From me at privacy.net Sat Nov 1 07:23:35 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Nov 1 07:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] the world has voted References: Message-ID: http://www.iftheworldcouldvote.com/ From me at privacy.net Sat Nov 1 07:49:02 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Nov 1 07:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Disability Rights Organizations Express Outrage Over Attacks at McCain-Palin Rally References: Message-ID: The National Coalition for Disability Rights is a nonpartisan nonprofit that does not endorse political candidates. We are a coalition of national, state and local disability, civil rights and social justice organizations united to protect and promote the human rights of children and adults with physical and mental disabilities. ***************************** NEWS RELEASE October 31, 2008 Disability Rights Organizations Express Outrage Over Attacks at McCain-Palin Rally Contacts: Jim Ward, Founder and President 202-415-4753 or jward@ncdr.org Marcie Roth, Executive Director 301-717-7447 or mroth@ncdr.org (Washington, DC) The National Coalition for Disability Rights (NCDR) pushed back today against the McCain-Palin campaign for ridiculing the legal rights of people with disabilities. News reports describe McCain-Palin campaign representative Senator Kit Bond (R-Mo), joining Vice Presidential candidate Sarah Palin at a rally in Rush Limbaugh's hometown of Cape Girardeau, Missouri, mocking Presidential candidate Senator Barak Obama for stating that he's looking to nominate judges who empathize with "the disabled." "It's Halloween and it seems that Sarah Palin's mask of support for people with "special needs" is slipping. Despite past pandering to people with disabilities, McCain-Palin are actually opposed to vital disability legislation like the Community Choice Act and they want to appoint judges who will further roll back the civil rights protections of the Americans with Disabilities Act," declared NCDR's founder and president, Jim Ward. NPR's Nina Totenberg has reported that McCain-Palin's and conservatives' "most oft-mentioned prospects" for nomination to the Supreme Court include Ohio Judge Jeffrey Sutton. Sutton was opposed by hundreds of disability organizations when he was nominated by President Bush after successfully weakening the ADA with states' rights arguments. As a sitting judge, he has recently supported the execution of criminals with developmental disabilities and has undermined the Help America Vote Act(HAVA). Disability rights advocates are further incensed that the McCain-Palin campaign has reframed this civil rights struggle, one founded in concepts of equality, dignity and self-respect, as an issue of "special needs." Disability rights advocate, Steve Gold states, "Yes we need support services. Yes we need inclusive education. Yes we need integrated employment. Yes we need equal rights. This not "special". These needs are based on us, people with disabilities, equal members of our communities. We are not inspirational nor are we "special". We are PROUD PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES who should push back when anyone describes us as anything but equal members of our communities." The National Coalition for Disability Rights is a nonpartisan nonprofit that does not endorse political candidates. We are a coalition of national, state and local disability, civil rights and social justice organizations united to protect and promote the human rights of children and adults with physical and mental disabilities. From me at privacy.net Sat Nov 1 11:22:36 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Nov 1 11:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Medicare's Poison Pill Message-ID: http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/2008/09/exit-strategy-medicares-poison-pill.html From MikeE at ster.invalid Sat Nov 1 13:16:50 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sat Nov 1 13:20:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks References: Message-ID: Mike Easter wrote: That was weird. Both of those messages of mine seemed to just disappear from everywhere - I couldn't see/find them on the server and I couldn't see/find them in my Sent folder. It was all because of how I was looking and that they had the wrong date on them. That just goes to show you - sometimes when you can't find something, it is because you are looking for it in the wrong way. The conversants in the newsgroup news.software.readers think I'm weird because I don't normally use threading by MID. In this case, if I had I would've found the messages. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Nov 1 14:18:14 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Sat Nov 1 14:20:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:gei2vi$p7o$1@news.spamcop.net... > Mike Easter wrote: > > > That was weird. ... Well aside from you getting older and forgetful, and searching in all the wrong places, the thing I find fascinating about the subject of the other 2 missives, is that as you say Tylenol has no anti-inflammatory properties at all, yet it is routinely prescribed and touted on TV as pain relief for arthritis, which technically I suppose one can say it is, but it is inappropriate pain relief for arthritis, one might as well prescribe morphine for arthritis, you'll feel better, but your arthritis will worsen as if you took no meds or faster. (Faster because you are probably more likely to engage in activity that hastens damage) Aspirin is still one