstall method by brute force). The second trick was using several apps simultaneously -- RegScanner, RegEdit, and Scannow. I ran Scannow to find the two remaining problematic registry entries, cut the entry names from the sfcdetails text file, pasted them into the RegScanner search window, which found every reg entry for that item, then I used RegEdit to delete the registry entries. Throughout the entire "cleaning up" process I was careful to make reg backups and restore points after fixing each problem. A simple failed and/or corrupted OESpamfilter-DAT update from several months ago turned out to be the cause of my inability do download and install any new Windows updates (I unsinstalled all of the hotfixes on my machine too). In summary, I now believe what Mike Easter and some others have been saying forever -- most, if not all, "Registry Cleaners" cannot do much more than cleanup empty or invalid registry keys from old uninstalled programs -- they can't actually solve any serious registry problems. It takes the correct approach, some grunt work, and a few simple/proper tools to fix things, at least the problems that were bedeviling me. BTW, while doing my research online, I discovered that I was not the only person on earth to have my computer screwed up by that exact same spamfilter update, there were plenty of screams for help out there on various websites for that issue. So you can't blame that one on me CHARLES :-P Now that my computer is back in proper working order, I plan on following one of the useful suggestions I got in .geeks -- get a bigger external HD so I can backup or image my entire C drive so if anything bad happens again I can easily recover from it. My HP Pavilion has a slot for a Pocket Media Drive, and I found a 320 GB drive for $99 online. I'm only using 137 GB of my 500 GB hard drive right now, so I can easily backup everything on that 320 GB drive without having to add another peripheral to my already too cluttered office desk and shelves. From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 15 16:51:53 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Aug 15 16:55:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: New quote References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C68A5800FC7TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : House? No house. House? No house. House? No house. Etc. : : Anyway, sort of looking at 1/2 modular now. The salesman is very pushy! : The price is a lot closer to what we want to pay. The quality seems very : high. It seems high because it's only 1/2 modular - it's only the shell : that gets done in a factory. And they'll use as much insulation as I like : and give me whatever I want. Wood floors, 14x4 butcher block island, : whatever. Kind of crazy, really. Makes my head spin. And I just want a : beer. Good option. I've a friend in NC that did that. His only problem was the interface between the plumbing (copper) and what the local code permitted which resulted in a bit of electrolysis. Put non conducting spacers in the line and problem solved. He also went with a heap pump (much cheaper even in the mountains). He had the HVAC contractor design it with an inline (H2O) heat exchanger with the intent of adding a buried source/sump for geo thermal. In the end he cut his heat/AC bills to a fraction of his old house. He also had his waste water plumed for a gray water system (currently illegal in NC) but since his design requires only the replacement of a PVC pipe and a valve he's good to go when the law changes. Still good to go if no one is looking. From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 15 16:53:57 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Aug 15 16:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Someone finally had the balls to say it out loud.. References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h66jop$p2t$1@news.spamcop.net... : bar0 wrote: : : > I don;t find Newt to be such a : > heavyweight either. : : Are you referring to Newt's Center for Health Transformation or some : other source of commentary? : : http://www.healthtransformation.net/ The Center for Health : Transformation is a high-impact collaboration of private and public : sector leaders committed to creating a 21st Century Intelligent Health : System that saves lives and saves money for all Americans. : To my understanding if the system is proprietary it's not going to fair well. OTOH opens source has promise. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 15 17:44:44 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 15 17:45:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h5snjl$5qn$2@news.spamcop.net... > BTW when GWB was gov of Texas he signed (and to my memory) promoted a > bill > that would allow hospitals to stop treatment to chronically ill (aka > terminally ill) patients. Want to guess who got to make the > determination? > ( A program brought to you by the medical industrial complex, a wholly > owned > subsidiary of the military industrial complex) > > So much for 'kill your grandma' as a Democratic idea. > > Anyone with access to HBO should watch last night's Bill Maher show -- they had an excellent discussion on Obama's health care plan, other country's health care plans, and how this "kill your grandma" thing is total BS. Believe it or not, the most knowledgeable and seemingly most informed guy on the panel was Ashton Kutcher, of all people......I always thought he was a lunkhead, I guess based on the roles I've seen him play in TV and movies, but that dude is actually pretty damn intelligent! From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 15 17:53:02 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 15 17:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: 50 ways to lose your lunch In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h64j2p$r25$1@news.spamcop.net... > http://www.rdmag.com/News/2009/08/Software-New-movie-theater-puts-viewers-in-immersive-dome/ > > I swear that I saw that exact same thing at the 1980 World's Fair held in Nashville (IIRC). They also had a 3-panel IMAX theater there, I got so dizzy and disoriented from the experience and the weird (on purpose) clips they were showing that I could barely walk out of the theater (way before the movie was over!). From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 15 17:55:05 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 15 18:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C68A4CCCE248TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "indigo" ! > >> BTW, while doing my research online, I discovered that I was not the only >> person on earth to have my computer screwed up by that exact same >> spamfilter update[...] So you can't blame that one on me CHARLES :-P > > Of course I can. Because you installed the screwy software that had a > screwy update. Hello. Sheesh. What are you talking about? The spamfilter is a built-in part of Windows Mail, the email app that ships with Vista. I had nothing to do with it. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 15 17:58:33 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 15 18:00:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: New quote In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C68A5800FC7TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > House? No house. House? No house. House? No house. Etc. > > Anyway, sort of looking at 1/2 modular now. The salesman is very pushy! > The price is a lot closer to what we want to pay. The quality seems very > high. It seems high because it's only 1/2 modular - it's only the shell > that gets done in a factory. And they'll use as much insulation as I like > and give me whatever I want. Wood floors, 14x4 butcher block island, > whatever. Kind of crazy, really. Makes my head spin. And I just want a > beer. Too bad it's only half modular -- they make great houses using factory built modules. I live in one. Most of the nearly 400 houses in my neighborhood are modular, only the last 20 or so were stick built. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 15 18:04:03 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 15 18:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h60665$mgb$2@news.spamcop.net... > Dallas has a monopoly toll system and they are jumping fees right and > left. > Last jump caused a drop in usage, so the mental giants decided to raise > rates to make up the difference. Opps net income went down... again. > They're doing the same thing to a portion of I-95 north of Baltimore, creating toll lanes. I, along with many others, are EXTREMELY PISSED OFF about the plan, because they are taking existing lanes already built with MY tax money and making me pay AGAIN to use them. They're being called "Lexus Lanes", because only the rich will be willing to pay the cost of using them to get to wherever faster, of course unless you get stuck behind some older folks driving 55, forming a rolling roadblock..... From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 15 18:18:43 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 15 18:20:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Bill" wrote in message news:h63quv$1d4$1@news.spamcop.net... > Pros: > 1. About 250,000 new cars were sold. > These vehicles will be "out of the market" now which means several things. > 1. auto part manufacturers will have less of a demand for their products > 2. auto parts stores like auto-zone, pep boys and such will have a > reduction in the amount of sales C'mon now.....taking a measly 250,000 cars off the market out of the nearly 125 million cars on the road today (number does not even include any kind of truck or SUV) is such a tiny dent nobody will even notice it. I see the "cash for clunkers" plan as a jobs/economic stimulus bill in disguise and not much more than that. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 15 18:30:09 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 15 18:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h61322$8ge$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Video: Dean Kamen Unplugged > > Segway inventor Dean Kamen has taken his private island off the grid. He > has > replaced every lightbulb on the island with an LED as part of a larger > effort to popularize zero-net-energy living. At least he was smart enough to use LEDs instead of the POS fluorescent "replacement" bulbs being pushed these days. I tried them, and they do NOT put out the amount of light (in lumens) that the box label claims. I replaced a 100 w incandescant with one of those things, both boxes claimed the same light output, but the difference in actual light output was so noticeable it wasn't even funny. They claim things like "same ouput of a 100 w light bulb but only consumes 33 w" or something similar. From my experience, the output was closer to that of a 50-60 w or so regular bulb. LEDs on the other hand, also do not produce waste heat, and they're bright as hell. Only problem with them is they put out a light that is almost entirely at the "white" wavelength (well, in reality, unless it's a mixture of LEDs, it IS only one wavelength), so the colors of things in your house show up differently. I wonder if he uses some kind of coating or filter on his indoor lights to make them put out light more closely resembling sunlight? From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 15 18:29:52 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Aug 15 18:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: 50 ways to lose your lunch References: Message-ID: "indigo" : > http://www.rdmag.com/News/2009/08/Software-New-movie-theater-puts-viewers-in-immersive-dome/ : > : > : : I swear that I saw that exact same thing at the 1980 World's Fair held in : Nashville (IIRC). They also had a 3-panel IMAX theater there, I got so dizzy : and disoriented from the experience and the weird (on purpose) clips they : were showing that I could barely walk out of the theater (way before the : movie was over!). IMAX is good but I understand this is way past that. My grand daughter went to the IMAX at the age of FIVE and come out wanting more. I've taken her to various amusement parks and I'm the one that turns green. Her dad and aunt are fearless (never feel the effect of motion sickness) and even then the kid can out last them. Rock walls and real rock mountain sides she scales like a scaled ape. She saw something on the TV the other day with the various demo flying teams Blue Angles etc. and is ready NOW! to enlist. I've a friend with a two seat Pitts special (that I will not mention in her presence) at least until both mom and dad are on board with her flying. Likely have to wait a bit until she's big enough to wear a 'chute without slipping out of the harness. Right now she's keen on barrel racing. From MikeE at ster.invalid Sat Aug 15 22:04:25 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sat Aug 15 22:05:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > And, obviously, I've now had that beer. Ahem. Did you have one of those ice things? That seems like a bad idea to me. I think I would focus on a taste/flavor/body that was consistently appealing. OTOH, I've currently shifted over to a big glass of wine, chardonnay out of a box for the next little while if that matters. Not really /big/ like an ice tea glass, probably only about 10 oz of so with a normal cylindrical configuration and a hexagonal base. I have no use for things/glasses with stems. That effect on the center of gravity and dynamic instability has no place in the company of people who are drinking and progressively impairing their cerebellar functions. Give me a nice steady glass with a base which is unlikely to tip over. I used to drink wine out of a glass with a short stem; but then I decided that if you were into getting rid of the stem disadvantages, you might as well get rid of the whole damn thing. Who came up with that crazy idea anyway? -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From Unknown.User at Invalid.Domain Sat Aug 15 22:11:23 2009 From: Unknown.User at Invalid.Domain (Jan M. Nelken) Date: Sat Aug 15 22:15:07 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > What are you talking about? The spamfilter is a built-in part of Windows > Mail, the email app that ships with Vista. I had nothing to do with it. What are *you* talking about?? You installed Windows - that was first mistake. You decided to use Windows Mail - that was second mistake. Think for a moment: All ATM traffic - all credit card checks - runs bilions of bilions transactions a minute worldwide - yet there is no single virus known to mankind even trying to attack those machines. Ditch Windows, install z/OS on z/900 machine - and you will be safe. But check the hardware price first before ordering :-) Jan M.Nelken From joegill at removethis Sat Aug 15 22:56:34 2009 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Sat Aug 15 23:00:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: New quote In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C68DDC6A7133TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! > >> He also went with a heap pump (much cheaper even in the mountains). >> He had the HVAC contractor design it with an inline (H2O) heat >> exchanger with the intent of adding a buried source/sump for geo >> thermal. In the end he cut his heat/AC bills to a fraction of his old >> house. > > I had a quote on a heat pump. $37k. But you can get up to 1/3 of that > back in incentives and bla bla bla. The problem is that it can never > repay > itself. If I have a superinsulated house, heating should be under $1k a > year. So, payback on $20+k is 20+ years. Not a good plan. Smart reasoning..... I'm glad you are not 'green for the sake of green'.... Green must be cheaper or it won't be adopted!! From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 15 22:58:44 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Aug 15 23:05:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: New quote References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C68DDC6A7133TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! : : > He also went with a heap pump (much cheaper even in the mountains). : > He had the HVAC contractor design it with an inline (H2O) heat : > exchanger with the intent of adding a buried source/sump for geo : > thermal. In the end he cut his heat/AC bills to a fraction of his old : > house. : : I had a quote on a heat pump. $37k. But you can get up to 1/3 of that : back in incentives and bla bla bla. The problem is that it can never repay : itself. If I have a superinsulated house, heating should be under $1k a : year. So, payback on $20+k is 20+ years. Not a good plan. Seems a bit steep to me especially since this is a super insulated house. From dfmanno at mail.com Sat Aug 15 23:39:57 2009 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Sat Aug 15 23:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: In article , "indigo" wrote: > Believe it or not, the most knowledgeable and seemingly most informed guy on > the panel was Ashton Kutcher, of all people......I always thought he was a > lunkhead, I guess based on the roles I've seen him play in TV and movies, > but that dude is actually pretty damn intelligent! Well, the anti-reform wingnuts are not exactly a collection of Stephen Hawkings. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com "Faith is a cop-out. If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits." (Dan Barker) From MikeE at ster.invalid Sun Aug 16 00:11:40 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sun Aug 16 00:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: D.F. Manno wrote: > "indigo" >> Believe it or not, the most knowledgeable and seemingly most informed >> guy on the panel was Ashton Kutcher, of all people > Well, the anti-reform wingnuts are not exactly a collection of Stephen > Hawkings. It doesn't take any kind of mental giant to see how many things are wrong with the proposed health care reform package. Not the imaginary one that Obama is and has been hyping; the actual one that is cooking in Congress. The current health care situation is a wasteful inadequate disaster. The oncoming result of the attempted remediation of that disaster to be a much much bigger disaster is huge and impending - likely inevitable. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Aug 16 00:30:38 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sun Aug 16 00:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h680tl$cit$1@news.spamcop.net... > It doesn't take any kind of mental giant to see how many things are > wrong with the proposed health care reform package. Not the imaginary > one that Obama is and has been hyping; the actual one that is cooking > in Congress. > > The current health care situation is a wasteful inadequate disaster. > The oncoming result of the attempted remediation of that disaster to be > a much much bigger disaster is huge and impending - likely inevitable. The insurance lobby is very strong and has been very well taken care of by the past administrations. As long as there is profit to be made in healthcare, at the expense of patients, there will be no fair 'healthcare for all' at a decent price. I shudder to think how this will all play out, I am sure far far away from the "imaginary" plan. From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Aug 16 00:31:19 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sun Aug 16 00:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: New quote References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C68A5800FC7TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > House? No house. House? No house. House? No house. Etc. > > Anyway, sort of looking at 1/2 modular now. The salesman is very pushy! > The price is a lot closer to what we want to pay. The quality seems very > high. It seems high because it's only 1/2 modular - it's only the shell > that gets done in a factory. And they'll use as much insulation as I like > and give me whatever I want. Wood floors, 14x4 butcher block island, > whatever. Kind of crazy, really. Makes my head spin. And I just want a > beer. What company is this? From avoozl at spamcop.net Sun Aug 16 01:59:32 2009 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Sun Aug 16 02:00:06 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: New quote References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h67b2c$ush$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Too bad it's only half modular -- they make great houses using factory > built modules. I live in one. Most of the nearly 400 houses in my > neighborhood are modular, only the last 20 or so were stick built. Except for the water heaters. Ahem. From avoozl at spamcop.net Sun Aug 16 02:02:00 2009 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Sun Aug 16 02:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:h6821f$h4o$1@news.spamcop.net... > The insurance lobby is very strong and has been very well taken care of by > the past administrations. As long as there is profit to be made in > healthcare, at the expense of patients, there will be no fair 'healthcare > for all' at a decent price. I shudder to think how this will all play > out, I am sure far far away from the "imaginary" plan. > If there's no profit to be had most of the businesses will find some other method.. From me at privacy.net Sun Aug 16 02:33:42 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sun Aug 16 02:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) References: Message-ID: "indigo" : > Video: Dean Kamen Unplugged : > : > Segway inventor Dean Kamen has taken his private island off the grid. He : > has replaced every lightbulb on the island with an LED as part of a larger : > effort to popularize zero-net-energy living. : : At least he was smart enough to use LEDs instead of the POS fluorescent : "replacement" bulbs being pushed these days. I tried them, and they do NOT : put out the amount of light (in lumens) that the box label claims. I : replaced a 100 w incandescant with one of those things, both boxes claimed : the same light output, but the difference in actual light output was so : noticeable it wasn't even funny. They claim things like "same ouput of a 100 w light bulb but only consumes 33 w" or something similar. From my : experience, the output was closer to that of a 50-60 w or so regular bulb. : : LEDs on the other hand, also do not produce waste heat, and they're bright : as hell. Only problem with them is they put out a light that is almost : entirely at the "white" wavelength (well, in reality, unless it's a mixture of LEDs, it IS only one wavelength), so the colors of things in your house : show up differently. I wonder if he uses some kind of coating or filter on : his indoor lights to make them put out light more closely resembling : sunlight? : The blue light-emitting diode, arguably the greatest optoelectronic advance of the past 25 years, harbors a dark secret: Crank up the current and its efficiencies will plummet. The problem is known as droop, and it’s not only puzzling the brightest minds in the field, it’s also threatening the future of the electric lighting industry. http://spectrum.ieee.org/semiconductors/optoelectronics/the-leds-dark-secret I've the orginal articl and can send you or anyone a copy. From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Aug 16 10:13:17 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sun Aug 16 10:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? Message-ID: I know someone whose brother was paralyzed for months from that vaccine, it seems like nothing has changed. They're willing to push this untested vaccine on people why, for the money? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1206807/Swine-flu-jab-link-killer-nerve-disease-Leaked-letter-reveals-concern-neurologists-25-deaths-America.html From me at privacy.net Sun Aug 16 14:45:17 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sun Aug 16 14:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:h6945v$vs0$1@news.spamcop.net... :I know someone whose brother was paralyzed for months from that vaccine, it : seems like nothing has changed. They're willing to push this untested : vaccine on people why, for the money? : http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1206807/Swine-flu-jab-link-killer-nerve-disease-Leaked-letter-reveals-concern-neurologists-25-deaths-America.html You referring to 1918? 1965? or somewhere between? From gezgin at spamcop.net.which.is.not.invalid Sun Aug 16 14:59:56 2009 From: gezgin at spamcop.net.which.is.not.invalid (Gezgin) Date: Sun Aug 16 15:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Need a *real* .mov file Message-ID: Can someone give me a link to a real .mov (QuickTime) file, please? I need to test something. (All of the ".mov" videos I've been able to Google turn out to be really .flv.) TIA -- Bob http://www.kanyak.com From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Aug 16 15:57:07 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sun Aug 16 16:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Oh boy! Hurricanes! Message-ID: The oil industry loves a good storm, all that price gouging whether it's warranted or not.... bets, anyone? http://www.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idUSTRE57F1PN20090816 From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Aug 16 16:01:55 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sun Aug 16 16:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h69k3n$2r3$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Heidi" wrote in message > news:h6945v$vs0$1@news.spamcop.net... > :I know someone whose brother was paralyzed for months from that vaccine, > it > : seems like nothing has changed. They're willing to push this untested > : vaccine on people why, for the money? > : > http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1206807/Swine-flu-jab-link-killer-nerve-disease-Leaked-letter-reveals-concern-neurologists-25-deaths-America.html > > You referring to 1918? 1965? or somewhere between? 1976 http://healthandsurvival.com/2009/04/26/swine-flu-vaccine-of-1976-more-harm-than-good/ http://www.semp.us/publications/biot_reader.php?BiotID=177 hen, on November 21, 1976, a “Minnesota physician reported to his local health authorities a patient who had contracted an ascending paralysis, called Guillain-Barré syndrome, following swine flu immunization. The physician said he had just learned of this possible side-effect from a cassette-tape discussion of flu vaccination prepared for the continuing education of family practitioners by a California specialist. The Minnesota immunization program officer, Denton R. Peterson, dutifully called CDC and spoke to one of the surveillance physicians there. The latter expressed no interest in the single case, but Peterson was sufficiently bothered to conduct a literature search and did indeed discover previous case reports. “We felt we were sitting on a bomb,” he told investigators. Within a week three more cases, one fatal were reported to Peterson. Two came from a single neurologist who remarked that he had observed this complication of flu vaccine during his residency training. More anxious than ever, Peterson again called the CDC, where the surveillance center was just being told by phone of three more cases in Alabama. The next day they learned of an additional case in New Jersey. By then the CDC was taking the problem seriously.” (** pp. 24-25) Still, Sender was not impressed. The federal government abruptly suspended the NIIP pending analysis of Guillain-Barré cases emerging in the vaccinated population. Eventually, 532 cases of vaccine-related Guillain-Barré syndrome and at least 25 deaths occurred. One CDC official recalled that he had expected side effects upon the nervous system of some vaccinees, but he had no notion on what scale. No one expected a high frequency and no one then explored the policy implications, particularly in the absence of pandemic, which indeed turned out to be exactly the case. CDC research showed that the actual risk for Guillain-Barré was only about 1 in 1,000 among people who had received the vaccine, which was about seven times higher than for people who did not receive the vaccine.* From me at privacy.net Sun Aug 16 16:12:13 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sun Aug 16 16:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Oh boy! Hurricanes! References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:h69oak$qmn$1@news.spamcop.net... : The oil industry loves a good storm, all that price gouging whether it's : warranted or not.... bets, anyone? : http://www.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idUSTRE57F1PN20090816 There's a rumor that the oil industry employs meteorologist in an effort to figure how to start hurricanes. Could be some truth to the rumor as global warming has been blamed for the increased frequency and intensity of hurricanes. There have been more than a few sightings of oil company managers and execs outside of Pat O'Brien's with powerful elixcers on their persons. From MikeE at ster.invalid Sun Aug 16 17:13:40 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sun Aug 16 17:15:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > CDC research > showed that the actual risk for Guillain-Barr? was only about 1 in > 1,000 among people who had received the vaccine, which was about seven > times higher than for people who did not receive the vaccine. Unrelated to vaccination, but related to the same complication from ordinary flu, Andy Griffith had GBS in 1983. It took him a year to recover. He wasn't that big a star at the time, so by the time he was ready to work again, he was broke and didn't really have any job prospects. http://snipr.com/q9yj2 Journey To Health - by Andy Griffith GBS is a bad condition/complication, but the great majority eventually recover completely. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Aug 16 19:16:36 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sun Aug 16 19:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h69sq3$hhi$1@news.spamcop.net... > > GBS is a bad condition/complication, but the great majority eventually > recover completely. > One story said that some of those affected by the first vaccine never recovered and still wear braces to walk - that's certainly not a risk I'm willing to take, especially since I have an autoimmune disease already. I shouldn't be but I am shocked that the FDA would push the vaccine out without adequate trials, it'd be one thing if the drug companies were doing it as a nonprofit, but since they will be the ones raking in billions, well, doesn't look like they have my best interest at heart, does it? Look at the stats: "Drug companies in several countries are in an advanced stage of developing a H1N1 influenza vaccine to check the swine flu pandemic which has swept across over 160 countries, affecting over 1.5 million (confirmed cases; actual number may be far higher) and killing nearly 1,000 persons. In India, too, over two dozen people have lost their lives due to swine flu in recent weeks, in different cities." 1.5 million people , and only 1000 deaths? 24 people in the whole country of India? For this we put our kids at risk with an untested vaccine? From user at domain.invalid Sun Aug 16 23:44:44 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Sun Aug 16 23:45:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > "Frog Prince" wrote in message > news:h69k3n$2r3$1@news.spamcop.net... >> >> You referring to 1918? 1965? or somewhere between? > > 1976 > http://healthandsurvival.com/2009/04/26/swine-flu-vaccine-of-1976-more-harm-than-good/ > http://www.semp.us/publications/biot_reader.php?BiotID=177 > Well, the truth is out there somewhere - but the 'link' between the 1976 vaccines and those being developed in 2009 is not in evidence anywhere. Trials of an H1N1 vaccine in Australia began weeks ago (children first priority because they are greatly at risk from the current, pandemic, strain). These are gradated trials we are told, starting at 'understrength' and working up. This is one of several vaccines under development but there's not a lot of information to be found. Fact - pregnant women are grossly (no pun) over-represented amongst those in our intensive care units with this disease - part and parcel of the difference between this disease and previous swine 'flu epidemics. H1N1 is said to the the 'dominant' strain now, in the current Australian influenza season. The anti-viral Tamiflu is routinely given to pregnant women presenting with 'flu symptoms because of that risk that a small proportion of them might otherwise progress to a critical illness - even though there has been insufficient trialling with pregnant women (it's all about the professional assessment of *relative* risk). Thankfully there have been no disasters yet but it will be a while yet before anyone can be totally sure (my youngest son's partner is one so treated). It was always know that a vaccine could never be developed in time for the southern 'flu season - but they should be available later this month. Meantime, the season is ramping up 'nicely' - http://www9.health.gov.au/cda/Source/Rpt_1_sel_A.cfm see Influenza (laboratory confirmed) under "Vaccine preventable diseases" - yes, a nice little irony. Whatever happens, we in the southern hemisphere will have been your 'lab rats'. So far, we have seen the progressive failure of laboratory verification to keep up with the mounting pressure for diagnosis, the disproportionate risk to the pregnant (a small, but very noticeable and worrisome incidence) and the failure/porousness of all quarantine measures - it would need a far more disciplined approach to work effectively than any our population would support (and with all due respect, that goes double for the USA). Tamiflu stocks are (sort of) holding up but Tamiflu is just a stop-gap measure until effective vaccines are confirmed, produced, distributed and administered. That is likely to be too late for us but, so far, there is little/no evidence that H1N1 in its present form is unusually lethal, not in the whole of the population, it 'just' has an unlikely and heart-breaking demographic in its lethality. Yes, by the time it comes again to the northern hemisphere it may well have mutated some more (influenza is famous for that capability, yes?). But hopefully any vaccines will retain enough efficacy to be of use (they usually do in such a short term). [/soapbox]I am always amazed at the continuing/continual FUD concerning vaccinations. No doubt the human capacity for endless agonizing serves a very useful purpose in terms of the survival of the species and, certainly, 'the big picture' doesn't mean much when it gets personal. But these 'debates' have been going on, with increasing vehemence, for well over a century. Perhaps the greatest risk to public health remains the 'infectable' pool of those who refuse professionally-mandated vaccinations. A defining characteristic of the information age might well be the growing gap between opinion and knowledge.