of the most amazing drugs ever invented/discovered, and even though it is not recommended for children due to the slight risk of Rye's syndrome, that risk is in fact pretty miniscule given how few Ryes patients there are or have been and how many kids have been ingesting aspirin since Bayer started mass producing it a hundred or more years ago. Aspirin is pretty effective pain relief, effective anti inflammatory, minimal side effects except with prolonged massive usage (usually only when used as arthritis treatment over the long term), Blood thinner, (Aspirin given to heart attack patients has a significant positive effect on outcomes), Very effective fever reducer, and the only effective altitude sickness ameliorator I know of, both because it kills the headache and thins the blood. a potentially dangerous condition caused by altitude sickness is thickening and viscosity increas in the blood (Well I have never tried coca leaf). Al this from observation of the curative properties of willow bark. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Nov 1 14:19:24 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (BlueWave) Date: Sat Nov 1 14:20:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Sarah Palin: "My First Amendment Rights Are Threatened by Criticism" Message-ID: Would somebody please educate this half-witted bimbo on just what the Constitution says (and doesn't say)? http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/10/palin-fears-med.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/31/palin-criticism-threatens_n_139729.html http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/10/31/palin/index.html From MikeE at ster.invalid Sat Nov 1 15:21:42 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sat Nov 1 15:25:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks References: Message-ID: bar0 wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> That was weird. ... > > Well aside from you getting older and forgetful, and searching in all > the wrong places, the thing I find fascinating about the subject of the > other 2 missives, The fact that I'm commenting here doesn't mean I'm disagreeing with anything you have said. I'm a big aspirin fan, and it doesn't bother my stomach at all. I can recall people I've known with a lot of arthritis problems taking really large doses of aspirin without problems. Oh, yeah. The reason there were two related missives of mine in this thread is because I tho't the first one of them disappeared into the negasphere. > is that as you say Tylenol has no anti-inflammatory > properties at all, yet it is routinely prescribed and touted on TV as > pain relief for arthritis, which technically I suppose one can say it > is, but it is inappropriate pain relief for arthritis, I agree that there is a significant problem with touting what is otherwise a decent analgesic (for conditions unrelated to chronic inflammation) for a condition which is based on inflammation and its pathophysiology. Tylenol is not a NSAID, nonsteroidal antiinflammatory, because it is not antiinflammatory. It is a 'good' antipyretic and analgesic. It is bad in that it is not harmless; and when the wrong/suboptimal drug is being taken for a condition such as chronic arthritis, it invites/encourages the subject to take larger doses - more often & more dose - and definitely chronically, since the arthritides aren't going to go away - which invites the overuse scenario which jeopardizes the liver and kidneys -- ergo the 'popularity' & #1 cause of acute liver failure. We really should take out the stupid suicidal acute acetominophen ingestors and the childhood accidental accetominophen overdosers from the liver failure stats, since the mechanism is so different. > one might as > well prescribe morphine for arthritis, you'll feel better, but your > arthritis will worsen as if you took no meds or faster. (Faster because > you are probably more likely to engage in activity that hastens damage) The disadvantage of morphine in a chronic pain environment is that the subject is going to build a tolerance to the opiate. So, if you had unlimited access, I suppose you could just keep increasing and increasing the dose while dealing with the dosage related side effects; but typically non-opiod analgesics including acetominophen and the nsaids do not suffer from tolerance problems. > Aspirin is still one of the most amazing drugs ever > invented/discovered, I agree. It has resurged in popularity after its earlier declines secondary to the introduction of acetominophen and then ibuprofen because of its wonderful cardiovascular risk reduction effects. > Very effective fever reducer, and the only > effective altitude sickness ameliorator I know of, both because it > kills the headache and thins the blood. a potentially dangerous > condition caused by altitude sickness is thickening and viscosity > increas in the blood (Well I have never tried coca leaf). If we are talking about choosing a mountainside drug to help someone self motivate and self enable themselves back down the mountain as quickly as possible, I think I would go for the coca leaf. And maybe a potent steroid. > Al this from observation of the curative properties of willow bark. Altho' willow bark and other salicylate sources were used for millenia, the actual biochemistry and pharmaceutical preparation of acetyl salicylates wasn't until the second half of the 19th century -- whereas the extraction of digitalis from the foxglove by Withering was way back in 1785. That is, from a pharmaceutical botanicals perspective, aspirin is younger than digitalis. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From dfmanno at mail.com Sat Nov 1 21:03:24 2008 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Sat Nov 1 21:05:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Sarah Palin: "My First Amendment Rights Are Threatened by Criticism" References: Message-ID: In article , BlueWave wrote: > Would somebody please educate this half-witted bimbo on just what the > Constitution says (and doesn't say)? Why bother? After Tuesday, she's Alaska's problem. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com Corporation: n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. (Ambrose Bierce) From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Nov 1 22:06:35 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sat Nov 1 22:10:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B48E32983D7FTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Heidi" ! > >> Um...seriously - do you take aspirin, lots, or ibuprofen? > > No ulcers that I know of - no abdominal pains, etc. But, hey, that's that > I know of. Anyway, no, I don't take lots of aspirin. I take maybe a > couple when my chest hurts. Max 3 times a day. Max 4 days in a row. As > in, none the past week. Maybe 4 total last week. Sometimes chest pain can come from GI stuff, like reflux, do you have any issues with GERD? http://easydiagnosis.com/cgi-bin/expert/explain2.cgi?mod=Chest+Pain&ask=ddisease3&title=Chest+Pain%2C+GI+Causes&showmod=yes Gastrointestinal (GI) conditions of the esophagus, and stomach are the second most common cause of nonanginal chest pain, accounting for up to a third of all cases. Moreover, typical or atypical angina may themselves be confused with gastrointestinal problems. Esophageal conditions causing nonanginal chest pain include the very common diagnosis, gastroesophageal or "GE reflux" caused by stomach acid ascending to the lower esophagus, often accompanied by "hiatal hernia" and commonly described as HEARTBURN. Sometimes disorders of swallowing may be related to chest pain. Other common causes are ulcer disease and ulcer symptoms without ulcer, so-called "non-ulcer dyspepsia." From borgholio at storymind.com Sat Nov 1 22:19:48 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Sat Nov 1 22:20:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: the world has voted In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > "Frog Prince" wrote in news:gehe7m$41b$1@news.spamcop.net: > >> http://www.iftheworldcouldvote.com/ >> >> >> >> > > wow, that's one hell of a landslide! Although only Americans should have the right to vote for an American president, I do believe a good candidate will keep the rest of the world in mind when he forms his policies. Being an international failure could hurt the nation pretty bad in the long run. Reminds me of a hilarious British magazine cover from 2004 though: http://www.plasticbag.org/archives/2004/11/how_can_59054087_people_be_so_dumb/ From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Nov 1 23:57:12 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sun Nov 2 00:00:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B48E37099221TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Heidi" ! > >> Are you taking any supplements? > > No way - save that stuff for Indi. My PCP just (just just) told me to > take > some extra D. But, seriously, all of my blood tests were good to great. > Except low end of the OK scale on D and anemia. I have to take 50,000 iu of prescription Vit D a week, I am chronically deficient, even being outside in the sun all summer did nothing to boost it. Vit D deficiency is the new epidemic now, or so they're finding out, they've never tested for it before. From MikeE at ster.invalid Sun Nov 2 00:10:30 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sun Nov 2 00:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> As a general rule, when company isn't visiting, I average 30-40 beers/ >> fortnight^1, which would pencil out to average 2-3 beers/day. > > Depending on what you're drinking, that can be a whole lot or very > little. Know what I mean? My beers are always Heineken which is 5.4% alcohol^1, except when I'm traveling and buy it in OK at a convenience store, which has to play by OK beer alcohol 3.2 % rules. >Now, since you're calling this 5-7 six packs of bottles, we > can eliminate both the least and most expensive options. The reason I referred to the six pack counts is not because I buy my beer that way, since I buy it in multiple cases at a time, but when I'm handling the empty bottles I use old six pack cartons for 'storage shuffling'. The 6 packs of empty bottles eventually get back into cases of empties just before the fortnight count. ^1 http://www.realbeer.com/edu/health/calories.php Calories, carbs and alcohol -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Nov 2 12:33:40 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (BlueWave) Date: Sun Nov 2 12:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Sarah Palin: "My First Amendment Rights Are Threatened by Criticism" In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: D.F. Manno wrote: > Why bother? After Tuesday, she's Alaska's problem. Heh... good point. Let's hope so. From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Nov 2 12:37:56 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Sun Nov 2 12:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B4A55A721EDDTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Heidi" ! > >> I have to take 50,000 iu of