[/soapbox] From gezgin at spamcop.net.which.is.not.invalid Mon Aug 17 00:21:58 2009 From: gezgin at spamcop.net.which.is.not.invalid (Gezgin) Date: Mon Aug 17 00:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Need a *real* .mov file References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C69AC39329B7TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... >> Can someone give me a link to a real .mov (QuickTime) file, please? > Anything on http://www.apple.com/trailers. For example, first link sends > us to: > http://movies.apple.com/movies/paramount_vantage/thegoods/thegoods-tvspot_h.320.mov Thanks for the reply however apple.com was the first place I looked. The links there all seem to download a small (50-150 byte) file of type "3ivx.mov", which is not the actual video data but looks like it may be instructions telling QuickTime what to do to get the video data. What I need to conduct my test is a .mov file that is complete, including the video data. -- Bob http://www.kanyak.com From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Mon Aug 17 00:22:13 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Mon Aug 17 00:25:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Farelf wrote: > > [/soapbox]I am always amazed at the continuing/continual FUD concerning > ... > well be the growing gap between opinion and knowledge.[/soapbox] BEGIN {pedantic soapbox} Parsing your markup language, it would appear that you are saying 'unquote' some quote, then 'unquote' again without actually starting the quote. END {pedantic soapbox} From user at domain.invalid Mon Aug 17 00:41:23 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Mon Aug 17 00:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mr K Mean wrote: > Farelf wrote: >> >> [/soapbox]I am always amazed at the continuing/continual FUD concerning > > ... >> well be the growing gap between opinion and knowledge.[/soapbox] > > BEGIN {pedantic soapbox} > Parsing your markup language, it would appear that you are saying > 'unquote' some quote, then 'unquote' again without actually starting the > quote. > END {pedantic soapbox} I really have to get a handle on this tagging thing :) [soapbox][/soapbox] - theres a null content one (perhaps the best kind of soapbox) in contrition. From gezgin at spamcop.net.which.is.not.invalid Mon Aug 17 01:50:55 2009 From: gezgin at spamcop.net.which.is.not.invalid (Gezgin) Date: Mon Aug 17 01:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Need a *real* .mov file References: Message-ID: Never mind. I found what I need with Binsearch and ".mov". -- Bob, who can now convert .mov files without QuickTime on his system. http://www.kanyak.com "Gezgin" wrote in message news:h6alt8$ogk$1@news.spamcop.net... > Thanks for the reply however apple.com was the first place I looked. The > links there all seem to download a small (50-150 byte) file of type > "3ivx.mov", which is not the actual video data but looks like it may be > instructions telling QuickTime what to do to get the video data. What I > need to conduct my test is a .mov file that is complete, including the > video data. From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 17 08:23:48 2009 From: me at privacy.net (magus kent) Date: Mon Aug 17 08:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in news:h6945v$vs0$1@news.spamcop.net: > I know someone whose brother was paralyzed for months from that > vaccine, it seems like nothing has changed. They're willing to push > this untested vaccine on people why, for the money? > http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1206807/Swine-flu-jab-link-kill > er-nerve-disease-Leaked-letter-reveals-concern-neurologists-25-deaths-A > merica.html > > I was in the military at the time. They own you and you know it. Got the shot. Spent the weekend on the couch, too weak to do anything, including moving, talking or staying awake. If I recall probably 25% of my fellow guinea pigs had about the same symptoms. From MikeE at ster.invalid Mon Aug 17 12:16:47 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Mon Aug 17 12:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: Let me see... "All vaccinations are good." No, that's not right. "All vaccinations are bad." No, that's not right either. "All vaccinations are necessary." No. "No vaccinations are necessary." No. "Some vaccinations have health risks." OK. "Some vaccinations have health advantages." OK. Any anti-vaccinator needs to figger out where they are on such questions; any pro-vaccinator needs to figger out where /they/ are. Yesterday's vaccines are not the same as today's vaccines. In many/most cases anti-vaccinators get a free ride on the back of the vaccinated. Vaccinations lead to herd immunity which protect the anti- people who didn't have to bother getting vaccinated. Somehow it doesn't seem quite fair, but it is often better that the herd's intelligence/decisions and planning be better than those of the anti-vaccinator. The CDC and WHO make mistakes. The vaccine devlopers make mistakes. So what else is new? -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 12:55:10 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Mon Aug 17 13:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C68DE020A114TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "indigo" ! > >> What are you talking about? The spamfilter is a built-in part of >> Windows Mail, the email app that ships with Vista. I had nothing to do >> with it. > > Oh, no way I'm falling for that. Windows broke windows? Come now! > Microsoft is the best and most consumer-friendly company on the planet! > And, obviously, I've now had that beer. Ahem. So how about a few props now? Geesh....I thought I accomplished something pretty damn amazing, bringing my PC back from the dead all on my own.....not that I wanted any compliments, but a simple "congrats!" would have been nice.... I was a little ahead of myself in my pronouncement anyway, as it turns out. A Saturdary re-run of scannow found one final spamfilter reg entry I had missed, scannow gives me a clean bill of health now. I also ordered that 320 GB pocket drive Saturday, should have it by the end of this week. Since you despise M$ products so much, any suggestions for a better backup app than theirs? One thing I dislike about M$ backup is that you can't easily see what files are stored in the backup .BKF file. I have the free version of Magic ISO installled, it's limited to 300 GB images, but that's fine since I'm only using ~ 140 GB of my HD. I think "Ghost" is a pay to use app? I also have "SyncBack" installed, it's free and unlimited, but IIRC doesn't compress files, not that that really matters to me. I never set it back up after my system restore months ago, maybe I'll take another look at that. It can run automatically on a schedule and is pretty fast. One last question: I have defrag set up to run every Friday night -- I assume that I DON'T want defrag running when I try to do a backup lest disaster happen -- correct assumption? From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 17 13:25:53 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 17 13:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Ahhh...dating.... Message-ID: So had practically a dream date on Saturday. Cute, funny, have tons of things in common, didn't stop conversing for hours. Love at first sight, it seems. Now the hard part, forcing myself to not rush too fast...gotta wait until Wednesday to call her so I don't appear overbearing. Ugh... From MikeE at ster.invalid Mon Aug 17 14:00:23 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Mon Aug 17 14:05:17 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > So had practically a dream date on Saturday. Cute, funny, have tons of > things in common, didn't stop conversing for hours. Love at first > sight, it seems. Now the hard part, forcing myself to not rush too > fast...gotta wait until Wednesday to call her so I don't appear > overbearing. Ugh... That doesn't make any sense to me. I think that if I had talked to someone for hours, I would already know -1- how soon we both wanted to be getting back together again -2- that I needn't be feeling one way and acting another toward them -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 17 15:22:16 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 17 15:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mike Easter wrote: > Borgholio wrote: >> So had practically a dream date on Saturday. Cute, funny, have tons > of >> things in common, didn't stop conversing for hours. Love at first >> sight, it seems. Now the hard part, forcing myself to not rush too >> fast...gotta wait until Wednesday to call her so I don't appear >> overbearing. Ugh... > > That doesn't make any sense to me. > > I think that if I had talked to someone for hours, I would already > know -1- how soon we both wanted to be getting back together again -2- > that I needn't be feeling one way and acting another toward them > Well in the past I've had issues with trying to move too fast, getting ahead of myself, etc...so I'm working to avoid that by not bombarding her with emails and phone calls. From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 17 15:55:19 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 17 15:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6cal6$csv$2@news.spamcop.net... : Mike Easter wrote: : > Borgholio wrote: : >> So had practically a dream date on Saturday. Cute, funny, have tons : > of things in common, didn't stop conversing for hours. Love at first : >> sight, it seems. Now the hard part, forcing myself to not rush too : >> fast...gotta wait until Wednesday to call her so I don't appear : >> overbearing. Ugh... : > : > That doesn't make any sense to me. : > : > I think that if I had talked to someone for hours, I would already : > know -1- how soon we both wanted to be getting back together again -2- : > that I needn't be feeling one way and acting another toward them : > : : Well in the past I've had issues with trying to move too fast, getting : ahead of myself, etc...so I'm working to avoid that by not bombarding her : with emails and phone calls. Send a single rose, or a $3 wind up toy ... no note except your name. Be careful! I did (way back when, in response to a blind date) and wound up married. From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 17 16:32:39 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 17 16:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6cal6$csv$2@news.spamcop.net... > : Mike Easter wrote: > : > Borgholio wrote: > : >> So had practically a dream date on Saturday. Cute, funny, have tons > : > of things in common, didn't stop conversing for hours. Love at first > : >> sight, it seems. Now the hard part, forcing myself to not rush too > : >> fast...gotta wait until Wednesday to call her so I don't appear > : >> overbearing. Ugh... > : > > : > That doesn't make any sense to me. > : > > : > I think that if I had talked to someone for hours, I would already > : > know -1- how soon we both wanted to be getting back together again -2- > : > that I needn't be feeling one way and acting another toward them > : > > : > : Well in the past I've had issues with trying to move too fast, getting > : ahead of myself, etc...so I'm working to avoid that by not bombarding her > : with emails and phone calls. > > Send a single rose, or a $3 wind up toy ... no note except your name. > > Be careful! I did (way back when, in response to a blind date) and wound up > married. > > > > Oh I plan on calling her on Wednesday and surprising her with a home-grown orange rose on our second date. :) From kenbrody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 17:38:04 2009 From: kenbrody at spamcop.net (Kenneth Brody) Date: Mon Aug 17 17:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: [...] > Well in the past I've had issues with trying to move too fast, getting > ahead of myself, etc...so I'm working to avoid that by not bombarding > her with emails and phone calls. So, basically you're walking the line between "interested" and "stalker"? :-) -- Kenneth Brody From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 17 18:01:49 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 17 18:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Kenneth Brody wrote: > Borgholio wrote: > [...] >> Well in the past I've had issues with trying to move too fast, getting >> ahead of myself, etc...so I'm working to avoid that by not bombarding >> her with emails and phone calls. > > So, basically you're walking the line between "interested" and > "stalker"? :-) > Exactly. :-P At the risk of sounding cliche, she's my dream girl...and I want to be careful about it. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 18:38:24 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Mon Aug 17 18:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Jan M. Nelken" wrote in message news:h67psb$bh2$1@news.spamcop.net... > indigo wrote: > >> What are you talking about? The spamfilter is a built-in part of Windows >> Mail, the email app that ships with Vista. I had nothing to do with it. > > What are *you* talking about?? > > You installed Windows - that was first mistake. > You decided to use Windows Mail - that was second mistake. Jesus. H......gimme a fscking break........ BTW, I kept my OpenOffice installation even after I got Office 2003 running again. All the *nix fanatics that claim that they are equivalent are full of bunk. OO Calc _sucks_ as far as ease of use compared to Excel, even after I learned how to use it over the better part of two months. It can't/won't even import a tab or space delimited text file, fer christ's sake! Insists on a CSV file or it automatically opens the OO Word equivalent instead. What a pita.... From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 18:44:22 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Mon Aug 17 18:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6A845F6DB43TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "indigo" ! > >> a simple "congrats!" would have been nice.... > > I'm glad that your computer is working again. > Thank you very much, and I am being quite sincere here. > >> Since you despise M$ products so much > > Hey! I did not say that! > Ok, is it fair to say that you despise some M$ apps? >> any suggestions for a better backup app than theirs? > > We use Acronis. Seems to work pretty well. I've recovered from disk > failures and OS mishaps without problems. > Sounds expensive..... >> One last question: I have defrag set up to run every Friday night -- I >> assume that I DON'T want defrag running when I try to do a backup lest >> disaster happen -- correct assumption? > > There shouldn't be a problem with soft disasters but it sounds like a way > to set up hard ones - you would be thrashing your hardware for no good > reason. Might as well have things run at different times. That's what I thought. Any way to figure out how long it actually takes for my defrag to run? I wonder if I can find that info in eventviewer..... if I have defrag set up to write a log for it......I'll go check. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 19:08:49 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Mon Aug 17 19:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h63vuj$11r$1@news.spamcop.net... > > In any case he ran a bar show based on physics where his close was > something > with the signature Hurricane. Some how super-cooled the mix Had a bottle of liquid nitrogen hidden under the bar? and had a bar > patron (usually a woman that was, basically, the life of the party) > 'plunk' > the container and the thing would freeze up, solid with a resounding, loud > CRACK. Dammit....I _used_ to remember the physics of how that trick worked.....now you make me want to go google it. Ain't got the time, my sump pump drainage system is still clogged somewhere, gotto go roto-root the front drain hose again, supposed to thunderstorm tomorrow. Speaking of which, last night I finished all the repairs of the drainage system at the far end of the house, where the sump pump discharge enters the downspout discharge underground in a T-fitting. Managed to poke a few new holes in the hose digging it all up, got them all patched up with a good silicone adhesive and Gorilla tape. Also removed and cleaned up the downspout-drain house fittings, replaced one of them, and glued and gorilla taped them all back together and re-installed them. You ever use Gorilla Tape? It makes duct tape look like Scotch tape in comparison as far as strength and adhesion goes. I know that the pressure in the underground hose at the front of the house is being relieved by water bursting out of the downspout/flex hose connection, which I kept unsealed for diagnostic purposes. After I dug up everything at the rear of the house I tried running water from a hose down the line while using the roto-rooter and the water just disappeared after coming back out of the buried line, which got stuck right where a big tree root is exposed in the flowerbed -- whether that huge root crushed the hose or not I'm not sure. The amazing (and horrifying) thing I discovered is that the previously sealed rear downspout/flex hose connection had dissipated the overpressurization in the line by hydraulically boring a hole from leaks in the underground T-fitting joints straight down to the bottom of the foundation (I think). As I widened the hole to find out how deep it went, I got stuck -- had a 2 ft long screwdriver in my hands, and my arm buried up to my armpit. So the hole was at least over 5-6 feet deep, around 1-2" diameter at it's deepest. It took an entire bag of pea gravel (packed it in the hole a little bit at a time to ensure any off-shoots got filled up too) and a 40 lb bag of topsoil to completely fill the hole from all of the erroded dirt that had disappeared (no wonder I found so much silt in my sump last year!). That end of the system is completely sealed up now, and hopefully I can find the still-existing clog so the hose doesn't rupture somewhere else -- if it busts thru all those layers of silicone sealer and gorilla tape I used on the rear section I got a serious problem! From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 19:14:51 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Mon Aug 17 19:15:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: 50 ways to lose your lunch In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h67ctl$7ts$1@news.spamcop.net... > My grand daughter went to the IMAX at the age of FIVE and come out wanting > more. I've taken her to various amusement parks and I'm the one that > turns > green. I've always had a problem with "turning green" and getting disoriented, especially by rotating amusement park rides. Docs and others say it's due to being deaf in my right ear -- my balance ain't so great either at times. I'd fail that DUI "walk the painted line by putting one foot in front of the other (heel to toe)" even if I were stone-cold sober -- I've tried to do it, and I can't. I also can't stand and tilt my head way back and touch my nose with my pointer finger -- I lose my balance. It really only bothers me in static or semi-static positions, as long as I'm moving unrestricted I'm fine. From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 17 20:02:36 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 17 20:10:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Don't know if this is true or not but it does bring up some interesting mental videos. References: Message-ID: "...according to Special Operations Command, [the Predator] still needs that essential finishing touch: the latest sound system. The command is setting out to correct this..." All this just so they can play "Ride of the Valkeries" as they zero in on the do-bads. http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2009/08/killer-drones-to-get-sound-system/ From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 17 20:19:57 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 17 20:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Don't know if this is true or not but it does bring up some interesting mental videos. References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6ACE5DDB921TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! : : > Don't know if this is true or not : : I hate phrases that start out that way. They typically mean that what : follows is complete and utter bullshit. I try to include something for everyone including those that cannot laugh. From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 17 20:31:27 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 17 20:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h6cnu3$uog$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : news:h63vuj$11r$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : > In any case he ran a bar show based on physics where his close was : > something with the signature Hurricane. Some how super-cooled the mix : : Had a bottle of liquid nitrogen hidden under the bar? Likely. There are a lot of neat things you can do with liquid gas. Had a neighbor in Louisiana that worked for Liquid Air. He'd drill a 15 to 20 foot 1 inch diameter hole in fire ant nest then pump it full of liquid gas. Kill'um dead but also left brown spots in the grass three feet wide. : and had a bar patron (usually a woman that was, basically, the life of the party) 'plunk' the container and the thing would freeze up, solid with a resounding, loud CRACK. : : Dammit....I _used_ to remember the physics of how that trick worked.....now you make me want to go google it. : : Simple keep EVERYTHING still, lower the temp gradually have someone tap the container at the most exciting moment and YOU'RE ON! From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 20:36:20 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Mon Aug 17 20:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6cal6$csv$2@news.spamcop.net... > > Well in the past I've had issues with trying to move too fast, getting > ahead of myself, etc...so I'm working to avoid that by not bombarding her > with emails and phone calls. There IS a happy medium, you know. Silence for three days is NOT a good plan. Just sayin'. From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 17 20:39:06 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 17 20:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6cal6$csv$2@news.spamcop.net... >> Well in the past I've had issues with trying to move too fast, getting >> ahead of myself, etc...so I'm working to avoid that by not bombarding her >> with emails and phone calls. > > There IS a happy medium, you know. Silence for three days is NOT a good > plan. Just sayin'. > > Well I sent her an email shortly after she left on Saturday thanking her for a great date, expressing hope to see her again...etc. I wanted to wait a couple days before calling her. Bad idea, you say? From avoozl at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 20:54:46 2009 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Mon Aug 17 20:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Great relationship book References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6ACF58A77ACTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > So, hey, has anyone seen "In July" yet? Borg would surely enjoy it. The > rest of youse are surely just fuddy-duddies with no sense of romance and > adventure. > > But anyway... While I'm not enjoying reading The Amateur Marriage I'm > sure > that it's having positive effects on mine. Prolly 'cause I don't want to > end up anything like the characters in the book. Bleh. > > And there you have it. How's the kid? From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 17 20:58:02 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 17 21:00:32 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Don't know if this is true or not but it does bring up some interesting mental videos. References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6AD47357380TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! : : > I try to include something for everyone including those that cannot : > laugh. : : Ah, so someone told you that I'd run into a tree, then, did they? It hurts : to smile, man, and laughing is way out of the question, for sure. And I'm : much less pretty than usual. I though you'd given up driving climbing tractors... From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 21:06:34 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Mon Aug 17 21:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h6c5rf$s0u$1@news.spamcop.net... > Borgholio wrote: >> So had practically a dream date on Saturday. Cute, funny, have tons > of >> things in common, didn't stop conversing for hours. Love at first >> sight, it seems. Now the hard part, forcing myself to not rush too >> fast...gotta wait until Wednesday to call her so I don't appear >> overbearing. Ugh... > > That doesn't make any sense to me. > > I think that if I had talked to someone for hours, I would already > know -1- how soon we both wanted to be getting back together again -2- > that I needn't be feeling one way and acting another toward them I agree. If he doesn't call soon(er) she may think that "magic" was just her imagination. I bet if he waits that she'll call him first -- something I sometimes do on purpose to see what the results are ;-) Damn, I need to find a g/f myself! From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 17 21:22:18 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 17 21:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > "Mike Easter" wrote in message > news:h6c5rf$s0u$1@news.spamcop.net... >> Borgholio wrote: >>> So had practically a dream date on Saturday. Cute, funny, have tons >> of >>> things in common, didn't stop conversing for hours. Love at first >>> sight, it seems. Now the hard part, forcing myself to not rush too >>> fast...gotta wait until Wednesday to call her so I don't appear >>> overbearing. Ugh... >> >> That doesn't make any sense to me. >> >> I think that if I had talked to someone for hours, I would already >> know -1- how soon we both wanted to be getting back together again -2- >> that I needn't be feeling one way and acting another toward them > > I agree. If he doesn't call soon(er) she may think that "magic" was just > her imagination. I bet if he waits that she'll call him first -- > something I sometimes do on purpose to see what the results are ;-) > Damn, I need to find a g/f myself! Well I just fired off a short email asking how her day went, simply to let her know I was thinking of her. I'll call her on Wednesday in either case to discuss plans for next weekend. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 21:30:24 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Mon Aug 17 21:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6cal6$csv$2@news.spamcop.net... > Well in the past I've had issues with trying to move too fast, getting > ahead of myself, etc...so I'm working to avoid that by not bombarding her > with emails and phone calls. It *is* a delicate balancing act in the beginning.....definitely do not call/email her more than once, if she doesn't respond immediately DO NOT call/email her again. Let the ball lie in her court, elsewise you _will_ appear pushy and/or desperate. You need to act like you don't care what happens at this point.....let her come to you, in other words. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 21:30:43 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Mon Aug 17 21:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6ct77$csv$5@news.spamcop.net... > Well I sent her an email shortly after she left on Saturday thanking her > for a great date, expressing hope to see her again...etc. I wanted to > wait a couple days before calling her. Bad idea, you say? No, you made some contact so that's good, now you can wait for her response before becoming an obsessed stalker.... :) From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 21:33:56 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Mon Aug 17 21:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6cep4$csv$3@news.spamcop.net... > > Oh I plan on calling her on Wednesday and surprising her with a home-grown > orange rose on our second date. :) Homegrown flowers are always a great hit -- good move! If you knew where she lived/worked, that rose left under a windshield wiper can have a pretty good effect too. No note though! She'll be curious and call you to find out if you did it, if she doesn't that means something. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 21:36:48 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Mon Aug 17 21:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6cvo7$csv$6@news.spamcop.net... > > Well I just fired off a short email asking how her day went, simply to let > her know I was thinking of her. I'll call her on Wednesday in either case > to discuss plans for next weekend. Well, be sure to keep us informed on the progress! I'll live vicariously thru you for a while ;-) From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 21:39:42 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Mon Aug 17 21:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6AC8039175FTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > And, frankly, I don't think that's a bad thing. I got authorization to > buy > a house today. It's a shitty house. But it's close to where we want to > be > and we can make it work for us, hopefully. > Shitty house is cheap enough to be able to afford needed upgrades/repairs you can afford, I hope? >> Any way to figure out how long it actually takes for my defrag to run? > > You could always just watch it run :) It, seriously, couldn't take more > than 10 minutes given that you do it every week. Huh. I've watched it run before, always seemed to take longer than that before I got bored and went off to do something else.... From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 17 21:52:21 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 17 21:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6cvo7$csv$6@news.spamcop.net... >> >> Well I just fired off a short email asking how her day went, simply to >> let her know I was thinking of her. I'll call her on Wednesday in >> either case to discuss plans for next weekend. > > Well, be sure to keep us informed on the progress! I'll live vicariously > thru you for a while ;-) That's what the .social forums are most commonly used for. Practically everybody here has some form of ongoing drama that keeps the rest of us entertained. :-P From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 17 22:07:20 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 17 22:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6d1gi$csv$7@news.spamcop.net... : indigo wrote: : > : > "Borgholio" wrote in message : > news:h6cvo7$csv$6@news.spamcop.net... : >> : >> Well I just fired off a short email asking how her day went, simply to : >> let her know I was thinking of her. I'll call her on Wednesday in : >> either case to discuss plans for next weekend. : > : > Well, be sure to keep us informed on the progress! I'll live vicariously : > thru you for a while ;-) : : That's what the .social forums are most commonly used for. Practically : everybody here has some form of ongoing drama that keeps the rest of us : entertained. :-P Keeps/kept some of us alive. I'm constantly remembering dark nights fill with pain with no way to (and no one to help) deal with the issues. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 17 22:14:58 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Mon Aug 17 22:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Great relationship book References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6AD53E5AADBTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Chris F. Willoughby" ! > >> How's the kid? > > Um. OK? > > They're mostly over being sick. Hmm. We should check to see if the > little > one still has spots but, hey, at least he's eating and acting mostly > normal > so he's probably OK. They both ate the crazy green fritters I made for > dinner. I'll surely never understand kids. why not? You too werw one once weren't you? or were you hatched? From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 17 23:46:06 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 17 23:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > "indigo" wrote in message > news:h6cnu3$uog$1@news.spamcop.net... > : > : "Frog Prince" wrote in message > : news:h63vuj$11r$1@news.spamcop.net... > : > > : > In any case he ran a bar show based on physics where his close was > : > something with the signature Hurricane. Some how super-cooled the mix > : > : Had a bottle of liquid nitrogen hidden under the bar? > > Likely. There are a lot of neat things you can do with liquid gas. Had a > neighbor in Louisiana that worked for Liquid Air. He'd drill a 15 to 20 > foot 1 inch diameter hole in fire ant nest then pump it full of liquid gas. > Kill'um dead but also left brown spots in the grass three feet wide. > Easier way to do it is mix equal amounts powered sugar and black powder. Put a sizable mound next to the ant nest, let them bring in about 3/4 of the pile then set it off. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 18 06:21:24 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Aug 18 06:25:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h6d0e6$8ju$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6cep4$csv$3@news.spamcop.net... >> >> Oh I plan on calling her on Wednesday and surprising her with a >> home-grown orange rose on our second date. :) > > Homegrown flowers are always a great hit -- good move! If you knew where > she lived/worked, that rose left under a windshield wiper can have a > pretty good effect too. No note though! She'll be curious and call you to > find out if you did it, if she doesn't that means something. That only works if the interest is mutual (has she communicated that yet by replying?) - otherwise it's just creepy and "too much". From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Aug 18 06:22:24 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Aug 18 06:25:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > "indigo" wrote in message > news:h6d0e6$8ju$1@news.spamcop.net... >> "Borgholio" wrote in message >> news:h6cep4$csv$3@news.spamcop.net... >>> Oh I plan on calling her on Wednesday and surprising her with a >>> home-grown orange rose on our second date. :) >> Homegrown flowers are always a great hit -- good move! If you knew where >> she lived/worked, that rose left under a windshield wiper can have a >> pretty good effect too. No note though! She'll be curious and call you to >> find out if you did it, if she doesn't that means something. > > That only works if the interest is mutual (has she communicated that yet by > replying?) - otherwise it's just creepy and "too much". > > Nope, no reply yet. Sent a little "Hi how was your day?" note today. Will call on Wednesday if I don't hear anything. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 18 06:30:27 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Aug 18 06:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Don't know if this is true or not but it does bring up some interesting mental videos. References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6AD623EC7A8TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > > For now, anyway. I do, however, mountain bike. And, sadly, I only have > hardpack tires. Well, despite having had nearly a week with high temps > and > no rain, the trails were awfully wet. I went sideways into a tree. The > cool thing is that I was still upright. The not cool thing was the blood. Ouch. How much skin does the tree have now? > > Anyway, yeah. We're looking at a house in a subdivision or building on 10 > acres. Tough choice. Sort of. The house... Already exists. Big bonus, > there. On 10 acres I'd need another tractor or two. I can't believe you're having such a hard time finding somewhere to live. The prices around here are killing me, look at this place, old house, nice barn, 23 acres at 327k - ughhhhh, killing me, I tell you..... From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 18 06:34:08 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Aug 18 06:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h6bvpd$puv$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Any anti-vaccinator needs to figger out where they are on such > questions; any pro-vaccinator needs to figger out where /they/ are. > Yesterday's vaccines are not the same as today's vaccines. > > In many/most cases anti-vaccinators get a free ride on the back of the > vaccinated. Vaccinations lead to herd immunity which protect the anti- > people who didn't have to bother getting vaccinated. Somehow it doesn't > seem quite fair, but it is often better that the herd's > intelligence/decisions and planning be better than those of the > anti-vaccinator. > > The CDC and WHO make mistakes. The vaccine devlopers make mistakes. So > what else is new? It's untested, it contains mercury, the hysteria, IMO far outweighs the real risk, or I should say the risks don't outweigh the benefits, at least for me. And no way in hell would I be vaccinating my kid with that if I had one. From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Aug 18 17:45:40 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Aug 18 17:50:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h6dvcs$csv$10@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Nope, no reply yet. Sent a little "Hi how was your day?" note today. >> Will call on Wednesday if I don't hear anything. >> > > Hmm... i'd have thought she should have replied. Of course email can be a > bit flakey, what with spam blockers etc. It was sent through the dating site, never had any problems yet. Think I should call this evening or wait until tomorrow? From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 18 19:47:59 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Tue Aug 18 19:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Wildlife Question Message-ID: Does anyone know whether frogs (of unknown type) make "nests"? I just got back inside from trying to roto-root my drainage system from the exit at the bottom of the driveway, and this time I disconnected the front downspout flex connector from the drainage system and ran a water hose down the pipe, running full blast. I know that the buried 6" drainage pipe sags somewhere between the front and rear downspouts, the ground along the foundation has dropped between 4-6" (at a minimum) since the house was built and the backfill settled and compacted. I installed the drainage system within the first 6 months of owning the house to prevent errosion of the sparsely grass covered areas near the downspouts. After turning on the water, I waited about 30 seconds for the drainage hose to fill up, started running the roto-rooter up the hose, and in short order 4 frogs (3 babies and Mom, I think) came flashing out of the exit, followed about 20 seconds later by Daddy, a relative monster -- his body was at least 4" long alone, not counting another 5-6" or so worth of hind legs. I guess he tried to wait the "flood" out and couldn't hold his breath any longer. He sat right next to me in the stream of water flowing out onto the driveway trying to get back into his "home", actually tried to re-enter the exit once, so I picked him up and tossed him onto the front yard, where he stayed. About 15-20 ft into the drainage hose I ran into the clog I suspected was there --- about 3 chunks of bark mulch came out of the exit, each piece was about 2-3" long and about 3/8" in diameter, carried along by the flowing water. There is no frigging way that size of wood got up into the drainage hose unless "something" carried it there on purpose. When I paced out the location of where the clog should be, it was still on the gentle part of the downslope of my front yard -- perhaps the hose had settled to a relatively flat position there? And said family of 5 frogs had set up camp there? What doesn't make sense to me is the timing of when the first batch of frogs came flying out of the exit -- for how long it took them to flee, it seems far more likely to me that their "nest", if they have one, is located somewhere alongside of the house where the hose dips -- and that's WAAAAY out of the reach of my puny 25 ft long roto-rooter. Anyone care to provide their knowledge and wisdom about how common "puddle" frogs live? I don't really want to kill them because they probably eat a ton of bothersome insects, but on the other hand if they are responsible for clogging my drainage system I don't have much choice.......dammit, I just had an idea. I should have put some metal mesh or screen over the exit hole while they were all outside....that way I wouldn't have to kill them, they'd just have to go find somewhere else to live. But I had to go inside because a thunderstorm was coming and it was starting to rain. Guess I could always repeat the excersise of flooding the system again to flush them out if necessary. Got me my new HP pocket hard drive today too! Woohoo! From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 18 19:55:07 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Tue Aug 18 20:00:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C6B90CCF671Fsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "indigo" wrote in > news:h6cmg8$n7i$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> That's what I thought. Any way to figure out how long it actually >> takes for my defrag to run? I wonder if I can find that info in >> eventviewer..... if I have defrag set up to write a log for >> it......I'll go check. >> >> > > used to be you could see it doing it graphically but the last time i did > it, that didn't seem to be possible any more which is very annoying! > assume > several hours Yes, I do believe the newer versions of MS provided defrag don't show the graphics anymore. I tried running defrag multiple times last night and the process ended as soon as it started -- event viewer claimed "sucess" !?! It didn't do anything! I then set up a manual defraggler run and went to bed. Haven't checked on the results yet, but defraggler does show the graphics. The thing that has a tad confused is that both apps typically have 2 phases -- first the app has to analyze the disk, then you click another button and say "ok, defrag it". I KNOW that at one time defrag was running normally, because my frag rate was down around 2-3% whenever I checked it manually. Last night it was up at 17% - not horrible, but definitely a sign that the scheduled weekly defrag hasn't been working properly. Need to do a little digging.... From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 18 19:59:33 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Tue Aug 18 20:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6f7dv$nuu$1@news.spamcop.net... . > > It was sent through the dating site, never had any problems yet. Think I > should call this evening or wait until tomorrow? Hmmmm.....found her on a dating site....that makes this a completely different issue.....she may have had some "magical" dates with some other guys too.....and may be trying to make up her mind on who she wants to date on a solo basis, or whether to keep playing the field a bit to narrow down her list.......in any case, the email addy she used on the site may be one that she doesn't check on a daily basis (a throw-away). I'd make the phone call. From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 18 20:00:57 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 18 20:05:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > It was sent through the dating site, never had any problems yet. Oh, Jeez. Both of you people are involved in a dating site. Nevermind any earlier comments from me. I'm out of this loop. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Aug 18 20:13:36 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Aug 18 20:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > So had practically a dream date on Saturday. Cute, funny, have tons of > things in common, didn't stop conversing for hours. Does 'date' and 'conversing' in the context of cyber-meeting dating services, mean that you actually had physical, that is eyeball to eyeball, contact with this person, or does date&conversing mean that you had a cyberdate of IRC messaging? -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Aug 18 20:27:00 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Aug 18 20:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mike Easter wrote: > Borgholio wrote: >> So had practically a dream date on Saturday. Cute, funny, have tons > of >> things in common, didn't stop conversing for hours. > > Does 'date' and 'conversing' in the context of cyber-meeting dating > services, mean that you actually had physical, that is eyeball to > eyeball, contact with this person, or does date&conversing mean that you > had a cyberdate of IRC messaging? > > Nope, actual date. Went through the matching phase on Eharmony over a week, then communicated for a few more days, then had lunch, bowling, and a drive around town on Saturday. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 18 22:27:30 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 18 22:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Wildlife Question References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h6fejp$q3i$1@news.spamcop.net... : Does anyone know whether frogs (of unknown type) make "nests"? : : I just got back inside from trying to roto-root my drainage system from the : exit at the bottom of the driveway, and this time I disconnected the front : downspout flex connector from the drainage system and ran a water hose down : the pipe, running full blast. I know that the buried 6" drainage pipe sags : somewhere between the front and rear downspouts, the ground along the : foundation has dropped between 4-6" (at a minimum) since the house was built : and the backfill settled and compacted. I installed the drainage system : within the first 6 months of owning the house to prevent errosion of the : sparsely grass covered areas near the downspouts. : : After turning on the water, I waited about 30 seconds for the drainage hose : to fill up, started running the roto-rooter up the hose, and in short order : 4 frogs (3 babies and Mom, I think) came flashing out of the exit, followed : about 20 seconds later by Daddy, a relative monster -- his body was at least : 4" long alone, not counting another 5-6" or so worth of hind legs. I guess : he tried to wait the "flood" out and couldn't hold his breath any longer. He : sat right next to me in the stream of water flowing out onto the driveway : trying to get back into his "home", actually tried to re-enter the exit : once, so I picked him up and tossed him onto the front yard, where he : stayed. : : About 15-20 ft into the drainage hose I ran into the clog I suspected was : there --- about 3 chunks of bark mulch came out of the exit, each piece was : about 2-3" long and about 3/8" in diameter, carried along by the flowing : water. There is no frigging way that size of wood got up into the drainage : hose unless "something" carried it there on purpose. When I paced out the : location of where the clog should be, it was still on the gentle part of the : downslope of my front yard -- perhaps the hose had settled to a relatively : flat position there? And said family of 5 frogs had set up camp there? : : What doesn't make sense to me is the timing of when the first batch of frogs : came flying out of the exit -- for how long it took them to flee, it seems : far more likely to me that their "nest", if they have one, is located : somewhere alongside of the house where the hose dips -- and that's WAAAAY : out of the reach of my puny 25 ft long roto-rooter. : : Anyone care to provide their knowledge and wisdom about how common "puddle" : frogs live? I don't really want to kill them because they probably eat a ton : of bothersome insects, but on the other hand if they are responsible for : clogging my drainage system I don't have much choice.......dammit, I just : had an idea. I should have put some metal mesh or screen over the exit hole : while they were all outside....that way I wouldn't have to kill them, they'd : just have to go find somewhere else to live. But I had to go inside because : a thunderstorm was coming and it was starting to rain. Guess I could always : repeat the excersise of flooding the system again to flush them out if : necessary. : : Got me my new HP pocket hard drive today too! Boohoo! Sounds like toads to me. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 18 22:30:48 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 18 22:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's going on with the town hall protest re health care legislation? References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C6B8CE81BB71sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : "Mike Easter" wrote in news:h680tl$cit$1 : @news.spamcop.net: : : : : > The current health care situation is a wasteful inadequate disaster. : > The oncoming result of the attempted remediation of that disaster to be : > a much much bigger disaster is huge and impending - likely inevitable. : : As I see it, it doesn't matter much if it's single payer or if we pay for : it individually, what DOES matter is that it not be a for-profit venture. : It's a service to keep people healthy, not a means of making billions for : some while letting others die. I'm a bit concerned about no public options as coops and nonprofits can be hammered and gamed by the big boys by way of the insurance commissions. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 18 22:34:56 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 18 22:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Just for Charles References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6d85r$csv$8@news.spamcop.net... : Frog Prince wrote: : > "indigo" wrote in message : > news:h6cnu3$uog$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : : > : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : > : news:h63vuj$11r$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : > : > : > In any case he ran a bar show based on physics where his close was : > : > something with the signature Hurricane. Some how super-cooled the mix : > : : > : Had a bottle of liquid nitrogen hidden under the bar? : > : > Likely. There are a lot of neat things you can do with liquid gas. Had a : > neighbor in Louisiana that worked for Liquid Air. He'd drill a 15 to 20 : > foot 1 inch diameter hole in fire ant nest then pump it full of liquid gas. : > Kill'um dead but also left brown spots in the grass three feet wide. : > : : Easier way to do it is mix equal amounts powered sugar and black powder. : Put a sizable mound next to the ant nest, let them bring in about 3/4 of : the pile then set it off. Some places get downright hostile about black power. At one time we would gas the river rat holes with O2 gas with ataceline (spl) and then strike a stick. Had to quit because the Corp of engineers was worried we'd damage the levees. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 18 22:58:47 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 18 23:05:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Great relationship book References: Message-ID: "bar0" wrote in message news:h6d2r9$kbi$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Charles" wrote in message : news:Xns9C6AD53E5AADBTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : > No way it was me! It was "Chris F. Willoughby" ! : > : >> How's the kid? : > : > Um. OK? : > : > They're mostly over being sick. Hmm. We should check to see if the : > little : > one still has spots but, hey, at least he's eating and acting mostly : > normal : > so he's probably OK. They both ate the crazy green fritters I made for : > dinner. I'll surely never understand kids. : : why not? You too werw one once weren't you? or were you hatched? : Cognitive ability skips a generation. when he get to be a grandpa he'll be in the know. From avoozl at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 00:51:19 2009 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Wed Aug 19 00:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6fgsf$nuu$2@news.spamcop.net... > Nope, actual date. Went through the matching phase on Eharmony over a > week, then communicated for a few more days, then had lunch, bowling, and > a drive around town on Saturday. So that site didn't reject you? Interesting... From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Aug 19 00:54:08 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Aug 19 00:55:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Chris F. Willoughby wrote: > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6fgsf$nuu$2@news.spamcop.net... >> Nope, actual date. Went through the matching phase on Eharmony over a >> week, then communicated for a few more days, then had lunch, bowling, and >> a drive around town on Saturday. > > So that site didn't reject you? Interesting... > > I made sure to omit my dark side. From user at domain.invalid Wed Aug 19 01:09:00 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Wed Aug 19 01:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Wildlife Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > Does anyone know whether frogs (of unknown type) make "nests"? > ... Yes, probably, believably. Well, some that habituate running water might build 'basins' to create an area where the tadpoles and jueveniles can develop without being swept away to more problematic parts of the waterway. Most use natural features but any that are able to improve on nature have an advantage. I seem to have once come across the "gladiator frog" as a candidate for that behavior. Where there's one species, there's likely to be more. Certainly some species nurture the tadpoles, which might be part of the nesting picture (that one that deposits eggs in a pitcher-plant - etc., etc.) Nothing more specific for you though. From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Aug 19 03:12:31 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Aug 19 03:15:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6f7dv$nuu$1@news.spamcop.net... > . >> >> It was sent through the dating site, never had any problems yet. >> Think I should call this evening or wait until tomorrow? > > Hmmmm.....found her on a dating site....that makes this a completely > different issue.....she may have had some "magical" dates with some > other guys too.....and may be trying to make up her mind on who she > wants to date on a solo basis, or whether to keep playing the field a > bit to narrow down her list.......in any case, the email addy she used > on the site may be one that she doesn't check on a daily basis (a > throw-away). I'd make the phone call. Will call her tomorrow. From Unknown.User at Invalid.Domain Wed Aug 19 09:58:30 2009 From: Unknown.User at Invalid.Domain (Jan M. Nelken) Date: Wed Aug 19 10:00:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > BTW, I kept my OpenOffice installation even after I got Office 2003 = > running again. All the *nix fanatics that claim that they are equivalent = > are full of bunk. OO Calc _sucks_ as far as ease of use compared to = > Excel, even after I learned how to use it over the better part of two = > months. It can't/won't even import a tab or space delimited text file, = > fer christ's sake! Insists on a CSV file or it automatically opens the = > OO Word equivalent instead. What a pita.... This is incorrect, I'm afraid. I have no problem importing tab or space delimited files into OpenOffice Ca= lc You choose File -> Open dialog, choose TextCSV as file type and select file= of = .txt extension for example. Calc opens a dialog where you specify separator options - see attached imag= e. Jan Nelken -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Calc.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 63808 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://zeta.cesmail.net/pipermail/scsocial/attachments/20090819/2d6e7= 37b/Calc-0001.jpg From MikeE at ster.invalid Wed Aug 19 15:05:44 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Wed Aug 19 15:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > "Jan M. Nelken" >> see attached image. > > Whoa! Double whoa! Crazy mofo super double whoa! I agree with Chas concept. This is a pretty much self-moderated behavior newsserver. The general rule about discussion groups is that we shouldn't post binary attachments to discussion groups. The SC server has a 'garbage' group, spamcop.spam. In my opinion, if any of us needs to post any garbage, such as a binary attachment, they should not attach the binary to a message into a discussion group; even if that seems convenient and the famous 'but it wasn't very large' and even if it is less convenient to put the attachment in the junk/.spam group when the conversation is going on in .social. So, the best 'protocol' would be to post the binary in .spam and then post the message about the .spam binary message into the thread in .social where the discussion is going on. Not discuss the binary in .spam; post the binary in .spam, discuss the cause/purpose/illustration of the binary in the discussion group where the cause of the need to post the binary arose. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From Unknown.User at Invalid.Domain Wed Aug 19 15:25:25 2009 From: Unknown.User at Invalid.Domain (Jan M. Nelken) Date: Wed Aug 19 15:30:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > BTW, I kept my OpenOffice installation even after I got Office 2003 > running again. All the *nix fanatics that claim that they are equivalent > are full of bunk. OO Calc _sucks_ as far as ease of use compared to > Excel, even after I learned how to use it over the better part of two > months. It can't/won't even import a tab or space delimited text file, > fer christ's sake! Insists on a CSV file or it automatically opens the > OO Word equivalent instead. What a pita.... Removed attachment due to SNAP (Self Nominated Attachment Police) attack. Text portion of reply follows: This is incorrect, I'm afraid. I have no problem importing tab or space delimited files into OpenOffice Calc You choose File -> Open dialog, choose TextCSV as file type and select file of .txt extension for example. Calc opens a dialog where you specify separator options - :see attached image . Jan Nelken From bcs1 at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 15:29:05 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Wed Aug 19 15:30:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h67c86$4s2$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Bill" wrote in message > news:h63quv$1d4$1@news.spamcop.net... >> Pros: >> 1. About 250,000 new cars were sold. > >> These vehicles will be "out of the market" now which means several >> things. >> 1. auto part manufacturers will have less of a demand for their products >> 2. auto parts stores like auto-zone, pep boys and such will have a >> reduction in the amount of sales > > > > C'mon now.....taking a measly 250,000 cars off the market out of the > nearly 125 million cars on the road today (number does not even include > any kind of truck or SUV) is such a tiny dent nobody will even notice it. > I see the "cash for clunkers" plan as a jobs/economic stimulus bill in > disguise and not much more than that. That's why many people are discounting the negligable effect of the supposed "envt" part of the program, and while it does help in the short term for some jobs, the overall effect isn't a big boost in the arm, it's kind of like putting a bandaid on a ruptured artery :) and yes, I agree with the disguise aspect of it... From bcs1 at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 16:05:14 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Wed Aug 19 16:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-406BC1.09195214082009@killface.local... > In article , "Bill" > wrote: > >> 1. About 250,000 cars will be crushed: > > False. Then engines and the drivetrains are the only parts that won't go > back on the parts market. actually, since i wrote that post, I've spoken with one of the junkyard/crusher people, they've stated that while they may harvest some parts off of the newer vehicles, there are many parts that they cannot harvest (drivetrains, main body, ect ect) and they are limited to a 6 month timeframe before the cars have to be destroyed... of course this is what the guy told me, the dealership said they were going to be crushed straightaway when I first asked them about it.. (i do the comp work for that dealership and a couple of others that they own) > >> 2. auto parts stores like auto-zone, pep boys and such will have a >> reduction >> in the amount of sales > > Because junkyards will have all the part you need from the above... not nessicarily, in my research of this, I spoke with 2 places where I buy parts at regularly enough that they know me as more than just an occasional customer, one place from years of buying parts there, and the other through the garage and through knowing some of the folks who work there from another job that we both shared. in both cases, their sales have dropped a little since the start of the cars program, especially on vehicles like explorers, some other SUVs and larger cars (LTD, Crown Vic, caprice, tahoe, f-150, ect ect) > > <3-6 snipped for space> > > I think you're forgetting about the huge number of vehicles excluded > from the program such as pickups, vans, anything getting better than 18 > MPG, and anything over 25 years old. nope, not forgetting about those at all, but don't factor them in because they aren't a part of the program... > >> 7. the yearly gas savings is only equal to approx 1/400th of one percent >> of >> our total fuel consumption any way, and speculation has it that most >> people >> will drive more miles now because not only is the vehicle new and less >> subject to breakdowns, but also that they can go further on a gallon of >> gas, >> so even the 1/400th of 1 percent saving may be just a "statistical", but >> not >> "actual" saving. > > Where do those numbers come from? The analysis is silly, they can go > further on a gallon of gas, so they'll drive more... Most people drive > to a particular destination (usually work and back) not as far as their > tank will take them. the average MPG difference between traded in vehicles and purchased vehicles is 9.6 mpg more, that came from the transportation department, and was also echoed in business week (based on the august 5th release from the transportation department) "Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood said the average mileage of new vehicles purchased through the program is 9.6 mpg higher than for the vehicles traded in for scrap. Buyers of new cars and trucks that get 10 mpg better than their trade-ins get the $4,500 rebate. Customers whose cars get between 4 mpg and 10 mpg better fuel efficiency qualify for a $3,500 rebate." and http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/content/aug2009/db2009085_823256.htm partial paste of the article: For that $1 billion, Americans will trade in roughly 250,000 cars and light trucks. The average gas mileage of those "clunkers" (vehicles such as aging Ford Explorers) was 16 miles per gallon, according to data released Aug. 5 by the Transportation Dept. The average mileage of the replacement vehicles (led by Ford's small Focus) is 25 mpg. Saving a Drop of Gas Now do some easy math. Let's assume that the average number of miles driven for both the new and old vehicles is 10,000 miles per year. The clunker thus would have burned 625 gallons per year. The new car? Only 400 gallons. That's a savings of 225 gallons per year per car. It's a nice pocketbook boost for consumers. With gas at $2.70 per gallon, they'll save $600 per year, assuming they drive the same number of miles (which actually is a questionable assumption). And at 250,000 cars traded in so far, that adds up to 56 million fewer gallons consumed in the U.S. per year That sounds like a lot. You could drive 1.4 billion miles on that much gas. But it's only a small percentage of the total gasoline consumption in the U.S. Last year, Americans burned about 138 billion gallons. So cutting that by 56 million gallons is a reduction of only 0.04%. And since auto emissions of carbon dioxide are directly proportional to gasoline consumed, greenhouse gas emissions would also go down a minuscule 0.04%. In terms of the average fuel economy of the entire fleet, the Cash for Clunkers program is hardly even measurable. With 254 million registered vehicles in the U.S., the fact that 250,000 new cars are more efficient is a mere blip. "We're talking about a tiny amount of cars," says Lee Schipper, project scientist in Global Metropolitan Studies at the University of California at Berkeley, who studies fuel economy issues. Doubting the Numbers Expanding the program with an additional $2 billion, as Congress is doing, will presumably triple any fuel savings and carbon