prescription Vit D a week > > Sounds like a lot! It is, and from what I read, it's the wrong kind of Vit D, I should take cod liver oil instead (bleh)....... From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Nov 2 13:52:52 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Sun Nov 2 13:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] S-KAT !!!!!! Message-ID: Did you just see the Brazil race? Without a doubt, the most exciting last 10 minutes of any race I've ever seen in my life! And someone from McLaren should find Robert Kubicza and rip his fscking head off! (if you haven't seen it yet you'll understand why when you do). From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Nov 2 19:26:16 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Sun Nov 2 19:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: S-KAT !!!!!! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B4A782D68BC1sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > > OH. MY. GOD! I never saw anything like it in my life. I have no nails > left. > Hell, I have no first knuckles left LOL. Seemed to me like Kubica > deliberately tried to mess him up. Certainly wasn't very sporting, whatever reason he did it..... Did you see the Ferrari guys in the pit > celebrating then their faces fall as they realised that Glock had let them > by? LOL. Phew, what a race! Yeah, talk about going from top to bottom in 30 seconds! Although I'm pretty sure Glock didn't "let them by", he was still on slicks, while everyone else had put intermediate rains back on. I was shocked when the pass happened, didn't see it coming. The commentators seemed completely unaware how fast that group was catching up to Glock, not normal for that group of guys, they're usually on top of things like that. Has to be the best finish to an F1 year ever! From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Nov 2 19:41:48 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Sun Nov 2 19:45:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Oy vey, Hubble in trouble again Message-ID: A month or so ago I mentioned in some thread that I got called back to work on a volunteer basis to restart a system I helped to build......somehow, the reason "why" was never explained to me fully......this is bad news, really bad....hope the two bad batteries and the gyros hold up for another 6 months......and all those guys and gals who busted their butts to get all the new hardware to the Cape on time now have to go back to another Chinese fire drill, no time to relax a bit. NASA's plans to service Hubble Space Telescope suffer another setback Ground testing of a critical replacement computer taking longer than expected "Delivery in April to support a May launch," NASA manager predicts More than six months of work will be needed to get it ready to fly (CNN) -- NASA's plans to fly a fifth and final space shuttle mission to service the Hubble Space Telescope have suffered another set-back. Atlantis was prepared to launch in September ([October 10th, actually, was the real launch date] before an onboard computer failed, delaying the mission. Hubble managers say ground testing of a critical replacement computer that they hope to install on the orbiting telescope is taking longer than previously expected. And that means an additional flight delay. "Delivery in April to support a May launch, I think is a fair thing to say," said Hubble program manager Preston Burch. "Right now I think we have a very good chance of meeting a readiness date in that time frame." The additional delay is just the latest dip in an emotional rollercoaster ride for the Hubble team over the past few months. In late September, astronauts were mere weeks away from launching to Hubble aboard the space shuttle Atlantis, with spacewalks planned to make the telescope more powerful than ever and extend its expected lifespan an additional five years. That flight had to be postponed when the onboard computer that downlinks scientific data to the ground suddenly failed on September 27th. While that problem has been corrected using a back-up system, NASA managers have decided the computer needs to be completely replaced in order to keep a fully redundant back-up capability available. A spare computer was built prior to Hubble's launch in 1990, and has been warehoused at the Goddard Space Flight Center in Maryland ever since. Initially, engineers had hoped that spare could be quickly tested, certified "flight ready," and shipped to the Kennedy Space Center in Florida to be packed aboard Atlantis in time for a February launch. Space Shuttle Endeavour set for November launch But a closer evaluation of the spare shows more than six months of work will be needed to get it ready to fly. Among other issues, it was partially disassembled other the years so that parts could be used for other systems. It has been largely put back together, but now programming anomalies are cropping up. And once engineers get it in good working order, it will have to go a battery of environmental tests to make sure it is ready to hold up in the harsh conditions of space. But the engineers are confident that they will eventually overcome all the obstacles. "We've gotten a lot smarter about the condition of this unit over the last four weeks, said Burch. "We don't want to take any chances in bringing a box up there that isn't going to be 100% working to the absolute best that it can. So we want to take some extra time and make sure that we subject this to a very rigorous test program and we don't want to leave any stones unturned on the way to the launch pad." From avoozl at spamcop.net Sun Nov 2 23:34:44 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Sun Nov 2 23:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Sarah Palin: "My First Amendment Rights Are Threatened by Criticism" References: Message-ID: That's what YOU think. "D.F. Manno" wrote in message news:dfmanno-565715.21032301112008@news.cesmail.net... > Why bother? After Tuesday, she's Alaska's problem. > > -- > D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com > > Corporation: n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit > without individual responsibility. (Ambrose Bierce) From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Nov 3 15:02:09 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Nov 3 15:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: ranking the presidents In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > David Dean wrote in > news:v8ltfuv02-FF8194.10315103112008@killface.local: > >>> I see that FDR was in office for 12 years - did they only introduce >>> term limits fairly recently? (I shudder to imagine if Bush were in >>> office that long - we'd be a smoking crater - and when I say 'we' I >>> mean the planet!) >> The 22nd Amendment was ratified in 1951, mainly because of FDR. > > Phew! Glad to see someone saw the risks. They ought to bring something like > it into the UK's system. I personally believe that FDR was one of the handful of presidents who one could trust completely to make the right decisions. He knew the dangers that could go along with a president who got re-elected for the rest of his life, and he put a stop to it. That in itself is historic. However he is also the only president in history to be elected to 4 terms. :) We really could use someone like FDR right now... From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 3 16:39:34 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (BlueWave) Date: Mon Nov 3 16:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Fearless Election-Eve Electoral College Prognostications Message-ID: Since we're just about at the end of this campaign cycle, it's time to take a semi-educated guess at what the results might be Tuesday night. While I think most of us on this group would like to see a landslide for Obama (including me), it's also possible that this election could be a lot closer than some of the polls indicate. So after consulting my own internal "poll of polls", I'm predicting: Obama: 303 McCain: 235 Anyone else care to offer up their prediction? Winner gets bragging rights until the next presidential election (or until the Electoral College is abolished, whichever comes first). From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 3 19:18:01 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Mon Nov 3 19:20:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Bummer References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B4BA1D53A191sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/03/obama.grandma/ > > Sen. Barack Obama's grandmother, Madelyn Dunham, has died following a bout > with cancer, Obama and his sister, Maya Soetoro-Ng, said Monday. > > His victory is going to be bittersweet. Mostly because she didn't get to > see it. Incredibly sad that she didn't hang on for one more day, but maybe she knew already. I'm not ready to say 'he's going to win', because I remember the bitter disappointment of the last "surprise", and I don't trust the Democrats to get off their lazy asses and actually show up to vote - they have, in the past, been an awful lot of mouth and no trousers. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 3 23:58:35 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Tue Nov 4 00:00:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Oy vey, Hubble in trouble again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B4ACBF1E933CTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Indigo" ! > >> A spare computer was built prior to Hubble's launch in 1990 > > And we're just going to cobble this thing back together and use it. 1990? > Golly, my pocket calculator could out perform it - even in the harsh > environment of space. Well, it's now a 486 based computer, we test flew the current flight one in 1999 on the shuttle. Dunno why the article sez it was pre 1990. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 4 01:34:11 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (BlueWave) Date: Tue Nov 4 01:35:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Obama Wins Dixville Notch, NH, First Place To Vote Message-ID: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081104/ap_on_el_pr/new_hampshire_first_votes DIXVILLE NOTCH, N.H. ? Barack Obama came up a big winner in the presidential race in Dixville Notch and Hart's Location, N.H., where tradition of having the first Election Day ballots tallied lives on. Democrat Obama defeated Republican John McCain by a count of 15 to 6 in Dixville Notch, where a loud whoop accompanied the announcement in Tuesday's first minutes. The town of Hart's Location reported 17 votes for Obama, 10 for McCain and two for write-in Ron Paul. Independent Ralph Nader was on both towns' ballots but got no votes. "I'm not going to say I wasn't surprised," said Obama supporter Tanner Nelson Tillotson, whose name was drawn from a bowl to make him Dixville Notch's first voter. With 115 residents between them, Dixville Notch and Hart's Location get every eligible voter to the polls beginning at midnight on Election Day. Between them, the towns have been enjoying their