dioxide emissions reductions. But the numbers are still tiny. And more importantly, there are good reasons to doubt the numbers. > >> 8. Cars that are traded in to dealerships and do not sell or are not >> salable >> usually end up in a junkyard where remaining good parts are sold off of >> the >> vehicle to people who are willing to buy a used part for their vehicle >> and >> do the work themselves to save money. Neither the junkyards, nor their >> customers will have access to these parts. > > Which is nearly zero of the cars we are talking about... Your > assumption is that these cars wouldn't have been sold in the first > place, that people would have just kept them.. not really, I kept mine (97 explorer, that qualified for the program), a few of the people stated to one salesman friend of mine that without this they wouldn't have purchased a new vehicle, and to be honest with you, there were some tradins that make my ride look like it is a clunker, I was there for the entire day that the engines were being disabled, some ran like crap, but most of them ran great, one even took 5:20 secs to finally die.... and if people were going to buy a new car anyway, the numbers would not have been falling off like they have been recently, however, eventually those who were going to, would have, that mush is true.. > >> 9. while new car sales have risen, not all of these sales were limited to >> American car companies and even understanding that some Americans do work >> for foreign car companies, much of the money on the sales of foreign cars >> is >> not staying in the USA. > > Economists will tell you that this doesn't matter. Money leaving the > country lets us finance the national debt. that's fine and dandy, but again, this is such a miniscule amount from this program that any benefit in that respect is negligable.. > >> 10. Car companies have not ramped up building of cars to counter the >> recent >> surge in sales, > > Not true, Ford has ramped up Focus and Escape production. yes, Ford (God love em), has in fact done so, but not "ramped up" pper say, they had continued to build cars and remain a stable company even in light of the other car companies` failures... but that's one company out of a few.. GM is reported to be adding 60K cars to production during Q3 and Q4, but that's barely(just over) 1/5th of the cars sold during this first burst of purchases.. again, nothing to write home about, especially since they are now "Government Motors" and for all intents and purposes no longer a truely "privately" owned business... I don't have the numbers for Chrysler in front of me though so I'm doing this off the top of my head. > >> 11. Most of the traded in cars were "PAID FOR" and the people had no car >> payment each month, yet now, another 250,000 Americans have gained a >> $200.00 >> to $400.00 car payment during this time of economic troubles. > > Economists will tell you that this is easily balanced by the > increased activity. a person (in this economy taking on a car payment that they didn't have previously isn't balanced by anything.. perfect example.. Monday morning there was a car dropped off that the dealership (gotta give it's owner props for having a pair and owning up to his mistake) the key were in the drop box with a note that he had lost his Job and couldn't make the car payment.. his Paid for vehicle has been disabled and he hadn't even gotten to the point of making his first car payment. Now the man is out of a job, and ironically enough, doesn't have a vehicle to go look for one with... > >> 12. no one who got the new cars in the first round were people who could >> not >> have otherwise qualified for a new car loan, so basically, this did not >> help >> the part of the population who could have really "used" the help. > > That doesn't mean that the program is bad, just that it wasn't > intended to help those people. right, and if something doesn't benefit those it's supposed to have benefitted, then is it not in reallity bad? > >> 13. people who would have normally car-pooled, or ridden a bus to work >> because of fuel costs will now probably drive themselves creating more >> congestion in the high traffic areas. > > Fuel costs are insignificant among the reason for why people don't > car pool. serveral articles I've read, disagree with that, in fact, pooling and alternating carpools, is one of the things I used to do with some co workers.. saved fuel, saved wear and tear on the vehicle, ect ect. > >> 14. Not all of the funds for the program are even going to consumer car >> purchases, the fact is that out of that money the government also puts >> the >> cost of administering the program against the total amount of funds. > > That doesn't tell us anything about the effectiveness of the program. that's true, it doesn't, but it does tell us that either all of the allocated money isn't going to what it's intended for, or that there are other costs outside of the allocations... both cases reduce the effectiveness of the program do they not? > >> 15. with the addition of the new funds, the sales of new cars under this >> program should slow down now that there's no "urgency" to it, this means >> that the temporary positive effects of the program (if any) will fall off >> markedly as people will not be "rushed" to get their new vehicle. > > Slow and steady is *far* better than roller coaster. We want to > smooth the economy not shake it up. I agree, slow and steady and thought out is the best way, rushing into something isn't. the "urgency" of the deadline did push people into doing something that they would have otherwise not done at this time.. > -- > -David Thanks Brother.. Bill From bcs1 at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 16:13:59 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Wed Aug 19 16:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h61322$8ge$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Video: Dean Kamen Unplugged > > Segway inventor Dean Kamen has taken his private island off the grid. He > has > replaced every lightbulb on the island with an LED as part of a larger > effort to popularize zero-net-energy living. > > He and his lighting guru, Fritz Morgan, take IEEE Spectrum on a > behind-the-scenes tour of the island's energy infrastructure, which > includes > solar and wind generators, a Web-based control system, and a basement full > of backup batteries. > > For more > > http://spectrum.ieee.org/video/green-tech/buildings/dumpling-island > > http://newsmanager.commpartners.com/ieeesta/issues/2009-08-13-email.html > > > man that's hawt!!!! :) From bcs1 at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 16:15:37 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Wed Aug 19 16:20:11 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Proposed Ayatollah System for USA References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h5q4jb$n0b$1@news.spamcop.net... > Some claim support for a "faith-based" system of government: > > http://theskunk.org/2009/06/republicans-propose-ayatollah-system-for-u-s > > I wonder if this is a predecessor to a 'faith based healing' protocol? > > HAHAHAA!!!, that was a hit with my friends LMAO we/me/they all got a good laugh out of it, and an even better one out of the "is this for real?" question on of them asked the rest of us.. Thanks Froggy... From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Aug 19 18:41:38 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Aug 19 18:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6f7dv$nuu$1@news.spamcop.net... > . >> >> It was sent through the dating site, never had any problems yet. >> Think I should call this evening or wait until tomorrow? > > Hmmmm.....found her on a dating site....that makes this a completely > different issue.....she may have had some "magical" dates with some > other guys too.....and may be trying to make up her mind on who she > wants to date on a solo basis, or whether to keep playing the field a > bit to narrow down her list.......in any case, the email addy she used > on the site may be one that she doesn't check on a daily basis (a > throw-away). I'd make the phone call. Made the call, left a message on her cell, now just gotta wait. Hmm, it's a shame my wine grapes have a couple weeks left to mature...I could use a bottle right about now. :) From bcs1 at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 19:00:48 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Wed Aug 19 19:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-5BF798.14355519082009@killface.local... > In article , "Bill" > wrote: > >> right, and if something doesn't benefit those it's supposed to have >> benefitted, then is it not in reallity bad? > > Did you read what I said? The program *wasn't* intended to help the > poor. The fact that it doesn't help people that it wasn't intended to > help doesn't make it a bad program. I did read, however, if this program wasn't intended to help the middle class (i don't believe I said "poor" in my comment, but I can go re-read it to be sure) then why were they talking about income limits for people signing up when debating the additional funds? Senator Tom Harkin (D-Iowa) was concerned that Cash for Clunkers didn't do enough for working families, so he offered an amendment that would limit eligibility for the government rebates to individuals with annual incomes of $50,000 or less and couples with combined incomes of $75,000 or less. > >> serveral articles I've read, disagree with that, in fact, pooling and >> alternating carpools, is one of the things I used to do with some co >> workers.. saved fuel, saved wear and tear on the vehicle, ect ect. > > I said "reasons people *don't* car pool" The negative case, not the > positive one. People don't car pool for a lot of reasons and fuel costs > aren't a factor in any of those reasons. I also allowed for other reasons in my response too did I not? > > I'm pretty sure you misread a lot of the rest of my post as well. I'm pretty sure I didn't, but that's cool :) so what did you think if the numbers source?, did that answer your question? Bill From me at privacy.net Wed Aug 19 19:15:28 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Aug 19 19:20:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Proposed Ayatollah System for USA References: Message-ID: "Bill" wrote in message news:h6hmh9$n51$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : news:h5q4jb$n0b$1@news.spamcop.net... : > Some claim support for a "faith-based" system of government: : > : > http://theskunk.org/2009/06/republicans-propose-ayatollah-system-for-u-s : > : > I wonder if this is a predecessor to a 'faith based healing' protocol? : > : > : : HAHAHAA!!!, that was a hit with my friends LMAO : : we/me/they all got a good laugh out of it, and an even better one out of : the "is this for real?" question one of them asked the rest of us.. : And you let the one off the hook ... From me at privacy.net Wed Aug 19 19:38:40 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Aug 19 19:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Alaska Supreme Court to rule on partial-term administrations References: Message-ID: http://theskunk.org/2009/07/alaska-supreme-court-to-rule-on-partial-term-administrations/ From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 20:26:15 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Wed Aug 19 20:30:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! References: Message-ID: "Jan M. Nelken" wrote in message news:h6hjj5$644$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Removed attachment due to SNAP (Self Nominated Attachment Police) attack. Umm. No you di-int... ;D We're kind of here (still) due to the courtesy of the server owner who may whack us at any time, so we don't like to piss the owner off by posting attachments. Don't take it personally.... From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 20:29:12 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Wed Aug 19 20:30:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6hv2r$vu4$2@news.spamcop.net... > > Made the call, left a message on her cell, now just gotta wait. You've emailed, twice, and called? And no response? She's either extremely rude or not interested.... and if she's so rude that she can't even manage a polite little hello, do you really want her to be interested? Hmph. > Hmm, it's a shame my wine grapes have a couple weeks left to mature...I > could use a bottle right about now. :) Did you actually plan on making grape juice and drinking it immediately? From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 20:31:00 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Wed Aug 19 20:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Great relationship book References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6CC3A92AB95TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > > At present rate of progress... I'll be luck to know my own name by the > time I'm a grandpa. I'd love to get in on some early-stage drugs, know > what I mean? When I was a kid I did third roots in my head to 6+ decimal > places. Now I'm lucky to remember my IT guy's name. Sad. Ahem. Some say alcohol has an effect on your brain. From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Aug 19 20:46:34 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Aug 19 20:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6hv2r$vu4$2@news.spamcop.net... >> Made the call, left a message on her cell, now just gotta wait. > > You've emailed, twice, and called? And no response? She's either > extremely rude or not interested.... and if she's so rude that she can't > even manage a polite little hello, do you really want her to be interested? > Hmph. Good point. I must assume at this point that I completely misread her, or something happened. If she were simply busy, even a short "Hi just didn't want you to think I was ignoring you..." note would take all of two minutes. > >> Hmm, it's a shame my wine grapes have a couple weeks left to mature...I >> could use a bottle right about now. :) > > Did you actually plan on making grape juice and drinking it immediately? > > No I planned on making honest to goodness wine. :) Just saying I wished it was ready. From me at privacy.net Wed Aug 19 20:39:35 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Aug 19 20:50:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Interesting POV (intended to sell books) Message-ID: http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2009/08/dr-deans-health-care-prescription From avoozl at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 21:08:14 2009 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Wed Aug 19 21:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:h6i59c$m78$1@news.spamcop.net... > Umm. No you di-int... ;D We're kind of here (still) due to the courtesy > of the server owner who may whack us at any time, so we don't like to piss > the owner off by posting attachments. Don't take it personally.... > > Not sure he ever said that was a no-no. I know that traditionally people whine about it.. but that's different. :) From me at privacy.net Wed Aug 19 21:31:36 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Aug 19 21:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Great relationship book References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6CC3A92AB95TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! : > "bar0" wrote in message : > news:h6d2r9$kbi$1@news.spamcop.net... : >: "Charles" wrote in message : >: news:Xns9C6AD53E5AADBTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : : >: > I'll surely never understand kids. : >: : >: why not? You too werw one once weren't you? or were you hatched? : >: : > Cognitive ability skips a generation. when he get to be a grandpa : > he'll be in the know. : : At present rate of progress... I'll be luck to know my own name by the : time I'm a grandpa. I'd love to get in on some early-stage drugs, know : what I mean? When I was a kid I did third roots in my head to 6+ decimal : places. Now I'm lucky to remember my IT guy's name. Sad. I was not talking about general cognitive ability only the ability to be in the grove with kids. I though I had it down pat. My kids once asked my why I didn't understand them as well as I understand their kids. I think my DIL has it pegged. He's as bad as the kids, worse actually as he has his own money. From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Aug 19 21:35:01 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Aug 19 21:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Let's just up the hype, shall we? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > Or, what's happening in 13 hours? Anyone??? Clueless, myself. Hurricane Bill makes landfall, maybe? From MikeE at ster.invalid Wed Aug 19 21:35:19 2009 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Wed Aug 19 21:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! References: Message-ID: Chris F. Willoughby wrote: > Not sure he ever said that was a no-no. I know that traditionally > people whine about it.. but that's different. :) Not posting binaries to text groups is an established newsgroup netiquette which is 'universally' listed as good behavior -- if you don't know where to find that kind of information, I hope that you will be able to search it out so that I don't have to spoon-feed it to you. The previous page in the website faq/s which used to list the newsgroups (discussed in a recent spamcop thread) and the recommended netiquette is no longer accessed via the same channels and old links, but the previous content can still be found here... http://forum.spamcop.net/scwik/SpamCopNewsgroupsHowToUse SpamCop Newsgroups - How to access and use -- Netiquette (Net Etiquette) applies equally to the SpamCop Newsgroups as to the SpamCop Web Forum and the rest of the Internet. A short list of links to articles about Netiquette follows: More specifically to the SpamCop Newsgroups, the following rules apply: -- text only, not binaries (except in spamcop.spam). -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 22:50:36 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Wed Aug 19 22:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Wildlife Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h6fnui$dct$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Sounds like toads to me. > > Could be....I used to have an annual crop of toads in my casement windows.....now that I think about it, they did have rough bumpy skin, not smooth like a frogs skin. In any case, got any answer to my "do they build nests" question? From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 22:56:38 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Wed Aug 19 23:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Jan M. Nelken" wrote in message news:h6h0e7$119$1@news.spamcop.net... > > This is incorrect, I'm afraid. > > I have no problem importing tab or space delimited files into OpenOffice > Calc > > You choose File -> Open dialog, choose TextCSV as file type and select > file of > .txt extension for example. I stand (sit) corrected....I never scrolled down that far, nor would I have known that that was the correct selection to make -- nothing in the help file indicated that course of action. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Aug 19 23:17:20 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Wed Aug 19 23:20:10 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6hv2r$vu4$2@news.spamcop.net... > Made the call, left a message on her cell, now just gotta wait. > So she was careful enough to give you her cell, not home number......smart on her part, but bad if it were I in the same situation due to my lack of use of my cell -- if it's not turned off it's usually nowhere close to me, might be days before I turn it on again. But then again she's a chick, they seem to live and die with their cell phones ;-) > Hmm, it's a shame my wine grapes have a couple weeks left to mature...I > could use a bottle right about now. :) Yeah, the waiting really sucks....good luck! From avoozl at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 06:43:21 2009 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Thu Aug 20 06:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! References: Message-ID: Not neccessary to quote nettiquete. :) My point was simply that I don't believe JT has specifically said not to do that. Furthermore, if the server actually allows it I've never saw it that big a deal. (Not that I've tried to post one here.) Chris "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:h6i98m$udd$1@news.spamcop.net... > Not posting binaries to text groups is an established newsgroup > netiquette which is 'universally' listed as good behavior -- if you > don't know where to find that kind of information, I hope that you will > be able to search it out so that I don't have to spoon-feed it to you. > > The previous page in the website faq/s which used to list the newsgroups > (discussed in a recent spamcop thread) and the recommended netiquette is > no longer accessed via the same channels and old links, but the previous > content can still be found here... > > http://forum.spamcop.net/scwik/SpamCopNewsgroupsHowToUse SpamCop > Newsgroups - How to access and use -- Netiquette (Net Etiquette) applies > equally to the SpamCop Newsgroups as to the SpamCop Web Forum and the > rest of the Internet. A short list of links to articles about Netiquette > follows: More specifically to the SpamCop Newsgroups, the > following rules apply: -- text only, not binaries (except in > spamcop.spam). > > > > -- > Mike Easter > kibitzer, not SC admin > From user at domain.invalid Thu Aug 20 07:27:52 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Thu Aug 20 07:30:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Wildlife Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > ... In any case, got any answer to my "do they > build nests" question? Well, yes, as I previously responded (any particular reason you ignored that?) Seems my recollection about the "gladiator frog" (as one example) was correct. Web search that and pick up the commentary from Ch 1 of "In search of the golden frog" by Martha L. Crump. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 14:38:55 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Thu Aug 20 14:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Great relationship book References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6CD37426205TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Heidi" ! > >> Some say alcohol has an effect on your brain. > > GTFOOH, dood. No way. Besides, despite talking the walk I haven't walked > it much except these past couple of years. Or, let's see, just because I > like good alcohol doesn't make me an alcoholic. Hello! I like good > cheese, good cars, good houses, good sunglasses, good duck, etc. That > makes me a gourmand or gourmet depending on how you look at things. Maybe it makes you a cheesehead? From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 16:37:39 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 20 16:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Farelf" wrote in message news:h6ajn6$bo2$1@news.spamcop.net... > Whatever happens, we in the southern hemisphere will have been your 'lab > rats'. Thanks so much for your contribution to the rest of the planet! From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 16:40:14 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 20 16:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Wildlife Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Farelf" wrote in message news:h6jbvk$8nl$1@news.spamcop.net... > indigo wrote: > >> ... In any case, got any answer to my "do they build nests" question? > > Well, yes, as I previously responded (any particular reason you ignored > that?) Don't recall seeing it? Seems my recollection about the "gladiator frog" (as one > example) was correct. Web search that and pick up the commentary from Ch > 1 of "In search of the golden frog" by Martha L. Crump. Someone else has determined that I have toads, not frogs, infesting my drainage system. I imagine they have quite different behaviors? From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 16:41:10 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 20 16:45:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C6B913F1E7BDsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... >> > > ... indi gives us a peek inside his extensive bag of tricks Oh yeah, I can "woo" with the best of them ;-) From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 16:42:56 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 20 16:45:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Chris F. Willoughby" wrote in message news:h6g0c8$l7i$1@news.spamcop.net... > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6fgsf$nuu$2@news.spamcop.net... >> Nope, actual date. Went through the matching phase on Eharmony over a >> week, then communicated for a few more days, then had lunch, bowling, and >> a drive around town on Saturday. > > So that site didn't reject you? Interesting... > LOL. I rejected that place many years ago. You have to spend hours and hours filling out all these questions, then once you can get "in" and look around you find that hardly anyone has photos up for you to see. Arrrgggghhh! All that time wasted for nothing! No pic first, no interest. From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Aug 20 16:45:41 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Aug 20 16:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > "Chris F. Willoughby" wrote in message > news:h6g0c8$l7i$1@news.spamcop.net... >> "Borgholio" wrote in message >> news:h6fgsf$nuu$2@news.spamcop.net... >>> Nope, actual date. Went through the matching phase on Eharmony over >>> a week, then communicated for a few more days, then had lunch, >>> bowling, and a drive around town on Saturday. >> >> So that site didn't reject you? Interesting... >> > > LOL. I rejected that place many years ago. You have to spend hours and > hours filling out all these questions, then once you can get "in" and > look around you find that hardly anyone has photos up for you to see. > Arrrgggghhh! All that time wasted for nothing! No pic first, no interest. No fewer than half of my matches have pics, so it's not that bad. I like Eharmony because you don't have to risk getting burned out searching for profiles and composing hundreds of emails to people who typically delete them without even reading. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 16:48:39 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 20 16:50:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: New quote In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Chris F. Willoughby" wrote in message news:h6878d$e80$1@news.spamcop.net... > "indigo" wrote in message > news:h67b2c$ush$1@news.spamcop.net... >> >> Too bad it's only half modular -- they make great houses using factory >> built modules. I live in one. Most of the nearly 400 houses in my >> neighborhood are modular, only the last 20 or so were stick built. > > Except for the water heaters. Ahem. Hey now....according to stats my water heater should have given up the ghost long before it did....lasted 16 years...... I'm on my 3rd icemaker though...... From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 16:52:08 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 20 16:55:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h6897s$nrp$1@news.spamcop.net... > The blue light-emitting diode, arguably the greatest optoelectronic > advance > of the past 25 years, harbors a dark secret: Crank up the current and its > efficiencies will plummet. The problem is known as droop, and it's not > only > puzzling the brightest minds in the field, it's also threatening the > future > of the electric lighting industry. They're also horribly expensive. When I went to buy a new PassPort 8500 LIDAR/RADAR detector a year or so ago their to topline models came in either red LED or Blue LED -- the blue LED looked way cooler than the red one, and probably less distraction while driving at night. However, it cost $50 more because of the blue LEDs! From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 17:01:48 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 20 17:05:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6kclb$1cj$1@news.spamcop.net... > No fewer than half of my matches have pics, so it's not that bad. I like > Eharmony because you don't have to risk getting burned out searching for > profiles and composing hundreds of emails to people who typically delete > them without even reading. You actually found anywhere near 100, let alone 100's, of women that you had interest in? Did you have an unlimited search range or what?!?! Sheesh, way back when I was using match.com I'd go months and months without anyone within a 25 mile radius piquing my interest, and match is by far the largest dating service online. And the ratio of profiles of blondes to brunettes was something like 10:1, no joke. I'd prefer that ratio to be backwards, of course..... A couple months ago I was bored some weekend so I logged onto match to look around, even though I have no intention of dating again until I have a job and my health is good. I found a damn near "perfect" woman for me, had everything I wanted, liked her attitude......a couple weeks later I checked again and she was gone. That's one problem with those dating sites, the REALLY good ones disappear as soon as they show up! From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Aug 20 17:07:58 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Aug 20 17:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > You actually found anywhere near 100, let alone 100's, of women that you > had interest in? Did you have an unlimited search range or what?!?! If you're referring to non-Eharmony dating sites then yeah, I've been signed up for a long time... > Sheesh, way back when I was using match.com I'd go months and months > without anyone within a 25 mile radius piquing my interest, and match is > by far the largest dating service online. And the ratio of profiles of > blondes to brunettes was something like 10:1, no joke. I'd prefer that > ratio to be backwards, of course..... Eharmony tends to have a majority of single mothers looking for a father...I guess every dating site has it's own demographics. > >That's one problem with those > dating sites, the REALLY good ones disappear as soon as they show up! Or they're fake. Date.com has a serious problem with tons of mailorder brides. They use pictures of attractive women and "copy and paste" profile essays. I no longer use that site. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 18:21:17 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 20 18:25:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6kdv3$1cj$2@news.spamcop.net... > > Or they're fake. Date.com has a serious problem with tons of mailorder > brides. They use pictures of attractive women and "copy and paste" > profile essays. I no longer use that site. Didn't a one-time .socialite run the Date.com website? I think his name was Michael something? Anyway, "fake" or rather "misleading" profiles can be found on any dating site you look at.....I have some horror stories from years ago that would have you on the floor laughing your ass off ;-) My biggest problem was getting so much garbage email, some from like you say "mail order brides" from foreign countries, but the worst offenders were "ladies" who either lived so far away (as far as you can get and still be in the continental US plus the occasion "real" foreigner), or were so different from my pretty explicit "match" preferences, listed right there in black and white, it wasn't even funny. No, you probably nice 58 year old woman from Omaha, I'm NOT INTERESTED in dating you! Sheesh..... From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Aug 20 19:08:34 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Aug 20 19:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6kdv3$1cj$2@news.spamcop.net... >> >> Or they're fake. Date.com has a serious problem with tons of >> mailorder brides. They use pictures of attractive women and "copy and >> paste" profile essays. I no longer use that site. > > Didn't a one-time .socialite run the Date.com website? I think his name > was Michael something? Yep, and he was kind enough to give me a free Date.com Gold account which I still have, but don't use anymore. > > Anyway, "fake" or rather "misleading" profiles can be found on any > dating site you look at.....I have some horror stories from years ago > that would have you on the floor laughing your ass off ;-) Oh yeah I know, it just seemed like Date.com had a higher than typical percentage of them. > > My biggest problem was getting so much garbage email, some from like you > say "mail order brides" from foreign countries, but the worst offenders > were "ladies" who either lived so far away (as far as you can get and > still be in the continental US plus the occasion "real" foreigner), or > were so different from my pretty explicit "match" preferences, listed > right there in black and white, it wasn't even funny. No, you probably > nice 58 year old woman from Omaha, I'm NOT INTERESTED in dating you! > Sheesh..... Oh yeah I actually got so many girls from the Philippines that I had to put a "If you live in Asia, then learn to read English and stop contacting me..." addendum to my profile. From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 20 17:37:13 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 20 19:15:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h6kd1o$egu$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : news:h6897s$nrp$1@news.spamcop.net... : > The blue light-emitting diode, arguably the greatest optoelectronic : > advance : > of the past 25 years, harbors a dark secret: Crank up the current and its : > efficiencies will plummet. The problem is known as droop, and it's not : > only : > puzzling the brightest minds in the field, it's also threatening the : > future : > of the electric lighting industry. : : They're also horribly expensive. When I went to buy a new PassPort 8500 : LIDAR/RADAR detector a year or so ago their to topline models came in either : red LED or Blue LED -- the blue LED looked way cooler than the red one, and : probably less distraction while driving at night. However, it cost $50 more : because of the blue LEDs! Preceived value aka marketing. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 20:13:44 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Thu Aug 20 20:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h6kc6k$dks$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Farelf" wrote in message > news:h6ajn6$bo2$1@news.spamcop.net... >> Whatever happens, we in the southern hemisphere will have been your 'lab >> rats'. > > Thanks so much for your contribution to the rest of the planet! We need the space anyway. From me at privacy.net Thu Aug 20 21:05:02 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Aug 20 21:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Even a blind pig occasionally finds an acorn. Message-ID: >From another group: Although this one time the article probably slipped through without anyone noticing: http://tinyurl.com/lg7zxl http://teamwashington.blogs.foxnews.com/2009/08/20/the-lighter-side-what-do-republicans-really-want/ From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 23:29:54 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 20 23:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h6klb2$nq2$1@news.spamcop.net... However, it cost $50 more because of the blue LEDs! > > Preceived value aka marketing. > Not sure what you mean there...besides looking nicer the usually knowledgeable sales staff had no explanation for the price difference except that the blue LED unit was a newer product. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 20 23:34:28 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Thu Aug 20 23:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6kl18$1cj$3@news.spamcop.net... > Oh yeah I actually got so many girls from the Philippines that I had to > put a "If you live in Asia, then learn to read English and stop contacting > me..." addendum to my profile. But it didn't help, did it? I specifically wrote in my profile that if "you live on the other side of the Potomac River don't bother contacting me", because the DC beltway drive into norther VA was horrific. Didn't stop many gals from thinking "he'll find me so irrestible that he'll be willing to break his rule for me". To be honest, if I _had_ been contacted by a seemingly near perfect match I probably would have gone out with her (I did date one gal from Alexandria for 4-5 months), I was just trying to cut down on the email traffic with the warning. From user at domain.invalid Fri Aug 21 00:07:47 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Fri Aug 21 00:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > "Farelf" wrote in message > news:h6ajn6$bo2$1@news.spamcop.net... >> Whatever happens, we in the southern hemisphere will have been your >> 'lab rats'. > > Thanks so much for your contribution to the rest of the planet! Accident of timing (yes, everything of significance *usually* happens in the northern hemisphere, populations, economics, etc) - but mass vaccinations should be available (and perhaps administered) here in October - we shall see. The thing about mass vaccinations is that the preservative(s) containing the minute amount of mercury which worry people may not be required since wastage is not such a factor. I don't know if that will be the case (somebody knows, I guess). We will see. From user at domain.invalid Fri Aug 21 00:27:03 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Fri Aug 21 00:30:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Wildlife Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > >> >> Well, yes, as I previously responded (any particular reason you >> ignored that?) > > Don't recall seeing it? It said nesting behavior was quite possible/believable in terms of survival advantage and I seemed to recall the gladiator frog as a candidate for such behavior and if there was one species there could be others. > > Seems my recollection about the "gladiator frog" (as one >> example) was correct. Web search that and pick up the commentary from >> Ch 1 of "In search of the golden frog" by Martha L. Crump. > > Someone else has determined that I have toads, not frogs, infesting my > drainage system. I imagine they have quite different behaviors? Quite different, generally, much more terrestrial (for an amphibian) but I don't know of a nesting type offhand or whether it might make that behavior more or less likely. More likely, I suspect but amphibians are not particularly well-studied. And the gladiator frog, at least, shows the nesting behavior is not consistently exhibited, perhaps not even within a single (regional) population. I'm not sure, even if you had photographs and consulted experts, that you would necessarily get an unequivocal answer. No real help to you (sorry) but I suspect your fears have foundation. FWIW. From user at domain.invalid Fri Aug 21 00:36:05 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Fri Aug 21 00:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: bar0 wrote: > > We need the space anyway. > ?? You're welcome to apply for immigration. Bring money. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 21 00:44:55 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 21 00:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h6l4bi$ae9$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : news:h6klb2$nq2$1@news.spamcop.net... : However, it cost $50 more because of the blue LEDs! : > : > Preceived value aka marketing. : > : : Not sure what you mean there...besides looking nicer the usually : knowledgeable sales staff had no explanation for the price difference except : that the blue LED unit was a newer product. Likely the same design, function and performance. Only difference is a prettier blue light. ergo perceived to be a better product. Kinda like the cell phone I designed. guts were all the same, software was all the same, only some functions were disabled. Marketing manage to convince the reviewers there was a real difference. From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 21 01:34:13 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 21 01:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h6kl18$1cj$3@news.spamcop.net... >> Oh yeah I actually got so many girls from the Philippines that I had >> to put a "If you live in Asia, then learn to read English and stop >> contacting me..." addendum to my profile. > > But it didn't help, did it? Well it did indeed reduce the number of people I got...and those that I did get I laid into them. Was I an asshole? Probably...but it felt good. :) From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Fri Aug 21 01:58:47 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Fri Aug 21 02:00:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Farelf wrote: > bar0 wrote: > >> >> We need the space anyway. > ?? You're welcome to apply for immigration. Bring money. And lots more money. Then get lots of forms certified and then certify those certifications. Then pay more money. And wait. Then pay a lot for a medical check. Pay a lot more to take an English test. Then wait, and send more money. Then wonder if they are going to shut down the immigration program all together. And then eventually you might get your visa. Only took about a year for me. If they haven't already shut down the immigration program. Umm, too late. I think I snuck in by like a few weeks before they cut it all by like 80%. Probably upped the fees too since then. From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 21 03:08:45 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 21 03:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h6lbka$5n5$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Well it did indeed reduce the number of people I got...and those that >> I did get I laid into them. Was I an asshole? Probably...but it felt >> good. :) >> > > so... has she contacted you yet? Nope. From user at domain.invalid Fri Aug 21 03:08:49 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Fri Aug 21 03:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mr K Mean wrote: > > And lots more money. Then get lots of forms certified and then certify > those certifications. Then pay more money. And wait. Then pay a lot for > a medical check. Pay a lot more to take an English test. Then wait, and > send more money. Then wonder if they are going to shut down the > immigration program all together. > > And then eventually you might get your visa. Only took about a year for > me. If they haven't already shut down the immigration program. Umm, too > late. I think I snuck in by like a few weeks before they cut it all by > like 80%. Probably upped the fees too since then. Sorry to hear of your travails. Others head for Java and find a boat heading south ... but that's another story. Well, not really, the UN keeps telling us we have to accept more refugees, even if they're not applying before their 'fait accompli' arrivals, so something has to give. Some wish our authorities would just tell the UN to go take a running jump, we have enough alienated minorities already. But apparently 'integration' is a dirty word now, equated with 'genocide' through some fantastic but supposedly effortless logic which only evades unreconstitued bigots. Anyway, it shouldn't be that hard for ordinary folks so I'm sorry to hear that it is. Of course we have to be careful of those from 'the old country'. That's where all those awful *convicts* came from. (Joke! joke). From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 21 11:13:42 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Aug 21 11:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C6E4121CEAA2sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > Charles wrote in > news:Xns9C6E53EACA75FTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61: > >> No way you can tell (without viewing sources) what web site the page >> is on - talk about a security hole. >> >> As in, often when purchasing online with CC a page shows up that >> claims to be your bank and asks for verification info. I'm sure >> they're perfectly legit. They do not seem legit in the slightest. >> They would be extremely easy to imitate and no one would ever know >> they weren't on their bank's site. Thanks for the added security but >> NO THANKS! >> > > I don't see that often but I know the ones you mean, you have to enter > your secret secret code right? The one I see is 'verified by visa' and > you have to set up a password which it then asks you for sometimes. > > I had a very very clever phishing email the other day. The only way I > knew it wasn't real was the address it came into. Had it come into the > 'right' address i might have thought it was legit at first (of course > once it started asking me for info I'd have known but at least I didn't > even go to their website as it happened). All the URLs looked real, > that's usually the first thing that gives these things away. Our > mortgage lender has various levels of security, including a picture > which you choose ahead of time which, if it's not displayed, it's not > THEM. my banks do it too, , 'course I only log in 'bout 2X a year, and I can;t remember which one of their stupid pictures I was looking at. From joegill at removethis Fri Aug 21 12:25:33 2009 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Fri Aug 21 12:30:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: So I told the builder... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6E321E8533CTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... >I said, "Hey. The houses you build look somehow unfinished." They've only > built one architect-designed house before. > > This whole thing is getting very stressful. Yes, they've built hundreds > of > houses. But this isn't about hundreds of houses - it's about my house. Ahh.. You want it 'finished'... that's an 'upgrade'.... :) In most business today, consumers are driving the lowest cost! In the 'race for the bottom', something has to give! So you get the 'base' (translated: stripped) model of ____________. You are then given the 'opportunity' to 'upgrade'..(translated: High-margin add-ons). The dealer/builder/manufacturer/etc has one goal in mind... rate of return to his/her investors.... From joegill at removethis Fri Aug 21 12:31:11 2009 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Fri Aug 21 12:35:06 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: So I told the builder... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6E321E8533CTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... >I said, "Hey. The houses you build look somehow unfinished." They've only > built one architect-designed house before. > > This whole thing is getting very stressful. Yes, they've built hundreds > of > houses. But this isn't about hundreds of houses - it's about my house. Another cynical response..... This builder is a 'cookie-cutter'... he can 'stamp out' cookies to a 'mold'. But you have broken the mold.... Ah... a buried charge for a new 'mold'... a buried charge for 'customization' ... another charge for ... etc etc. etc... Some builders are not in the house-building business, they are in the 'add-on' business... that is where the PROFIT is.... Look carefully at fixtures... another way the 'upgrade' game is played... A 'standard' house from the 'mold' comes with sinks/tubs that look like they are vintage 1990's 'plain janes'.... Of course they will 'upgrade' for the product cost (list) and a change fee.... From joegill at removethis Fri Aug 21 12:56:03 2009 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Fri Aug 21 13:00:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: So I told the builder... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6E803B6D34ATheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "Joe Gill" ! > >> Look carefully at fixtures... another way the 'upgrade' game is >> played... A 'standard' house from the 'mold' comes with sinks/tubs >> that look like they are vintage 1990's 'plain janes'.... Of course >> they will 'upgrade' for the product cost (list) and a change fee.... > > No change fees and, alas, we'll probably go with crappy fixtures. Why? > 'Cause they're very easy to change and we can't afford to have everything > perfect off the bat. > > At least, no change fees yet. And I intend to have the house spec'd out > before I sign, know what I mean? We're working through the big things > right now (counters, flooring, windows, siding, roofing, heating, > plumbing). Then the small things will get done. And then, hopefully, > we'll get this all done, darn it! Make sure they use REAL WOOD in the structure.. There have been some TV shows locally about fires where the structure is a different type of wood or manufacutred wood...... They burn up QUICKLY if there is a fire... From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 21 13:15:34 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 21 13:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in news:h6lh5h$p6l$1 > @news.spamcop.net: > > >>> so... has she contacted you yet? >> Nope. >> > > Bummer. Well.. NEXT! Indeed. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 21 19:53:43 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 21 20:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: So I told the builder... References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6E321E8533CTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... :I said, "Hey. The houses you build look somehow unfinished." They've only : built one architect-designed house before. : : This whole thing is getting very stressful. Yes, they've built hundreds of : houses. But this isn't about hundreds of houses - it's about my house. Last custom build house we had the design was by a license architect (signed and numbered design), that cost me extra. I hired a certified inspector that also cost me extra. aka designated SOB. I also had a builders bond (which I also paid for) End result we got the house we specified for the price we agreed. Builder is still not speaking to me. From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 21 20:07:42 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 21 20:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: So I told the builder... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > "Charles" wrote in message > news:Xns9C6E321E8533CTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > :I said, "Hey. The houses you build look somehow unfinished." They've only > : built one architect-designed house before. > : > : This whole thing is getting very stressful. Yes, they've built hundreds > of > : houses. But this isn't about hundreds of houses - it's about my house. > > Last custom build house we had the design was by a license architect (signed > and numbered design), that cost me extra. I hired a certified inspector > that also cost me extra. aka designated SOB. I also had a builders bond > (which I also paid for) > > End result we got the house we specified for the price we agreed. > > Builder is still not speaking to me. > > Could you please elaborate? If you paid extra for the architect and the inspector, how would that make the builder mad at you? Just because you made him do the job right? From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 21 20:29:27 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 21 20:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: So I told the builder... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6ncs1$3of$1@news.spamcop.net... : Frog Prince wrote: : > "Charles" wrote in message : > news:Xns9C6E321E8533CTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : > :I said, "Hey. The houses you build look somehow unfinished." They've only : > : built one architect-designed house before. : > : : > : This whole thing is getting very stressful. Yes, they've built hundreds : > of : > : houses. But this isn't about hundreds of houses - it's about my house. : > : > Last custom build house we had the design was by a license architect (signed : > and numbered design), that cost me extra. I hired a certified inspector : > that also cost me extra. aka designated SOB. I also had a builders bond : > (which I also paid for) : > : > End result we got the house we specified for the price we agreed. : > : > Builder is still not speaking to me. : > : > : : Could you please elaborate? If you paid extra for the architect and the : inspector, how would that make the builder mad at you? Just because you : made him do the job right? BINGO!!! As to doing the job right, he got to do it over until he did get it right. He lost a lot of points trying to BS the wife and I. Wife was, at one time, the operating manager for a real-estate partnership who build new properties from the ground up. Sad part if the guy had been honest he'd have made a decent profit but p*ssed it all away trying to beat us at our own game. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 21 20:38:17 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 21 20:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6E53EACA75FTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way you can tell (without viewing sources) what web site the page is on : - talk about a security hole. : : As in, often when purchasing online with CC a page shows up that claims to : be your bank and asks for verification info. I'm sure they're perfectly : legit. They do not seem legit in the slightest. They would be extremely : easy to imitate and no one would ever know they weren't on their bank's : site. Thanks for the added security but NO THANKS! My banks have sent out hard copy notices that they NEVER EVER ask for much less require secure information by email or on line. On their web sites before I can access my account I'm presented with information that is secure and only known to me. From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 21 22:50:29 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 21 22:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in news:h6lh5h$p6l$1 > @news.spamcop.net: > > >>> so... has she contacted you yet? >> Nope. >> > > Bummer. Well.. NEXT! My neighbor suggested that it was my giving her a quick kiss on the cheek that scared her off. I dunno, I thought it was a nice way to say "I like you" without going too far. Can I get the POV from the female-ish lurkers here? :) From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 21 23:38:36 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 21 23:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C6EDFCC799BETheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! : : > My banks have sent out hard copy notices that they NEVER EVER ask for : > much less require secure information by email or on line. : : And if you have a Visa card and purchase with it online then web sites : still often pull up the "Verified by Visa" BS in a frame inside of the : transaction window. Even if your bank doesn't do anything. : : Of course, were I ever to fill in any information in one of those and if it : was legit then Visa would surely call me to ask what was wrong :) : : But there is no indication WHATSOEVER that those frames are legit. And : making them illegit would be so fricking easy it isn't even funny. Too many questions or I'm not happy I back out and pass on the deal. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 21 23:45:27 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 22 00:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6nmd8$3of$2@news.spamcop.net... > > My neighbor suggested that it was my giving her a quick kiss on the cheek > that scared her off. I dunno, I thought it was a nice way to say "I like > you" without going too far. Can I get the POV from the female-ish lurkers > here? :) No effing way a simple kiss on the cheek scared her off. Any time I have a first date and don't at least get a simple quick peck on the lips (or more) that's a bad sign. Shaking hands or something like that feels too....weird....almost like you just had an interview instead of a date (but if I'm escaping/evading I'll find a way to avoid any physical contact). If things go really good (and you can feel good vibes from her) I will "demand" a kiss before I let her get into her car ;-) Hell, I've had mild make-out sessions in parking lots with chicks who apparently found me physically attractive but I didn't "fit the bill" for what they were looking for in a total package in the daylight, void of any alcoholic influences. When I had my first date with my last g/f, we hit it off so fast and so good about an hour into the date she got up from the bar to go to the ladies room -- I reached out and grabbed her around the waist as she started to pass me and said something like "you have to kiss me first if you're going to leave me here all alone". She dug it, I dug it, it was just "right". You really need to be able to pay attention to the woman, their body positions, slight brushes up against you, and their movements and actions etc. if you're going to do something like that though. I guess I can read women pretty well in that area ( I considered majoring in psychology in college, reading body language is fascinating), but when I delve farther and deeper into their psyche over time, well....that's when they seem to come from Venus! For an especially elegant and sophisticated woman, I may just go for kissing her hand.....that's a big old fashioned move certain to shock and delight her (greatly to your advantage) for said type of woman. Damn, I gotta quit giving away all my secret moves here! From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 21 23:49:02 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 22 00:15:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Wildlife Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Farelf" wrote in message news:h6l7mj$e5e$1@news.spamcop.net... > No real help to you (sorry) but I suspect your fears have foundation. > FWIW. Guess it's time to put up "the fences" then....but with thunderstorms expected over the next 3 days I'll have to wait to see if I stirred up enough junk in the line that a lot of water can succeed in flushing it out. I don't want to create a choke point for debris at the exit until the storms pass. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 21 23:50:24 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 22 00:15:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h6l8ri$fdc$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Likely the same design, function and performance. Only difference is a > prettier blue light. ergo perceived to be a better product. I thought you intoned that blue LEDs were more expensive than the standard red? From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 22 01:15:41 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Aug 22 01:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Dean Kamen Unplugged (Segway inventor) References: Message-ID: "indigo" < : > : > Likely the same design, function and performance. Only difference is a : > prettier blue light. ergo perceived to be a better product. : : I thought you intoned that blue LEDs were more expensive than the standard : red? Don't recall saying that but it may have been in the IEEE article which was dealing with power LEDs. Regardless if they are the differential is not worth $50. From user at domain.invalid Sat Aug 22 01:33:59 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Sat Aug 22 01:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Wildlife Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > > Guess it's time to put up "the fences" then....but with thunderstorms > expected over the next 3 days I'll have to wait to see if I stirred up > enough junk in the line that a lot of water can succeed in flushing it > out. I don't want to create a choke point for debris at the exit until > the storms pass. Sounds like a plan. I occasionally need to flush out my wastewater/rainwater lines using the garden hose but only to clear leaves and twigs (as far as I can tell). Occasionally some problems with encroaching tree roots which leads to the first signs further 'upstream' (hair clogging, etc.) but this is over a period of many years and mostly in dry years. Really thought there might be a problem with snakes when a neighbour used to keep birds in quantity leading to an increase in local mouse population - http://www.dec.wa.gov.au/animals/living-with-wildlife/dealing-with-snakes.html - the dugites would come after the mice. Saw plenty of dugites, but none encountered in the drains. If I had frogs/toads in the lines, I'm fairly sure there would have been tiger snakes up there after them. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 22 19:05:48 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Sat Aug 22 19:10:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Wildlife Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Farelf" wrote in message news:h6o003$8uv$1@news.spamcop.net... If I had frogs/toads in the lines, I'm > fairly sure there would have been tiger snakes up there after them. Eh....I think I'll stick to my plan instead of importing toad eating snakes.....I used to have some kind of small unidentified snake come shooting out from under my shed one day while I was working near the back of said shed.....scared the shite out of me...not because it was a snake (they really don't bother me.....much), but from the suddern unknown creature movement. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 22 21:53:28 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sat Aug 22 21:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6nmd8$3of$2@news.spamcop.net... > Sylvesterthekat wrote: > > My neighbor suggested that it was my giving her a quick kiss on the cheek > that scared her off. I dunno, I thought it was a nice way to say "I like > you" without going too far. Can I get the POV from the female-ish lurkers > here? :) Female-ISH??? I have no "ish"! If she was interested, you would not have put her off with a kiss on the cheek, although I would not have gone that far on a first date with someone I just met. If she was not interested, then yes, that would have been a big turnoff. Obviously from the silence, you either misread something about her behavior during the evening and her reactions, or she was being dishonest, maybe not wanting to hurt your feelings by saying right off the bat 'err no, this doesn't work for me.' From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 22 21:54:50 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sat Aug 22 21:55:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h6nrbu$4h1$1@news.spamcop.net... > > For an especially elegant and sophisticated woman, I may just go for > kissing her hand.....that's a big old fashioned move certain to shock and > delight her (greatly to your advantage) for said type of woman. > > Damn, I gotta quit giving away all my secret moves here! Ugh, gagging here, don't listen to Indi, Borg, he's a slut..... :D From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Aug 22 21:59:18 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sat Aug 22 22:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Even a blind pig occasionally finds an acorn. References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C6E42124C5DCsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > > "The CEO of AETNA made $24 million last year." > > HOLY CRAP! obviously something is SERIOUSLY awry. That's an obscene amount > of money for one man to be taking home. I wonder how many deaths that > represents (of people either denied care, or looking at it another way, of > those who could have been treated with the bulk of that money) That's what's wrong with profit in healthcare, obscene amounts of money for people who make a practice of denying care - it's disgusting. From user at domain.invalid Sun Aug 23 00:39:14 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Sun Aug 23 00:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Wildlife Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo wrote: > > > Eh....I think I'll stick to my plan instead of importing toad eating > snakes.....I used to have some kind of small unidentified snake come > shooting out from under my shed one day while I was working near the > back of said shed.....scared the shite out of me...not because it was a > snake (they really don't bother me.....much), but from the suddern > unknown creature movement. Yeah, they're mostly harmless but it is wise to treat them with respect/caution. And you couldn't buy a tiger snake if you wanted to and (believe me) you wouldn't want to. Your plan is good. From nobody at devnull.spamcop.net Sun Aug 23 13:37:24 2009 From: nobody at devnull.spamcop.net (Miss Betsy) Date: Sun Aug 23 13:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: So, what heating source do I want? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Didn't mention solar? I am not sure about ground source heat pumps, but I read years and years ago about houses that were built so that they had underground temperature and that seemed to me to make the most sense. Sometimes you have to heat, but all in all it was efficient. Miss Betsy "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C3FD037F1547TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > The new house will be ultra insulated (or whatever the stupid term is). > And all that. And I want to front-load everything - to pay for > efficiencies with my mortgage and not with future potential increases in > price of raw materials. Well. You maybe get the point. But, shit, there > are so many fricking choices. The greenies tell you that ground source > heat pumps (and, yeah, I've seen the wiki) are the greatest thing ever. > But a ridiculously small number of people install them each year. Well, > golly, I'm not stupid - if only 10 people are jumping off of the bridge > I'm > staying put. Hello! > > There's also on-demand hot water. Sure, you can get efficient burners > (what? Only ~78%? WTF?) so you don't have heat loss and bla bla bla but, > like, what? It's just a crap technology to begin with. And for whole- > house heating it sux. Besides, when trying to shower your water goes > hot/cold/hot/cold. Sux and sux some more. > > Oil is out of the question. > > I could to wood but it's so fricking impractical it isn't even funny. > > So, yeah. I'm thinking geo or lpg boiler/tank. I hate the thought of > using electricity for the geo. And still think it's a bad idea. And > tanks > are supposed to be fundamentally bad. And there is a limit to how much > money there is in building the house, eh? From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Sun Aug 23 20:30:07 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Sun Aug 23 20:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Farelf wrote: > > Sorry to hear of your travails. Others head for Java and find a boat > heading south ... but that's another story. Well, not really, the UN > keeps telling us we have to accept more refugees, even if they're not > applying before their 'fait accompli' arrivals, so something has to > give. Some wish our authorities would just tell the UN to go take a > running jump, we have enough alienated minorities already. But > apparently 'integration' is a dirty word now, equated with 'genocide' > through some fantastic but supposedly effortless logic which only evades > unreconstitued bigots. > > Anyway, it shouldn't be that hard for ordinary folks so I'm sorry to > hear that it is. Of course we have to be careful of those from 'the old > country'. That's where all those awful *convicts* came from. (Joke! joke). It was no problem getting in, it was just getting the paper work sorted so I could actually get a job. At least it is sorted and I have PR now, all the pain was upfront. The UK on the other hand, even if you have a visa, they keep changing the programs so halfway through, you have to reapply, requalify, etc. And now I hear they are bringing in all that stuff for getting passports, so they can give out less of those in the future. From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Sun Aug 23 21:07:51 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Sun Aug 23 21:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Mr K Mean wrote in news:h6ld2o$kgu$1 > @news.spamcop.net: > >> And then eventually you might get your visa. Only took about a year for >> me. If they haven't already shut down the immigration program. Umm, too >> late. I think I snuck in by like a few weeks before they cut it all by >> like 80%. Probably upped the fees too since then. > > Is that just for the year or for perpetuity? How is it going for you down > under, are you working now? Did you sort out your bike? I'm permanent now. I think the only thing to look out for is that the visa expires in four years or something and I don't get a passport, then I have to pay fees every time I reenter the country. My neighbor is Japanese and has been here 10 years or so, but since Japan doesn't do dual citizenships, she has to go through all of that. Down under is ok. It will probably be better once the winter is over. Our house is really cold and it has been cold and windy and rainy so much. I got a job 3 months ago. Part of it might be that after not working for nearly a year, working really sucks. I think ideally I would like to work 9 months or so. But the job isn't great, tiny company with lots of problems, so I'm slowly looking for something else. It is bearable and I'm employed so I'll take my time and find something much more suited to me. Got my replacement bike frame probably a month ago. I need to get to building a new bike here soon. I should get that done before summer. The urgency has been lessened a little since I got myself a motorcycle. I've been riding that 3 times a week and cycling the other 2. That seems to be whole lot less wearing on me. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 24 09:35:15 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Mon Aug 24 09:40:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h6np7n$2fg$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Charles" wrote in message > news:Xns9C6EDFCC799BETheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > : No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! > : > : > My banks have sent out hard copy notices that they NEVER EVER ask for > : > much less require secure information by email or on line. > : > : And if you have a Visa card and purchase with it online then web sites > : still often pull up the "Verified by Visa" BS in a frame inside of the > : transaction window. Even if your bank doesn't do anything. > : > : Of course, were I ever to fill in any information in one of those and if > it > : was legit then Visa would surely call me to ask what was wrong :) > : > : But there is no indication WHATSOEVER that those frames are legit. And > : making them illegit would be so fricking easy it isn't even funny. > > Too many questions or I'm not happy I back out and pass on the deal. > > Then there're all the activex controls, and js that your banks web site wants to run, which by the way are only offering functionless marketing or "Rich Internet Experience" and can all be (but must be declined) when they offer to run. From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 24 21:29:09 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 24 21:30:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > "Bar0" wrote in news:h6mdj7$lmi$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> my banks do it too, , 'course I only log in 'bout 2X a year, and I can;t >> remember which one of their stupid pictures I was looking at. > > you don't use online banking? i do just about everything online, i hardly > use any stamps at all these days. I can't even remember the last time I licked a stamp. These days I try to lick far more interesting things... From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 24 21:32:05 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 24 21:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: don't listen to Indi, Borg, he's a slut..... :D > > What and I'm not? From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 24 21:32:43 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 24 21:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h6nmd8$3of$2@news.spamcop.net: > > >> My neighbor suggested that it was my giving her a quick kiss on the >> cheek that scared her off. I dunno, I thought it was a nice way to >> say "I like you" without going too far. Can I get the POV from the >> female-ish lurkers here? :) >> > > I don't think a quick peck on the cheek would have bothered her, ESPECIALLY > if she DID like you. If she didn't... well it wouldn't have gone anywhere > anyway most likely so it makes no difference. So true. Oh well, there is truth to the saying "Many fish in the sea". Plus now that I have three aquariums, I have a ready supply of fish should I need them. :-P From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Aug 24 23:02:41 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Mon Aug 24 23:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C71DE351D53ATheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was Borgholio ! > >> These days I try to lick far more interesting things... > > Like slugs? Very cool. Eww, slugs? ALL over my lettuce and fennel. Yuck. And snails, I don't ever remember seeing snails around here but I've got those too, little bitty ones all over my veg. I guess my "EscarGO" didn't work...... From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 25 00:19:15 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 25 00:25:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6veuj$cr4$2@news.spamcop.net... : Heidi wrote: : don't listen to Indi, Borg, he's a slut..... :D : > : > : : What and I'm not? Pays to advertize. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 25 00:20:10 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 25 00:25:06 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6vevp$cr4$3@news.spamcop.net... : Sylvesterthekat wrote: : > Borgholio wrote in : > news:h6nmd8$3of$2@news.spamcop.net: : > : > : >> My neighbor suggested that it was my giving her a quick kiss on the : >> cheek that scared her off. I dunno, I thought it was a nice way to : >> say "I like you" without going too far. Can I get the POV from the : >> female-ish lurkers here? :) : >> : > : > I don't think a quick peck on the cheek would have bothered her, ESPECIALLY : > if she DID like you. If she didn't... well it wouldn't have gone anywhere : > anyway most likely so it makes no difference. : : So true. Oh well, there is truth to the saying "Many fish in the sea". : Plus now that I have three aquariums, I have a ready supply of fish should : I need them. :-P Borg's bait shop and sushi bar. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 25 00:21:33 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 25 00:25:07 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h6vep4$cr4$1@news.spamcop.net... : Sylvesterthekat wrote: : > "Bar0" wrote in news:h6mdj7$lmi$1@news.spamcop.net: : > : > : >> my banks do it too, , 'course I only log in 'bout 2X a year, and I can;t : >> remember which one of their stupid pictures I was looking at. : > : > you don't use online banking? i do just about everything online, i hardly : > use any stamps at all these days. : : I can't even remember the last time I licked a stamp. These days I try to : lick far more interesting things... Sushi ... From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Tue Aug 25 01:06:39 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Tue Aug 25 01:10:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Charles wrote in > news:Xns9C6E623A740ECTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61: > >> I hate those things! You also have to remember all sorts of passwords >> and whatnot. Bleh. > > LOL well yeah, otherwise how are they gonna know it's you? Be glad you're > not in the UK, they have a much more complex system there, it's hideous. I like my UK banks. I like logging in with a hard token, although I would be screwed if I lost the token thing, until they sent me a new one. It seems a lot more secure, especially using public terminals. They can steal my password but only have 30 seconds on the token until they are out of luck. (Unless they cracked the whole RSA thing, then the world is probably a bit screwed.) From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Tue Aug 25 01:20:42 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Tue Aug 25 01:25:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Mr K Mean wrote in > news:h6sp59$56c$1@news.spamcop.net: > > Yeah I remember my sister went through the same thing. She just became a > citizen a few months ago. Your Japanese neighbour could get citizenship > and just not tell Japan that she'd done it. She'd have to enter Japan > with her Australian passport but so what? Maybe there is another way around it. It wasn't my problem so I didn't pursue all the things she could have done. > Whereabouts are you, Melbourne area or similar? Obviously not up on the > gold coast or some such, it doesn't exactly get cold there. Yeah, Melbourne. Mostly cold and rainy and really windy. There are supposed to be 100km winds today. >> Got my replacement bike frame probably a month ago. I need to get to >> building a new bike here soon. I should get that done before summer. >> The urgency has been lessened a little since I got myself a >> motorcycle. I've been riding that 3 times a week and cycling the other >> 2. That seems to be whole lot less wearing on me. > > Feeling your age, or is it the weather? Mind you, you rode all the time > in Blighty so I can't imagine it's that! I'm more feeling the distance. It is 20 km to work and the outer suburbs get pretty hilly. And the roads are pretty hard core. There are a few roads where I'm kind of ashamed (as a hardened London cyclists) that are just way too dangerous and I'm retreated to the sidewalk - three lanes of 80 km/hr traffic that will not even give up a tiny sliver of the outside lane. Riding 2 to 2 1/2 hours a day was really taking its toll and left me with almost no free time. Not that I've saved so much time even on a motorcycle but physically I'm not so wiped out all the time. I'm slowly looking for a new job, hopefully in the city center. A 7 km ride to work would be a dream and I wouldn't think twice about cycling that every day. And the city center is much more suited to cycling than the outer suburbs. I am a little worried about getting home tonight (rode my bike today). The gusts are supposed to be against me, the gusts of up to 100 km. From avoozl at spamcop.net Tue Aug 25 03:12:57 2009 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Tue Aug 25 03:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Mr K Mean" wrote in message news:h6vrh0$57u$1@news.spamcop.net... > I like my UK banks. I like logging in with a hard token, although I would > be screwed if I lost the token thing, until they sent me a new one. It > seems a lot more secure, especially using public terminals. They can steal > my password but only have 30 seconds on the token until they are out of > luck. (Unless they cracked the whole RSA thing, then the world is probably > a bit screwed.) RSA has been cracked many times over.. depending on the bits. :) However, I doubt even the government would have much luck in 30 seconds. From user at domain.invalid Tue Aug 25 13:21:12 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Tue Aug 25 13:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More "google is bad" comments In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > You get hundreds of hits when you search on beer exercise (no quotes, in > that order) that are all for exactly the same information - some completely > bogus "study" that was done at the U of Granada. Yeah, sure, there are a > few other links mixed in there but they're sure hard to see. So... Why > can't we have a "same information" filter? Get rid of all of the crappy > dupes! > > And I'd still like to see something that lets me filter out all blogs. Well, you can improve it a bit by using something like beer exercise -blog -granada -forum That does something strange to the estimated hits though: Results 1 - 10 of about 4,660,000 Google has some sort of duplicate filter but it only seems to work when there are a low number of hits. Yeah, lots of room for improvement. From user at domain.invalid Tue Aug 25 16:06:48 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Tue Aug 25 16:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More "google is bad" comments In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: ... > > But, really, I was just trying to find those studies that show that: > - alcohol slows your metabolism for 3 days > - alcohol prevents your muscles from recovering after a hard workout > > Alas, life isn't that easy. Well, a search on metabolic effects alcohol training will get you quite different results, especially if you select the "Scholarly articles" (grrr - then a lot of that is 'by subscription'). I'm not sure it would be of any greater help though. Lots of stuff about rats and alcoholics and alcoholic rats and small sample studies of humans (everyone - lobby for increases to research grants we need very *large* samples). I even found one indicating that enemata of alcohol, dextrose, and levulose are as readily absorbed as oral administration. But we already suspected that from the example of that Darwin Award guy a few years back. But this was in 1915 when there were lots of people in Europe suddenly missing mouths and throats and stomachs and things, I guess. You're right, it isn't easy. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 25 17:52:14 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 25 17:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] why do we need Death Panels? Message-ID: Just came for a dog and pony show on senior (55+) health issue and what we can do to improve our general health and medical condition. Folk that put on the show showed up with tons of BBQ, pulled pork, links, brisket, ladles of BBQ sauce, sides: apple and peach cobbler, homemade sweet cream ice-cream, lots of fired onion rings and gallons of sweet tea. (not one smoked chicken) After the presentation I asked about the fair ... all I got was blank stares as the question and the problem went right over their heads. Makes one wonder ... why do we need Death Panels? From fiyntyd02 at sneakemail.com Tue Aug 25 17:52:19 2009 From: fiyntyd02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K. Mean) Date: Tue Aug 25 17:55:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles said the following on 25/08/09 21:25: > It wasn't me! It was Mr K Mean! > >> I'm slowly looking for a new job, hopefully in the city center. > > I won't tell you where you could get a job again 'cause you're obviously > not interested. But it could think about happening if you were. Ha. And > you'd love field work. Take me home, country roads, to the place I belong... Might be a tough commute. Not sure how I would handle crossing the international date line twice a day. >> I am a little worried about getting home tonight (rode my bike today). >> The gusts are supposed to be against me, the gusts of up to 100 km. > > That sounds pretty hardcore. I don't think you'd be much better off on the > other 'cycle, eh? The state emergency agency called an emergency and urged everybody to leave work at 3.30. Can't argue with that, can you? I rode to the nearest train station and caught a train instead of riding home. It had just started getting a little crazy by then. By the time I made it into the city center to catch my connecting train, the rain was pretty torrential. I would have been so wet. Would have been awful riding either way. A few nights I have been coming home and been pretty nervous as the gusts have rocked me back and forth on the motorcycle. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 25 18:27:03 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 25 18:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" : : stamps are usually self sticking these days anyway Don't ... go ... there ... From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 25 18:28:54 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 25 18:30:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C729D3B13921sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : Charles wrote in : news:Xns9C71DDF5DEC88TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61: : : : > ONE password is fine. You don't need the multiple pages of questions, : > authentications and stuff. : > : : heh... tell that to Nat West : : it's actually smart, you have a login and a password and rather than type : the whole thing in, they ask randomly for (eg) the first, third and fifth : character from your password and login. the weak link in the scheme are the : idiots who give out their passwords to phishers Won't work for folk who are dyslexic. From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Aug 25 18:32:17 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Aug 25 18:35:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h6vevp$cr4$3@news.spamcop.net: > > >> So true. Oh well, there is truth to the saying "Many fish in the >> sea". Plus now that I have three aquariums, I have a ready supply of >> fish should I need them. :-P >> > > just don't think of getting amorous with any of them! I dunno...goldfish love to nibble. From r.c.bates at btinternet.com Tue Aug 25 19:40:57 2009 From: r.c.bates at btinternet.com (Robert Bates) Date: Tue Aug 25 19:45:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] The TruthNBP Unregistered. Message-ID: CHILD ABUSE OF A FOUR YEAR OLD To begin with I am tired of holding this secret so those that are guilty will benefit from my silence. This is not an attempt at harrassment or slander of any person. The Australian police have already attempted to silence me, GO TO HELL !!! This is a factual account experienced by me of allegations made by my son James Bates against Mr Ronald Armstrong, father of Tanya Armstrong ( now Bates). Paul Armstrong, Simon Armstrong. He was to my knowledge married to Louise Armstrong. They were residents of the state of Victoria, Australia. More specifically the Mornington Penninsula, Rosebud. While a minor my son James Bates accused Ronald Armstrong of sexually assaulting him at the age of four. He was penetrated anally. As his legal guardian and the parent who had contact with the police to give consent for the investigation to go ahead, I have first hand knowledge of these allegations. James is now eighteen years old and can still remember what happened to him vividly. My ex wife Tanya Bates told me that she had been sexually abused by her father from the age of nine to nineteen. In full knowledge of what her father did to her she allowed my children James Bates, Samantha Bates, Nickolas Bates to spend time around this man. I have first hand knowledge of this as I am an eye witness to these events. As conveyed to me by the police child protection team in Lowestoft, after the investigation Mr Ronald Armstrong was sent to prison for the abuse of my ex wife but he denied the abuse of my son. I as the father of Samantha and Nickolas Bates have repeatedly been denied access to my children in Australia because my ex wife knows very well I will tell the children the truth. Late last year , 2009, I attempted to contact my children in Australia only to be told in the first phone call by my ex wife that my daughter Samantha had been abused by her ex partner Darren who was an alcoholic. I attempted to get the information out of my daughter via MSN messenger but she would not say as she had discussed things with her mother and for brodies sake, the son of the alcoholic, that they should keep things quiet. After finding this out I wrote some abusive emails to her and have been telling her friends about the abuse of my eldest son. Through interpol the Australian Police have attempted to have me charged with harrassment. I signed an unofficial warning in the Suffolk policemans notebook. The police in the UK know very well what is going on and I was treated very leniently. Hearing that your second eldest child has been abused as well would make any parent go insane. To be honest I hope that abuse victims throughout the world read this. Yes, my ex wife was abused by her father but it does not give her the moral right to abuse my children. Her father was abused as well and he is in prison. Why wasn't my ex wife charged with child neglect for knowingly allowing my children to be around a known peadophile ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://zeta.cesmail.net/pipermail/scsocial/attachments/20090826/d1f4faf3/attachment.htm From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Tue Aug 25 19:55:06 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Tue Aug 25 20:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Chris F. Willoughby wrote: > "Mr K Mean" wrote in message > news:h6vrh0$57u$1@news.spamcop.net... >> I like my UK banks. I like logging in with a hard token, although I would >> be screwed if I lost the token thing, until they sent me a new one. It >> seems a lot more secure, especially using public terminals. They can steal >> my password but only have 30 seconds on the token until they are out of >> luck. (Unless they cracked the whole RSA thing, then the world is probably >> a bit screwed.) > > RSA has been cracked many times over.. depending on the bits. :) However, I > doubt even the government would have much luck in 30 seconds. I think anybody trying to crack my RSA code on my bank account would lock my online account way before they crack the code. I think I get 4 strikes then I'm out. It would probably be easier to call and pretend to be me and guess my secret questions. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 25 19:57:21 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 25 20:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C729EDBA5885sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : "Frog Prince" wrote in : news:h71ok8$h2f$2@news.spamcop.net: : : > : : > Won't work for folk who are dyslexic. : > : > : > : : lol perhaps not... they'd be up the proverbial creek Same problem with phone trees and those 800-numbers I've come home and found my wife in tears over those systems. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 25 19:59:14 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 25 20:05:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: why do we need Death Panels? References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C729E87541DDsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : "Frog Prince" wrote in : news:h71meo$f82$1@news.spamcop.net: : : > Just came for a dog and pony show on senior (55+) health issue and : > what we can do to improve our general health and medical condition. : > : > Folk that put on the show showed up with tons of BBQ, pulled pork, : > links, brisket, ladles of BBQ sauce, sides: apple and peach cobbler, : > homemade sweet cream ice-cream, lots of fired onion rings and gallons : > of sweet tea. (not one smoked chicken) : > : > After the presentation I asked about the fair ... all I got was blank : > stares as the question and the problem went right over their heads. : > : > Makes one wonder ... why do we need Death Panels? : > : : ROFL that's bloody hilarious. I'm surprised they didn't also bring booze : and cigars! Would not have helped but would have been VERY popular. From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Tue Aug 25 20:30:58 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Tue Aug 25 20:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Mr K Mean wrote in > news:h6vrh0$57u$1@news.spamcop.net: > >> I like my UK banks. I like logging in with a hard token, although I >> would be screwed if I lost the token thing, until they sent me a new >> one. It seems a lot more secure, especially using public terminals. >> They can steal my password but only have 30 seconds on the token until >> they are out of luck. (Unless they cracked the whole RSA thing, then >> the world is probably a bit screwed.) > > I haven't encountered the token thing. They did send me a gizmo like a > calculator which I haven't yet had to use but supposedly it generates a one > time code or something, which you need if you do something like create a > new payee The hard token is a little gizmo you put on your keychain and generates new codes every 30 seconds or so. That code should match up with the same codes being generated on the server. It is the same system that most VPN authorization systems use. I suppose there are vulnerabilities, if both the token and the server are generating the same codes, there must be a way to replicate that and get the same results, but it is a big step over having somebody being able to guess your dog's name/password. I guess used in conjunction with your normal password, it feels reasonably secure. From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Tue Aug 25 20:35:14 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Tue Aug 25 20:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > "Mr K. Mean" wrote in > news:h71meo$f81$1@news.spamcop.net: > >> The state emergency agency called an emergency and urged everybody to >> leave work at 3.30. Can't argue with that, can you? I rode to the >> nearest train station and caught a train instead of riding home. It >> had just started getting a little crazy by then. By the time I made it >> into the city center to catch my connecting train, the rain was pretty >> torrential. I would have been so wet. Would have been awful riding >> either way. A few nights I have been coming home and been pretty >> nervous as the gusts have rocked me back and forth on the motorcycle. > > Ahh, glad to hear you got home on some form of alternative transport! Gotta > love those Aussies and their 'people come first' attitude. The trains are not so bad. At one point they tried to ban bikes but that didn't go through. It is just that the trains don't go the right way. Suburb to suburb always has to go into the city and back out on another line. They really need a ring line. It makes an hour bike ride into generally 1 1/2 hours on the train. And the main disadvantage is getting into the city in the morning to catch your connecting train. You have to go way early, if you wait until after 730 or so, there is no prayer of getting a bike on, just too crowded. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 25 20:38:10 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Tue Aug 25 20:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: why do we need Death Panels? References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h71meo$f82$1@news.spamcop.net... > Just came for a dog and pony show on senior (55+) health issue and what we > can do to improve our general health and medical condition. > > Folk that put on the show showed up with tons of BBQ, pulled pork, links, > brisket, ladles of BBQ sauce, sides: apple and peach cobbler, homemade > sweet > cream ice-cream, lots of fired onion rings and gallons of sweet tea. (not > one smoked chicken) > > After the presentation I asked about the fair ... all I got was blank > stares > as the question and the problem went right over their heads. > > Makes one wonder ... why do we need Death Panels? So Generation X-ers can get their promotions sooner, AND pay lower payroll taxes in the long run. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 25 20:39:29 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Tue Aug 25 20:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: "Mr K. Mean" wrote in message news:h71meo$f81$1@news.spamcop.net... > Charles said the following on 25/08/09 21:25: >> It wasn't me! It was Mr K Mean! >> >>> I'm slowly looking for a new job, hopefully in the city center. >> >> I won't tell you where you could get a job again 'cause you're obviously >> not interested. But it could think about happening if you were. Ha. >> And >> you'd love field work. > > Take me home, country roads, to the place I belong... > > Might be a tough commute. Not sure how I would handle crossing the > international date line twice a day. > >>> I am a little worried about getting home tonight (rode my bike today). >>> The gusts are supposed to be against me, the gusts of up to 100 km. >> >> That sounds pretty hardcore. I don't think you'd be much better off on >> the >> other 'cycle, eh? > > The state emergency agency called an emergency and urged everybody to > leave work at 3.30. Can't argue with that, can you? I rode to the nearest > train station and caught a train instead of riding home. It had just > started getting a little crazy by then. By the time I made it into the > city center to catch my connecting train, the rain was pretty torrential. > I would have been so wet. Would have been awful riding either way. A few > nights I have been coming home and been pretty nervous as the gusts have > rocked me back and forth on the motorcycle. You'rw just not a real biker! From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 25 20:41:15 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Tue Aug 25 20:45:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h71u19$lh3$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message > news:Xns9C729EDBA5885sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > : "Frog Prince" wrote in > : news:h71ok8$h2f$2@news.spamcop.net: > : > : > > : > : > Won't work for folk who are dyslexic. > : > > : > > : > > : > : lol perhaps not... they'd be up the proverbial creek > > Same problem with phone trees and those 800-numbers > > I've come home and found my wife in tears over those systems. Huh? other than being over the phone, where do phone trees and 800 numbers collide? From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 25 20:46:35 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Tue Aug 25 20:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ahhh...dating.... References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C729CFB734EAsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > Borgholio wrote in > news:h6vevp$cr4$3@news.spamcop.net: > > >> So true. Oh well, there is truth to the saying "Many fish in the >> sea". Plus now that I have three aquariums, I have a ready supply of >> fish should I feed them. :-P >> > > just don't think of getting amorous with any of them! Yes! feed them. From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Tue Aug 25 21:00:06 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Tue Aug 25 21:05:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: bar0 wrote: > "Mr K. Mean" wrote in message >> The state emergency agency called an emergency and urged everybody to >> leave work at 3.30. Can't argue with that, can you? I rode to the nearest >> train station and caught a train instead of riding home. It had just >> started getting a little crazy by then. By the time I made it into the >> city center to catch my connecting train, the rain was pretty torrential. >> I would have been so wet. Would have been awful riding either way. A few >> nights I have been coming home and been pretty nervous as the gusts have >> rocked me back and forth on the motorcycle. > > You'rw just not a real biker! Sadly probably not on either account. My commitment to sustainable cycling cracked in the face of 25 miles a day. And after a month of 3 days a week on the motorcycle, I'm still not confident enough to try the highway. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 25 21:11:16 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 25 21:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: why do we need Death Panels? References: Message-ID: "bar0" wrote in message news:h7205p$nig$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : news:h71meo$f82$1@news.spamcop.net... : > Just came for a dog and pony show on senior (55+) health issue and what we : > can do to improve our general health and medical condition. : > : > Folk that put on the show showed up with tons of BBQ, pulled pork, links, : > brisket, ladles of BBQ sauce, sides: apple and peach cobbler, homemade : > sweet : > cream ice-cream, lots of fired onion rings and gallons of sweet tea. (not : > one smoked chicken) : > : > After the presentation I asked about the fair ... all I got was blank : > stares : > as the question and the problem went right over their heads. : > : > Makes one wonder ... why do we need Death Panels? : : So Generation X-ers can get their promotions sooner, AND pay lower payroll : taxes in the long run. Recall Here's to bloody wars and sickly seasons. -old British Army toast? Early promotions perhaps but I doubt the tax will go down. From me at privacy.net Tue Aug 25 21:20:07 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Aug 25 21:25:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "bar0" < : > : : > : > Won't work for folk who are dyslexic. : > : > : > : > : > : > : > : : > : lol perhaps not... they'd be up the proverbial creek : > : > Same problem with phone trees and those 800-numbers : > : > I've come home and found my wife in tears over those systems. : : Huh? other than being over the phone, where do phone trees and 800 numbers : collide? Phone trees require an interaction process that most dyslexics don't handle well. Typically the process can only go three levels deep before the trail is lost. The 800-NUM-BERS require a translation process that is likewise difficult for dyslexics to manage. An aside the print work our studio has done when clients insist on the LET-TER-NUMB system (it's so cute) vs LET-TER-NUMB & 123-456-7890 those promotions with LET-TER-NUMB result in a much lower response. So apparently it's not only dyslexics that don't appreciate the 'cute' Might correct one part of my post. My wife was suffering tears of rage. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Aug 25 21:31:05 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Tue Aug 25 21:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h722kc$pjs$2@news.spamcop.net... > > "bar0" < > : > : > : > : > Won't work for folk who are dyslexic. > : > : > > : > : > > : > : > > : > : > : > : lol perhaps not... they'd be up the proverbial creek > : > > : > Same problem with phone trees and those 800-numbers > : > > : > I've come home and found my wife in tears over those systems. > : > : Huh? other than being over the phone, where do phone trees and 800 > numbers > : collide? > > Phone trees require an interaction process that most dyslexics don't > handle > well. Typically the process can only go three levels deep before the trail > is lost. The 800-NUM-BERS require a translation process that is likewise > difficult for dyslexics to manage. > > An aside the print work our studio has done when clients insist on the > LET-TER-NUMB system (it's so cute) vs LET-TER-NUMB & 123-456-7890 > those promotions with LET-TER-NUMB result in a much lower response. So > apparently it's not only dyslexics that don't appreciate the 'cute' > > Might correct one part of my post. My wife was suffering tears of rage. > > Ahhhhhh, I was thinking 1 800 123-4567, against an emergency phone tree, I call 4 parents in turn they call 4 each etc., and didn't make the connection at all, you're thinking hierarchichal answering systems. The thing that gets me is looking up a number, turning, to the phone dialing the area code and maybe the prefix, turn back to fiind the rest of the number, and these days the phone system bails before I find it again on the page. From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Tue Aug 25 21:37:56 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Tue Aug 25 21:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Mr K Mean wrote in > news:h6vsbc$5mr$1@news.spamcop.net: > >> Yeah, Melbourne. Mostly cold and rainy and really windy. There are >> supposed to be 100km winds today. > > Are you fixed on Melbourne for some reason? Maybe Brisbane would suit > you better! It is where my gf wanted to move back to, where she lived before the UK. She didn't want to go to Perth (bit of a cow town really). All her friends are here now. Not sure I'm a Brisbane sort of person though. Isn't it still a bit fascist up there? (Yeah, I know Labour runs it now.) >> I'm more feeling the distance. It is 20 km to work and the outer >> suburbs get pretty hilly. And the roads are pretty hard core. There >> are a few roads where I'm kind of ashamed (as a hardened London >> cyclists) that are just way too dangerous and I'm retreated to the >> sidewalk - three lanes of 80 km/hr traffic that will not even give up >> a tiny sliver of the outside lane. > > Ugh, that sounds like not fun at all! I'm surprised that they don't have > cycle lanes, they're all about being progressive there after all. 20km > is a bit of a slog too, and hills to boot. Oh, they have cycle lanes. The local councils have ticked all those boxes. The main busy street that goes to Burwood, three lanes either side, speed limits of 60-80 km/hr is a bike route. About every 50 meters, they have painted a bicycle on the road with about six dotted lines next to it. I haven't figured out how to use that bike lane yet, I think you get to ride on it for the 10 meters then you have to get off and walk on the pavement the 50 meters until the next one. While I'm confused by it, car drivers are even more confused by it and react to it by pretending it isn't even there. But the outer suburbs are probably a different animal than the inner city which seems somewhat more friendly to cycling. >> I am a little worried about getting home tonight (rode my bike today). >> The gusts are supposed to be against me, the gusts of up to 100 km. > > Is the bus an option? Do they have bike racks on the front? Bus, no, not a chance. Or trams either. Besides, a bus home would probably take like 2 hours to get home. From user at domain.invalid Wed Aug 26 03:18:36 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Wed Aug 26 03:20:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mr K Mean wrote: > > It is where my gf wanted to move back to, where she lived before the UK. > She didn't want to go to Perth (bit of a cow town really). Wise woman, stay away! And as recently as 30 years ago you could see the CBD from the cow paddocks. Well, "Wiv a ladder and wiv glahses," as the poet said. But literally is not what she/you meant. Terrible place anyway, too many people here already :). And the public transport's not as good. No, seriously, there's more job, social and cultural opportunities in Melbourne or in Sydney and if Melbourne is where her friends are, it's a no-brainer. The weather is quite exceptional just now, not usually that bad. Always notorious by Oz standards but not bad, it's all relative. But winter's not the ideal time to be riding bikes there, in any year. And don't get your bike wheel caught in a tram track, anytime. As for the Socialist People's Queenslandic Republic (SPQR) - well lots of Victorians end up there so it's probably a good place for refined endings. Well, every place is good for something - I've loved them all, those I've been to, come to think of it. From me at privacy.net Wed Aug 26 12:10:15 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Aug 26 12:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Phones was Re: "Issuing bank's web site" References: Message-ID: X-No-Archive: Yes © 2008 all rights reserved; no portion of this post may be used anywhere else or archived without written permission "bar0" wrote in message news:h72390$q3j$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : news:h722kc$pjs$2@news.spamcop.net... : > : > "bar0" < : > : > : : > : > : > Won't work for folk who are dyslexic. : > : > : lol perhaps not... they'd be up the proverbial creek : > : > : > : > Same problem with phone trees and those 800-numbers : > : > : > : > I've come home and found my wife in tears over those systems. : > : : > : Huh? other than being over the phone, where do phone trees and 800 : > numbers collide? : > : > Phone trees require an interaction process that most dyslexics don't : > handle : > well. Typically the process can only go three levels deep before the trail : > is lost. The 800-NUM-BERS require a translation process that is likewise : > difficult for dyslexics to manage. : > : > An aside the print work our studio has done when clients insist on the : > LET-TER-NUMB system (it's so cute) vs LET-TER-NUMB & 123-456-7890 : > those promotions with LET-TER-NUMB result in a much lower response. So : > apparently it's not only dyslexics that don't appreciate the 'cute' : > : > Might correct one part of my post. My wife was suffering tears of rage. : > : > : : Ahhhhhh, I was thinking 1 800 123-4567, against an emergency phone tree, I : call 4 parents in turn they call 4 each etc., and didn't make the connection : at all, you're thinking hierarchichal answering systems. : : The thing that gets me is looking up a number, turning, to the phone dialing : the area code and maybe the prefix, turn back to fiind the rest of the : number, and these days the phone system bails before I find it again on the : page. What tears me personally are the odd way the LATA are configured. As example I've a friend that is near us they have a voice phone and a fax phone. Voice phone is long distance (requires a 1) and the fax phone is local. Everything goes through the same lines, the same switch, into their home on the same copper ... WTF We have unlimited US toll free calling same as our cell phone. My cell phone I don' need to dial the 1, on my land line I'm required to dial the 1 in some cases and not in other. Ok I can game that. Now the system will require me to dial 1 on a given call to a number then next time I call that same number I get an intercept that I'm not require to dial a 1. grrrrrrrr From user at domain.invalid Thu Aug 27 00:35:38 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Thu Aug 27 00:40:02 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Beer up Message-ID: Where are those 'green buds': http://money.cnn.com/2009/08/25/news/companies/anheuser_busch/?postversion=2009082614 Sure, compensate for reduced sales volume by increasing price, makes perfect sense. This it global, not just USA. Ok, 'here' in Oz the preferred solution (heh!) is to reduce alcohol content which attracts lower excise, price stays the same. And it's already happened. Reducing alcohol level would have lead to riots (and blood) in the streets once upon a time - but we've become so testicularly-challenged of late that now it passes without so much as a whimper. Everyone knows the next phase in that cycle is to hike up the excise rate so the govt can make up reduced revenue. It just spreads out the process (and distends bladders). Ah, is this how the 'end-times' begin? I'm thinking Ragnar?k, I'm thinking G?tterd?mmerung, I'm thinking tap-water. Oh well, the 'home-brewing' movement just got a shot in the arm, I guess, but not for everyone the interval to tippling-time. Well, there's the brewing co-ops. From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Thu Aug 27 00:54:34 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Thu Aug 27 00:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Beer up In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Farelf wrote: > > Ah, is this how the 'end-times' begin? I'm thinking Ragnar?k, I'm > thinking G?tterd?mmerung, I'm thinking tap-water. Oh well, the > 'home-brewing' movement just got a shot in the arm, I guess, but not for > everyone the interval to tippling-time. Well, there's the brewing co-ops. Well, I got the fermenter with my first batch going in my home bunker> Am going for a golden ale. I had to give it a blanket and a heater to keep it warm enough. My house is so cold. I think I slightly screwed up. I forgot to take a reading when I first started it. Now 2 weeks later, it is coming up as 1180. I think. The scale is confusing me. I guess I won't be able to find the difference and get the alcohol content, but is there anything useful I can get from it at this point? Do I just wait until it stops bubbling (not bubbing so much at this point anyways) and bottle it and hope for the best? From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Thu Aug 27 01:04:55 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Thu Aug 27 01:05:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Farelf wrote: > Mr K Mean wrote: >> >> It is where my gf wanted to move back to, where she lived before the >> UK. She didn't want to go to Perth (bit of a cow town really). > > Wise woman, stay away! And as recently as 30 years ago you could see the > CBD from the cow paddocks. Well, "Wiv a ladder and wiv glahses," as the > poet said. But literally is not what she/you meant. Terrible place > anyway, too many people here already :). And the public transport's not > as good. > > No, seriously, there's more job, social and cultural opportunities in > Melbourne or in Sydney and if Melbourne is where her friends are, it's a > no-brainer. The weather is quite exceptional just now, not usually that > bad. Always notorious by Oz standards but not bad, it's all relative. > But winter's not the ideal time to be riding bikes there, in any year. > And don't get your bike wheel caught in a tram track, anytime. > > As for the Socialist People's Queenslandic Republic (SPQR) - well lots > of Victorians end up there so it's probably a good place for refined > endings. Well, every place is good for something - I've loved them all, > those I've been to, come to think of it. Well, she grew up in Perth, so she would know. It didn't seem so horrible there, but it also didn't seem so great. The ocean is pretty nice. Freo was pretty good, not sure I would want to be in central Perth. The train system seemed to be fairly good. It seems about as good as Melbourne's. I didn't spend loads of time there, so I can't say a whole lot about it all. Most of the people she knows did migrate east as soon as they could. I hope the weather is exceptional. I'm not sure about this frequent 60-100 km winds. It is so much rainier than London too. It has been a pretty miserable cycling season. Although 40c days in the summer, I'm not sure that's much better. The tram tracks are not so bad. I might like those roads better anyways since with all the parked cars and all that, nobody can go super fast and there is plenty of time for me to scoot past as they are stopped waiting for something. I worry more about the tram tracks with the motorcycle, those things are slippery. I thought that Queensland still had some lingering traces from the police state it used to be a few years ago. But then I don't really know much about it except what I learned from punk music. From user at domain.invalid Thu Aug 27 01:14:17 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Thu Aug 27 01:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Beer up In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mr K Mean wrote: > > I think I slightly screwed up. I forgot to take a reading when I first > started it. Now 2 weeks later, it is coming up as 1180. I think. The > scale is confusing me. I guess I won't be able to find the difference > and get the alcohol content, but is there anything useful I can get from > it at this point? Do I just wait until it stops bubbling (not bubbing so > much at this point anyways) and bottle it and hope for the best? I don't know. I think we need Charles at this point. Well, his advice. I got to clean up after my son's failed attempt at home-brewing once, but that was after some/many months, apparatus sitting under a gum tree - insufficient basis for contribution but the optimist in me would say 'just bottle it'. From user at domain.invalid Thu Aug 27 01:40:36 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Thu Aug 27 01:45:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mr K Mean wrote: > > I thought that Queensland still had some lingering traces from the > police state it used to be a few years ago. But then I don't really know > much about it except what I learned from punk music. Governments come and go but the police change more slowly, a 'disciplined service' with cultures and traditions and all that. Queensland was the first state to admit they had a problem with (some of) their police force/service so I guess they had a head start in sorting it all out but I think their (anti) 'assembly' law was/became the main problem in perceptions, back in the days of Jo - and that law doesn't seem to on the books/enforced/in the news any more. All police are demonised anyway, South Australia's probably have/had the best reputation but even there, there are 'stories'. Generally I think more people have cause to wish the police in any state would act with *more* authority and incisiveness rather than with less. But it's certainly different if you're young and a little unruly or fit some other profile of concern (aboriginal, biker, bogon ...). Of course police don't profile :). From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Thu Aug 27 03:12:18 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Thu Aug 27 03:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Beer up In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Farelf wrote: > Mr K Mean wrote: >> >> I think I slightly screwed up. I forgot to take a reading when I first >> started it. Now 2 weeks later, it is coming up as 1180. I think. The >> scale is confusing me. I guess I won't be able to find the difference >> and get the alcohol content, but is there anything useful I can get >> from it at this point? Do I just wait until it stops bubbling (not >> bubbing so much at this point anyways) and bottle it and hope for the >> best? > > I don't know. I think we need Charles at this point. Well, his advice. > I got to clean up after my son's failed attempt at home-brewing once, > but that was after some/many months, apparatus sitting under a gum tree > - insufficient basis for contribution but the optimist in me would say > 'just bottle it'. It seems like the main thing is don't bottle too soon. Better to bottle a few days late than 1/2 day early. If the yeast is still too active, you might get explosions. I'm just not sure yet if the readings will tell me that or if I just have to stop hearing the bubbling and go on that. From user at domain.invalid Thu Aug 27 04:05:22 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Thu Aug 27 04:10:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Beer up In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Mr K Mean wrote: > > It seems like the main thing is don't bottle too soon. Better to bottle > a few days late than 1/2 day early. If the yeast is still too active, > you might get explosions. I'm just not sure yet if the readings will > tell me that or if I just have to stop hearing the bubbling and go on that. You certainly can't risk bottling while significant fermentation is still happening - like it says 'here' http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter11-1.html. There might be something on the internet specific to your recipe. Like this Cascade site http://www.cascadehomebrew.com.au/faq/fermentation.asp (down to "Q. How do I know when my fermentation is finished?" but note they are talking about a specific yeast and recipe so times and SG might be quite different). If the worst came to the worst maybe you could just decant and filter a single bottle? Seal that firmly with a cork and keep it at fermentation temperature and it would soon let you know. The cascade site also mentions taste testing - supposedly there is a discernible taste difference day to day while fermentation continues. We need a brewer here! From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 27 08:35:16 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Thu Aug 27 08:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Beer up References: Message-ID: "Farelf" wrote in message news:h752em$i5p$1@news.spamcop.net... > Where are those 'green buds': > > http://money.cnn.com/2009/08/25/news/companies/anheuser_busch/?postversion=2009082614 > > Sure, compensate for reduced sales volume by increasing price, makes > perfect sense. This it global, not just USA. Ok, 'here' in Oz the > preferred solution (heh!) is to reduce alcohol content which attracts > lower excise, price stays the same. And it's already happened. > > Reducing alcohol level would have lead to riots (and blood) in the streets > once upon a time - but we've become so testicularly-challenged of late > that now it passes without so much as a whimper. Everyone knows the next > phase in that cycle is to hike up the excise rate so the govt can make up > reduced revenue. It just spreads out the process (and distends bladders). > > Ah, is this how the 'end-times' begin? I'm thinking Ragnarök, I'm thinking > Götterdämmerung, I'm thinking tap-water. Oh well, the 'home-brewing' > movement just got a shot in the arm, I guess, but not for everyone the > interval to tippling-time. Well, there's the brewing co-ops. It's like 20lb. BBQ propane bottles , filled legally to 18lb. are now filled to 10, but the price remains the same. This saves us money, that we can use to drive to the bottle exchange 50% more often. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 27 10:32:27 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Thu Aug 27 10:35:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: "Mr K Mean" wrote in message news:h7545n$j5m$1@news.spamcop.net... > Farelf wrote: >> Mr K Mean wrote: >>> >>> It is where my gf wanted to move back to, where she lived before the UK. >>> She didn't want to go to Perth (bit of a cow town really). I spent 2 months in Perth in the mid 80's, lovely town, clean, friendly not too big and lot's of nice affordable neighbourhoods. Beach is very accessible, and like in LA or San diego, if you live where the Fremantle doctor blows even hot days are very comfortable. The only issue I had was that the beaches on the Indian Ocean are unusable after lunchtime, unless you enjoy being sandblasted. Fish and chips in Applecroft byt the beach were as good as those they used to make on Spanish Banks beach. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Aug 27 10:39:22 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Thu Aug 27 10:40:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? References: Message-ID: "Farelf" wrote in message news:h7568h$ki6$1@news.spamcop.net... > Mr K Mean wrote: > >> >> I thought that Queensland still had some lingering traces from the police >> state it used to be a few years ago. But then I don't really know much >> about it except what I learned from punk music. > > Governments come and go but the police change more slowly, a 'disciplined > service' with cultures and traditions and all that. > > Queensland was the first state to admit they had a problem with (some of) > their police force/service so I guess they had a head start in sorting it > all out but I think their (anti) 'assembly' law was/became the main > problem in perceptions, back in the days of Jo - and that law doesn't seem > to on the books/enforced/in the news any more. > > All police are demonised anyway, South Australia's probably have/had the > best reputation but even there, there are 'stories'. > > Generally I think more people have cause to wish the police in any state > would act with *more* authority and incisiveness rather than with less. > But it's certainly different if you're young and a little unruly or fit > some other profile of concern (aboriginal, biker, bogon ...). Of course > police don't profile :). If they don't they're not doing their job. From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Aug 27 16:10:18 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Aug 27 16:15:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > I could see the smoke rising up from beyond Glendale when I was out this > morning, are you getting it over you? So far, we're not getting it over > this way, although it might actually help to dilute the sun a bit! Foolish > cat wanted to stay out when I went out earlier this morning. When I got > home an hour and a half later he was very keen to go inside and drink lol > (though he did have a relatively cool patio to sit on - ie 'only' about 90 > at the time). He's now sleeping indoors and won't be going out again until > it's at least below 95! Well it smells like smoke for sure, right now it's officially 100 with estimated 106 at peak temp. I'm not too worried though, I managed to snag a brand new 10k BTU a/c off of craigslist for 35 bucks a few months back. :-P From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Aug 27 16:26:14 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Aug 27 16:30:11 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h76p74$ku4$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Well it smells like smoke for sure, right now it's officially 100 with >> estimated 106 at peak temp. I'm not too worried though, I managed to >> snag a brand new 10k BTU a/c off of craigslist for 35 bucks a few >> months back. :-P >> > > Is that in your window or something? Our AC is coping ok, I only had it > serviced last week so it should be! It's very comfortable inside at about > 75 Yep, in the window...in an enclosed aluminum patio. :) With the AC it's a cool 86 in here right now. Having to keep an eye on the fishies to make sure they don't boil... From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Aug 27 16:35:19 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Aug 27 16:40:10 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Backyard fish ponds + other stuff In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: magus kent wrote: > Link: > > http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/ponds/ > > > a lot of knowledge! Decided to dig myself a 6' diameter, 3' deep pool once my indoor aquariums are completed. Should go "fairly" quickly depending on how fast I can dig. From avoozl at spamcop.net Thu Aug 27 17:36:39 2009 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Thu Aug 27 17:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h76q50$ku4$2@news.spamcop.net... > Yep, in the window...in an enclosed aluminum patio. :) With the AC it's > a cool 86 in here right now. Having to keep an eye on the fishies to make > sure they don't boil... 86? Geez.. I wouldn't even let it get above 80.. probably more like 78. From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Aug 27 17:45:59 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Aug 27 17:50:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Chris F. Willoughby wrote: > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h76q50$ku4$2@news.spamcop.net... >> Yep, in the window...in an enclosed aluminum patio. :) With the AC it's >> a cool 86 in here right now. Having to keep an eye on the fishies to make >> sure they don't boil... > > 86? Geez.. I wouldn't even let it get above 80.. probably more like 78. > > Can't really keep it below 80, gets too hot here. However both of the tanks are kept cool. The large tank is right around 77, it doesn't change temp very quickly due to it's size. The small one is around 79 and I have a fan blowing at the surface of the water, so it won't get above 80. From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Aug 27 18:40:20 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Aug 27 18:45:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h76q50$ku4$2@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Yep, in the window...in an enclosed aluminum patio. :) With the AC >> it's a cool 86 in here right now. Having to keep an eye on the >> fishies to make sure they don't boil... >> > > is there a lot of glass in the patio? Vinyl and acrylic...all the windows are vinyl and acrylic. Roof is corrugated aluminum with about 1/4" insulation. From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Aug 27 18:41:30 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Aug 27 18:45:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h76uqh$ku4$4@news.spamcop.net: > >> Can't really keep it below 80, gets too hot here. However both of the >> tanks are kept cool. The large tank is right around 77, it doesn't >> change temp very quickly due to it's size. The small one is around 79 >> and I have a fan blowing at the surface of the water, so it won't get >> above 80. >> > > ha, i had the exact opposite problem when the heater on my big aquarium > went out overnight in an english winter. i had a heater blowing hot air at > the tank until i could get to the aquarium store and buy a new heater the > next morning. fortunately it didn't drop too low and they all survived It doesn't get as cold in here as it used to before I repaired many of the leaks and windows...but both tanks still need heaters. Actually this will be the first winter for the big tank so it's quite possible I'll need two heaters for it... From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Aug 27 20:09:59 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Aug 27 20:10:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h7722k$ku4$6@news.spamcop.net: > > low and they all survived >> It doesn't get as cold in here as it used to before I repaired many of >> the leaks and windows...but both tanks still need heaters. Actually >> this will be the first winter for the big tank so it's quite possible >> I'll need two heaters for it... >> > > I only had one heater, not sure how many gallons were in the tank but it > was in a corner (so it was kind of diamond shaped) and across the front it > was about 6ft and maybe 2ft high so someone with better math abilities than > me can figure out how many gallons might have been in there! the room it > was in, during the winter months, would probably get down to 50 overnight. > oh i forgot, it also had a filter tank underneath which i'd guess held at > least another 10 gallons. just keep an eye on the temperature on days when > its cold in the room and make sure that it's within a safe range. if not, > get another heater. My big one is about 6x2x2 and it's 110 gallons. From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Thu Aug 27 20:28:28 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Thu Aug 27 20:30:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Beer up In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > It wasn't me! It was Mr K Mean ! > >> I forgot to take a reading when I first started it. > > But you used extract, right? Knowing your extract and volume of water (you > probably followed a recipe) the original gravity is very easy to figure > out. > >> Now 2 weeks later, it is coming up as 1180. > > I can even begin to imagine what scale you're using! Let's try looking at > specific gravity, shall we? You could, maybe, be at 1.012. Ok, I see, 1.1 is way down there at the bottom. So, that would make it 1.018 then, I think. The book said that sometimes that would be written out as 1018. I guess, which way does it usually go, does it go towards 1 as it gets finished or does it keep getting bigger until it runs out of sugar? Ok, I think I answered that question: http://www.hbkitreviews.com/view-id-52-malt-shovel-pale-ale.html They said OG 1.040 to FG 1.014. Although I used that kit plus 1 kg of #15 mix and made 22 liters. (The beer shop guy said to do that). They all said it was a week or two to ferment. Mine has been going for almost 2 weeks now, except for 3-4 days, it was under 18c until I got a heater. I guess if the SG hasn't changed tonight and tomorrow, I'll bottle on Sunday. I've tried a bit and it seemed to be ok and seems alcoholic. If it isn't great, well, it is a first batch. I know better what to do for the next one. I've got the ingredients for an English bitter. >> is there anything useful I can get from it at this point? > > If you get on the right scale, maybe. Well, actually, you can tell if > you've hit your final gravity - the one from your recipe. > > >> Do I just wait until it stops bubbling (not bubbing so >> much at this point anyways) and bottle it and hope for the best? > > The theory is that you want your gravity to be the same for 3 days in a > row. From mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com Thu Aug 27 21:27:11 2009 From: mny98rv02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K Mean) Date: Thu Aug 27 21:30:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > No way it was me! It was Sylvesterthekat ! > >> He's now sleeping indoors and won't be going out again until it's at >> least below 95! > > Ha. Well, shucks. It is a weather thread, and all. So my ride to work > this morning was cool enough that I went and bought booties and fenders > this evening. Winter is coming! Brrr! Before you know it they're going > to be salting the roads again! The bummer is that I can't get out of the > bike shop for under $150. But, hey, at least I didn't buy a new crankset > (even if I need one. "Need" being, um. Oh, nevermind. You wouldn't > understand!). Well, I'm heading to the bike shop this weekend to take the plunge, buying lots of bits to put on my new frame. I guess I can take it in stages, get a few bits at a time. Considering the amount of free time I seem to have in a week, it might take some time to get the whole bike built. Mostly I need to get a birthday present for the gf. She really wants a Schmidt dynamo hub. I need to find some cool retro looking lights too. I'm thinking the Schmidt E6, it seems to be the most 70s looking one available in LEDs. From bcs1 at spamcop.net Thu Aug 27 21:58:35 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Thu Aug 27 22:00:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Proposed Ayatollah System for USA References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:h6i12e$8ls$1@news.spamcop.net... > > : > > And you let the one off the hook ... > > well, sometimes humor outweighs politics... From bcs1 at spamcop.net Thu Aug 27 22:17:13 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Thu Aug 27 22:20:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C644BADC2293sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > > I personally find it deeply disturbing to see them wreck the engines like > that (you can see it on youtube). When you think of all the poor folks > who'd love to have a car but can't afford it, that's just horribly > wasteful. I know the idea of the program is (among other things) to > encourage people to get out of gas guzzlers but this seems like a step too > far. the overall MPG improvement over traded in clunkers vs new cars purchased was 9.6 mpg... that equates to 1/400th of 1% total fuel savings per year based on the august figures released for the first billion by the transportation dept. (Ray Lahood is the guy's name i think) "if" the numbers hold true through the other 2 Billion and all other factors were to remain constant over the expected 12 to 15 year lifespan of the new cars, the actual fuel saving over 15 years would be a whopping 3/400ths of 1% per year x 15 years equaling a total savings of 45/400ths of 1% for the $3 billion dollar investment... of course the engines in the new cars will become less effecient as they get older, and there are other factors involved too, but if everything remained constant, that would be the total savings from the program.. certainly nothing to write home about... and the average traded in vehicle's fuel mileage was 15.8 mpg i believe, and that's not really "bad" fuel mileage (overall) with the average new car purchased fuel mileage being 25.4, again, nothing astronomical... some temporary jobs were created out of it and even a 10 hour per week job was counted in order to make the numbers look better, but most of the jobs were temps and that's it, now that C4C is gone, those jobs will be gone too.. in my pros and cons post, i touched on some of the same things you mentioned and i agree with you 100% there were cars traded in that I personally saw, and helped kill the engines on that made my car look like a clunker... One van with a V8 took 5:20 secs to kill, that one held/holds the record at the ford dealer where i do comp work... and it was a custom van that was nicer inside than my house is... Bill From bcs1 at spamcop.net Thu Aug 27 22:26:48 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Thu Aug 27 22:30:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-06F4B3.16325919082009@killface.local... > In article , "Bill" > wrote: > >> then why were they talking about income limits for people >> signing up when debating the additional funds? > > Because politicians are opportunistic? This really is moving the goal > post though, we should be talking about the original reasons for the > program. Jumping on the bandwagon the second time around doesn't really > qualify for determining the intent of the program. > >> so what did you think if the numbers source?, did that answer your >> question? > > Yes, but apply that same reasoning elsewhere and many of your other > cons disappear as well. > -- > -David that's cool, since we started this discussion, there was even more changes and the rather abrupt ending of the program... I still hold that each and every one of the cons are valid with the exception of the junk yards are allowed to sell some parts, but not others, and the cars have to be crushed by the end of 6 months, and there were more cons added in that time too. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on many aspects of the issue, but i'm cool with that :) Thanks David.. Bill From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 28 00:39:02 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Aug 28 00:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Cash For Codgers References: <005000ba$0$9537$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com> Message-ID: Democrats, realizing the success of the President's "Cash For Clunkers" rebate program, have revamped a major portion of their National Health Care Plan. President Obama, Speaker Pelosi, and Sen. Reid are expected to make this major announcement at a joint news conference later this week. I have obtained an advanced copy of the proposal which is named..... "CASH FOR CODGERS" and it works like this... Couples wishing to access health care funds in order to pay for the delivery of a child will be required to turn in one old person. The amount the government grants them will be fixed according to a sliding scale. Older and more prescription dependent codgers will garner the highest amounts. Special "Bonuses" will be paid for those submitting codgers in targeted groups, such as smokers, alcohol drinkers, persons 10 pounds over their government prescribed weight, and any member of the Republican Party. Smaller bonuses will be given for codgers who consume beef, soda, fried foods, potato chips, lattes, whole milk, dairy products, bacon, Brussel sprouts, or Girl Scout Cookies. All codgers will be rendered totally useless via toxic injection. This will insure that they are not secretly resold or their body parts harvested to keep other codgers in repair. Remember you heard it here first... From user at domain.invalid Fri Aug 28 01:36:15 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Fri Aug 28 01:40:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > > I loved Queensland, it's very like California only less people and cars and > not as built up either. I'd live there in a heartbeat. No denying the coastal part is great - northern New South Wales is too. Queensland usually tussles with Western Australia for the highest growth rate, year in, year out. It changes. But slowly by (previous) US standards I guess. The entire national economy probably wouldn't match any of the top dozen states in the US (just a guess, haven't looked it up). Things are much different. We don't get that many permanent residents coming from the US. But by all means, anyone liking it, come. Bring money. From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 28 08:57:26 2009 From: me at privacy.net (magus kent) Date: Fri Aug 28 09:00:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Backyard fish ponds + other stuff References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote in news:h76qm1$ku4$3@news.spamcop.net: > magus kent wrote: >> Link: >> >> http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/ponds/ >> >> >> a lot of knowledge! > > Decided to dig myself a 6' diameter, 3' deep pool once my indoor > aquariums are completed. Should go "fairly" quickly depending on how > fast I can dig. > My remaining pond is 4foot X 6foot X 2 1/2foot deep. Loose stacked sandstone all around to a heighth of about seven inches. Small waterfall. Gives me that little bit of nature without becoming a major undetaking (g). Very peaceful and calming when sitting on the patio about three feet away from it..m From me at privacy.net Fri Aug 28 09:00:01 2009 From: me at privacy.net (magus kent) Date: Fri Aug 28 09:00:05 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash For Codgers References: <005000ba$0$9537$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com> Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in news:h77n2l$hte$1@news.spamcop.net: massive snipage.. Ah, and also can help with the "stamp out hunger program"...soylent green anyone? From user at domain.invalid Fri Aug 28 10:52:30 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Fri Aug 28 10:55:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash For Codgers In-Reply-To: References: <005000ba$0$9537$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com> Message-ID: magus kent wrote: > > Ah, and also can help with the "stamp out hunger program"...soylent green > anyone? Well the "All codgers will be rendered totally useless via toxic injection," might ruin that. What a waste of protein! And some talk of "saving the planet". Still, many toxins are made safe by heat/cooking and others are denatured by the digestive process (else hunting for food using 'poison darts' would be fairly pointless, as it were). But I can't help thinking Dr Freud would be muttering about the Oedipus/Electra complex (having the good fortune not to have been turned into a bushel of green biscuits before progressing his theories to that point). From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 28 12:00:27 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Aug 28 12:05:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash For Codgers References: <005000ba$0$9537$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com> Message-ID: "Farelf" wrote in message news:h78qv9$b97$1@news.spamcop.net... > magus kent wrote: > >> >> Ah, and also can help with the "stamp out hunger program"...soylent green >> anyone? > > Well the "All codgers will be rendered totally useless via toxic > injection," might ruin that. What a waste of protein! And some talk of > "saving the planet". Still, many toxins are made safe by heat/cooking and > others are denatured by the digestive process (else hunting for food using > 'poison darts' would be fairly pointless, as it were). > > But I can't help thinking Dr Freud would be muttering about the > Oedipus/Electra complex (having the good fortune not to have been turned > into a bushel of green biscuits before progressing his theories to that > point). Because of their terminal position in the food chain, like clunkers, codgers are generally too toxic for recycling as above, and like clunkers should be disabled in such a manner that their motive apparatus can only be recycled as raw materials. From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 28 13:46:55 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 28 13:50:04 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Backyard fish ponds + other stuff In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: magus kent wrote: > > My remaining pond is 4foot X 6foot X 2 1/2foot deep. Loose stacked > sandstone all around to a heighth of about seven inches. Small > waterfall. Gives me that little bit of nature without becoming a major > undetaking (g). Very peaceful and calming when sitting on the patio > about three feet away from it..m What precautions do you take to keep predators away? From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 28 16:20:13 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 28 16:25:03 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Ugh...another media circus on the horizon I predict... Message-ID: From CNN -- Michael Jackson's death was a homicide caused by "acute propofol intoxication," the Los Angeles County coroner rules. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 28 16:59:03 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Aug 28 17:00:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ugh...another media circus on the horizon I predict... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:h79e5m$nd2$1@news.spamcop.net... > From CNN -- Michael Jackson's death was a homicide caused by "acute > propofol intoxication," the Los Angeles County coroner rules. 3 day old news From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 28 17:22:17 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 28 17:25:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ugh...another media circus on the horizon I predict... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Bar0 wrote: > > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:h79e5m$nd2$1@news.spamcop.net... >> From CNN -- Michael Jackson's death was a homicide caused by "acute >> propofol intoxication," the Los Angeles County coroner rules. > > 3 day old news > Just received the breaking news...CNN needs to speed up their emails a bit. :) From fiyntyd02 at sneakemail.com Fri Aug 28 18:10:39 2009 From: fiyntyd02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K. Mean) Date: Fri Aug 28 18:15:09 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat said the following on 29/08/09 06:34: > > heh... my whole bike cost less than $150... 10+ years ago! i'd like a new > one but it does what i want of it so that'd just be frivolous spending and > i'd rather save money for other stuff. it's not like i use it for > transportation or nuthin' Sigh. You are the exact type that we bike evangelists are trying to reach. On average, something like 40% of journeys are only a mile or two. Replace those with bike journeys and what a difference it would make. From fiyntyd02 at sneakemail.com Fri Aug 28 18:13:02 2009 From: fiyntyd02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K. Mean) Date: Fri Aug 28 18:15:09 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ugh...another media circus on the horizon I predict... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Borgholio said the following on 29/08/09 07:22: > Bar0 wrote: >> >> "Borgholio" wrote in message >> news:h79e5m$nd2$1@news.spamcop.net... >>> From CNN -- Michael Jackson's death was a homicide caused by "acute >>> propofol intoxication," the Los Angeles County coroner rules. >> >> 3 day old news >> > > Just received the breaking news...CNN needs to speed up their emails a > bit. :) Wow, is Michael Jackson already yesterday's news? From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 28 18:42:17 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Aug 28 18:45:07 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ugh...another media circus on the horizon I predict... References: Message-ID: "Mr K. Mean" wrote in message news:h79kpn$stl$2@news.spamcop.net... > Borgholio said the following on 29/08/09 07:22: >> Bar0 wrote: >>> >>> "Borgholio" wrote in message >>> news:h79e5m$nd2$1@news.spamcop.net... >>>> From CNN -- Michael Jackson's death was a homicide caused by "acute >>>> propofol intoxication," the Los Angeles County coroner rules. >>> >>> 3 day old news >>> >> >> Just received the breaking news...CNN needs to speed up their emails a >> bit. :) > > Wow, is Michael Jackson already yesterday's news? Shit man he's had a month of being the only news. From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 28 20:03:30 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 28 20:05:09 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ugh...another media circus on the horizon I predict... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Bar0 wrote: > > "Mr K. Mean" wrote in message > news:h79kpn$stl$2@news.spamcop.net... >> Borgholio said the following on 29/08/09 07:22: >>> Bar0 wrote: >>>> >>>> "Borgholio" wrote in message >>>> news:h79e5m$nd2$1@news.spamcop.net... >>>>> From CNN -- Michael Jackson's death was a homicide caused by "acute >>>>> propofol intoxication," the Los Angeles County coroner rules. >>>> >>>> 3 day old news >>>> >>> >>> Just received the breaking news...CNN needs to speed up their emails a >>> bit. :) >> >> Wow, is Michael Jackson already yesterday's news? > > Shit man he's had a month of being the only news. He's buried in the same cemetery as a few of my relatives. We called and asked if it would disrupt our ability to visit and we were told no. Good thing too, if anybody (police included) tried to stop us from visiting our family on ground that belongs to us...it would be holy hell to pay. From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 28 20:55:46 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 28 21:00:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ugh...another media circus on the horizon I predict... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h79r8b$qc$1@news.spamcop.net: > >> He's buried in the same cemetery as a few of my relatives. We called >> and asked if it would disrupt our ability to visit and we were told >> no. Good thing too, if anybody (police included) tried to stop us >> from visiting our family on ground that belongs to us...it would be >> holy hell to pay. >> > > What, even on THE day he gets buried? I thought they were being super > exclusive. No doubt it's going to become some sort of shrine and there will > be a lot more visitors to that cemetary now. Where exactly is it? They said > it's in Glendale but I'm thinking it's surely the one on the hill isn't it? > Is that Glendale? I thought it was Burbank or even Studio City. There are Forest Lawns everywhere...my family is buried in the Glendale one, where MJ is. He will be in a gated / secured area with other celebrities. We were simply concerned that his "pilgrims" would make it difficult to visit our own family. From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Aug 28 21:19:16 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Aug 28 21:20:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ugh...another media circus on the horizon I predict... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h79uaa$qc$2@news.spamcop.net: > > >> There are Forest Lawns everywhere...my family is buried in the >> Glendale one, where MJ is. He will be in a gated / secured area with >> other celebrities. We were simply concerned that his "pilgrims" would >> make it difficult to visit our own family. >> > > Oh I know, but where is this particular one located? I lived in Glendale > and don't know where it is. Not that I'm going to be visiting mind you! I > used to live near the one where Marilyn Monroe, Jack Lemmon and Walter > Matthau are buried and went to pay my respects when Lemmon passed away a > few years ago but I've no intention of joining the circus that Jackson's > resting place will become. 1712 S Glendale Ave Glendale, CA 91205 From user at domain.invalid Fri Aug 28 21:41:28 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Fri Aug 28 21:45:10 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Anyone remember the first swine flu vaccine? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Farelf wrote in > news:h77qcb$k3g$1@news.spamcop.net: > > ... > > Well I think you've got fewer people in the entire nation than live in > California...maybe even in just LA County! OK, I just checked, there's > like 21.5 million in OZ, 36 million in California, almost 10 million of > whom live in LA County so half of Oz's population is right here. Little > wonder i found it to be very sparsely populated on the Gold Coast! 36 million in CA! I come from the west, where there are about 2 million people in one million square miles, though most of the 2 million are in Perth-Fremantle. Makes the rest of it fairly quiet though. > > However, wages there were rather lower than here and cost of living > isn't commensurately lower so we're slightly better off living here but > not if you consider quality of life I guess. Taxes. Taxes are the real killer. Pretty well nowhere else can match the USA for the low (Fed & state) income tax rates anywhere below about $600,000 annual earning rate (last time I looked). Well, once you get past the lower earning rates, which would mostly be less than US minimum rates. Australian rates (which are federal only) are similar to Canadian ones (federal and provincial) most years, except when they're higher. Yeah, taxes include basic healthcare but ... > > My sister has retired to the Sunshine Coast and has a good standard of > living as she has a good pension. Yeah, the Sunshine Coast is pretty much the 'Florida' for the eastern states. The southerners retire there for the warmth, the northerners go there for the cool (those that can stand the crowds). Getting a bit crowded by our standards. What the heck, there's always the Sunset Coast, nearby. Suppose that's getting a bit crowded too, now (haven't seen it for maybe 10-12 years). From user at domain.invalid Fri Aug 28 21:56:59 2009 From: user at domain.invalid (Farelf) Date: Fri Aug 28 22:00:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Ugh...another media circus on the horizon I predict... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > This is a classic case of enabling and > of spoilt entitlement. Maybe, if nothing else, others in his position will > learn a valuable lesson from it. Yeah, like *he* learned from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_drug-related_deaths And that list doesn't even include Elvis Presley? Oh, I forgot, Elvis still lives, obviously. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 28 23:12:04 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Fri Aug 28 23:15:09 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C75E22CFC21FTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was Sylvesterthekat ! > >> my whole bike cost less than $150 > > My kid's bike cost about that! Weren't you the one complaining about reining in the household spending a while back? $150 for a kids bike seems a bit, well, excessive..... From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Aug 28 23:37:54 2009 From: nobody at spamcop.net (indigo) Date: Fri Aug 28 23:40:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hey indi In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C75B7DD8DCDFsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > did you happen to see the lap of Spa from the front wing of kimi's car? > wow.... just... wow. if you missed it, hopefully they'll replay it Nope. Qualifying or practice for this weekend's race? See .geeks for why I've been quiet lately....another fscking auto-update Vista disaster.... From speedy.post at live.co.uk Sat Aug 29 00:39:37 2009 From: speedy.post at live.co.uk (Robert Bates) Date: Sat Aug 29 00:40:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] TANYA LOUISE BATES IS A CHILD ABUSERNBP Unregistered. Message-ID: CHILD ABUSE OF A FOUR YEAR OLD To begin with I am tired of holding this secret so those that are guilty will benefit from my silence. This is not an attempt at harrassment or slander of any person. The Australian police have already attempted to silence me, GO TO HELL !!! This is a factual account experienced by me of allegations made by my son James Bates against Mr Ronald Armstrong, father of Tanya Armstrong ( now Bates). Paul Armstrong, Simon Armstrong. He was to my knowledge married to Louise Armstrong. They were residents of the state of Victoria, Australia. More specifically the Mornington Penninsula, Rosebud. While a minor my son James Bates accused Ronald Armstrong of sexually assaulting him at the age of four. He was penetrated anally. As his legal guardian and the parent who had contact with the police to give consent for the investigation to go ahead, I have first hand knowledge of these allegations. James is now eighteen years old and can still remember what happened to him vividly. My ex wife Tanya Bates told me that she had been sexually abused by her father from the age of nine to nineteen. In full knowledge of what her father did to her she allowed my children James Bates, Samantha Bates, Nickolas Bates to spend time around this man. I have first hand knowledge of this as I am an eye witness to these events. As conveyed to me by the police child protection team in Lowestoft, after the investigation Mr Ronald Armstrong was sent to prison for the abuse of my ex wife but he denied the abuse of my son. I as the father of Samantha and Nickolas Bates have repeatedly been denied access to my children in Australia because my ex wife knows very well I will tell the children the truth. Late last year , 2009, I attempted to contact my children in Australia only to be told in the first phone call by my ex wife that my daughter Samantha had been abused by her ex partner Darren who was an alcoholic. I attempted to get the information out of my daughter via MSN messenger but she would not say as she had discussed things with her mother and for brodies sake, the son of the alcoholic, that they should keep things quiet. After finding this out I wrote some abusive emails to her and have been telling her friends about the abuse of my eldest son. Through interpol the Australian Police have attempted to have me charged with harrassment. I signed an unofficial warning in the Suffolk policemans notebook. The police in the UK know very well what is going on and I was treated very leniently. Hearing that your second eldest child has been abused as well would make any parent go insane. To be honest I hope that abuse victims throughout the world read this. Yes, my ex wife was abused by her father but it does not give her the moral right to abuse my children. Her father was abused as well and he is in prison. Why wasn't my ex wife charged with child neglect for knowingly allowing my children to be around a known peadophile ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://zeta.cesmail.net/pipermail/scsocial/attachments/20090829/60461327/attachment.html From me at privacy.net Sat Aug 29 03:55:36 2009 From: me at privacy.net (magus kent) Date: Sat Aug 29 04:00:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Backyard fish ponds + other stuff References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote in news:h79568$gur$1 @news.spamcop.net: SNIP> > What precautions do you take to keep predators away? > I have chainlink fence around the property plus two killer dachshunds (g). The height of the stonework around the pond keeps racoons out, as I've heard that if they can't touch bottom from where they are standing they won't get into the water. Other than that the possums will wander around. rabbits, squirrels, cats. Haven't had any animal caused problems in the ten years its been set up..m From fiyntyd02 at sneakemail.com Sat Aug 29 05:57:44 2009 From: fiyntyd02 at sneakemail.com (Mr K. Mean) Date: Sat Aug 29 06:00:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hey indi In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: indigo said the following on 29/08/09 13:37: > > "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message > news:Xns9C75B7DD8DCDFsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... >> did you happen to see the lap of Spa from the front wing of kimi's car? >> wow.... just... wow. if you missed it, hopefully they'll replay it > > Nope. Qualifying or practice for this weekend's race? > > See .geeks for why I've been quiet lately....another fscking auto-update > Vista disaster.... Maybe you could try some Linux then in that run VMWare and run Windows in that. Windows could go nuts and you could just shut it down and start it up again. And you would have access to whatever you needed to run in Windows. It should be able to handle things like USB and the rest of that as well. From bcs1 at spamcop.net Sat Aug 29 09:40:12 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Sat Aug 29 09:45:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cash for clunkers References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9C758B693315Fsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "Bill" wrote in news:h77en9$b9u$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> in my pros and cons post, i touched on some of the same things you >> mentioned and i agree with you 100% there were cars traded in that I >> personally saw, and helped kill the engines on that made my car look >> like a clunker... >> One van with a V8 took 5:20 secs to kill, that one held/holds the >> record at >> the ford dealer where i do comp work... and it was a custom van that >> was nicer inside than my house is... > > Well you'd hope that the rest of the car will be sold for parts, it's only > the engine that's being destroyed. Even at 17 yrs old my miata still gets > gas mileage too high to have qualified (between about 26 and 30mpg > depending on driving conditions) but the interior is nothing to write home > about! Bodywork is fine as it's lived in CA its entire life. yeah, you'd think, but the cars have to be crushed within 6 months and there's a list of chassis parts, certain body parts, and some of the running gear that can't be sold (according to Mike at the dealership) that one 99 explorer was so nice that, if it were legal, I would have considered changing the frame and body VIN plates on it LOL coulda had a new ride, or if I would have been at the dealer when they came to trade it in, i would have just bought their explorer from them and kept it for myself.. That truck was well worth $4,500.00 Bill From bcs1 at spamcop.net Sat Aug 29 09:56:35 2009 From: bcs1 at spamcop.net (Bill) Date: Sat Aug 29 10:00:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: HAH! IT'S ALIVE! References: Message-ID: "indigo" wrote in message news:h6c21g$6vv$1@news.spamcop.net... > > > Since you despise M$ products so much, any suggestions for a better backup > app than theirs? One thing I dislike about M$ backup is that you can't > easily see what files are stored in the backup .BKF file. I have the free > version of Magic ISO installled, it's limited to 300 GB images, but that's > fine since I'm only using ~ 140 GB of my HD. I think "Ghost" is a pay to > use app? I also have "SyncBack" installed, it's free and unlimited, but > IIRC doesn't compress files, not that that really matters to me. I never > set it back up after my system restore months ago, maybe I'll take another > look at that. It can run automatically on a schedule and is pretty fast. > > One last question: I have defrag set up to run every Friday night -- I > assume that I DON'T want defrag running when I try to do a backup lest > disaster happen -- correct assumption? I believe that's correct on the defrag, if the system is making an image of the drive, and that image is being changed in the process, it could be a bad thing. I use PowerQuest Drive image for most backups, it has the ability to burn to a CD or to an image on a shard drive, in the case of you getting the module drive, I would suggest creating a folder on that drive named r3st0r3 and then placing the image of the C drive in that folder. I built a bootable 2.88 mg img file out of the two 1.44 mg floppies so that i could create a bootable cd (much faster). if you don't find a solution you like you are welcome to contact me off board and I can tell you how to do it. I have not tested this on Vista yet, but I know that it doesn't like windows 7... Bill From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 31 15:40:36 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 31 15:45:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Charles wrote in > news:Xns9C785993F98B6TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61: > > >>> booties? >> For my tootsies! Tomorrow it's going to be cold... >> > > yeah, hubby is usually at work by 6 and out jogging. it's the best way to > beat the traffic (and the heat) > > i could smell the smoke a bit this morning but the wind must have shifted > since because it's faded Have my face in an air purifier today... From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Aug 31 16:24:08 2009 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Aug 31 16:25:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hot enough for ya Borg? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:h7h8vq$9e8$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >>> i could smell the smoke a bit this morning but the wind must have >>> shifted since because it's faded >> Have my face in an air purifier today... >> > > um... is it that bad in burbank or are you just odd? Both? From me at privacy.net Mon Aug 31 22:23:52 2009 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Aug 31 22:25:09 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Gonna build References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C78DBBB785A1TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was Sylvesterthekat ! : : > I hope this time you've got an estimate written in stone that they can't : > suddenly double! : : This is only the second custom unit that this outfit has done. Or, looked : at another way, they're very used to sticking to a budget. I hope it works : out for us! Were you able to get a performance bond? From jwjr at poSPAMSUCKSbox.com Mon Aug 31 23:32:14 2009 From: jwjr at poSPAMSUCKSbox.com (J. Weaver Jr.) Date: Mon Aug 31 23:35:08 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Four day work week In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: My neighbor's been 4/10 for a couple years now, and _loves_ it. He's got Friday off; he mows his lawn first thing, then he's free for the entire weekend. -JW From joegill at removethis Mon Aug 31 22:19:28 2009 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Tue Sep 1 11:10:09 2009 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Gonna build In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9C78E0513DA9ETheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was Sylvesterthekat ! > >> When do you expect them to start work? > > As soon as I sign a check they start work on the framing. As soon as we > close (s/b less than a month) they break ground. They claim that I will > be > able to move in in under 90 days from the deposit check. From all > indications, they're not just telling stories... Ah... 90 days... plus 20% 'fudge factor'.... you will be singing "I'll be home for Christmas"