first-vote status since 1948. Being first means something to residents of the Granite State, home of the nation's earliest presidential primary and the central focus ? however briefly ? of the vote-watching nation's attention every four years. Town Clerk Rick Erwin said Dixville Notch is proud of its tradition, but added, "The most important thing is that we exemplify a 100 percent vote." Dixville Notch resident Peter Johnson said the early bird electoral exercise "is fun." A former naval aviator, Johnson said he was voting for McCain, but added, "I think both candidates are excellent people." Voting was carried out in a room in a local hotel festooned with political memorabilia from campaigns long past. Each voter gets an individual booth so there are no lines at the magic hour. The votes were quickly counted, announced and recorded on a posterboard that proclaims, "First in the Nation, Dixville Notch." The tradition drew spectators, including Tim McKenna, who drove with his wife 16 miles from Cambridge, N.H., to witness the event. "Living in New Hampshire, you hear so much about it in the news," said McKenna. "I think it's a very historic election this year." Ed Butler, a Democratic state representative who runs the Notchland Inn in Hart's Location, said, "Being this small and being able to be first just makes it that much more special." Although scores of states have voted early, the two villages are the first to officially announce the results on Election Day. New Hampshire law requires polls to open at 11 a.m., but that doesn't stop towns from opening earlier. It also allows towns to close their polls once all registered and eligible voters have cast ballots. Hart's Location started opening its polls early in 1948, the year Harry S. Truman beat Thomas Dewey, to accommodate railroad workers who had to get to work early. Hart's Location got out of the early voting business in 1964 after some residents grew weary of all the publicity, but brought it back in 1996. Dixville Notch, nestled in a mountain pass 1,800 feet up and about halfway between the White Mountain National Forest and the Canadian border, followed suit in 1960, when John F. Kennedy beat Richard M. Nixon. Nixon, the Republican, swept all nine votes cast in Dixville that year, and before Tuesday, the town had gone for a Democrat only once since then. That was in 1968, when the tally was Democrat Hubert Humphrey eight, Nixon four. From dfmanno at mail.com Tue Nov 4 01:55:16 2008 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Tue Nov 4 02:00:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Fearless Election-Eve Electoral College Prognostications References: Message-ID: In article , BlueWave wrote: > Since we're just about at the end of this campaign cycle, it's time to > take a semi-educated guess at what the results might be Tuesday night. > > While I think most of us on this group would like to see a landslide for > Obama (including me), it's also possible that this election could be a > lot closer than some of the polls indicate. So after consulting my own > internal "poll of polls", I'm predicting: > > Obama: 303 > McCain: 235 > > Anyone else care to offer up their prediction? Winner gets bragging > rights until the next presidential election (or until the Electoral > College is abolished, whichever comes first). In the Daily Kos prediction contest (prize: a new MacBook), I went with Obama 311, McCain 227. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com Corporation: n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. (Ambrose Bierce) From dfmanno at mail.com Tue Nov 4 02:04:50 2008 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Tue Nov 4 02:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: ranking the presidents References: Message-ID: In article , Sylvesterthekat wrote: > http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/us_elections/article5029204.ece > > http://tinyurl.com/62tgjl > > Bush isn't judged as quite the worst, (37th/40) but he's ranked equal with > Nixon. Personally, I don't think we know the half of it yet and by the time > all the facts have come out he'll probably go in history as the worst ever. This is a fucking joke - Wm. Henry Harrison was a worst president than the Shrub? Harrison didn't do a damn thing in office, good or bad, mainly because he spent the whole 33 days on his death bed. Yeah, it wasn't very bright to give a two-hour inaugural address in freezing weather without a coat, catching the pneumonia that killed him, but then Bush does stupider things every day before breakfast. I guess the Times, a Murdoch rag, couldn't let the Shrub come in last. > I see that FDR was in office for 12 years - did they only introduce term > limits fairly recently? The 22nd Amendment, which bars people from being elected to the presidency more than twice, was ratified in 1951. The GOP pushed it through, getting revenge on a dead man. It's cosmic justice that it's affected them more often than the Democrats (Eisenhower/Reagan/Bush II v. Clinton). -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com Corporation: n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. (Ambrose Bierce) From dfmanno at mail.com Tue Nov 4 02:10:29 2008 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Tue Nov 4 02:15:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: ranking the presidents References: Message-ID: In article , Borgholio wrote: > I personally believe that FDR was one of the handful of presidents who one > could trust completely to make the right decisions. He knew the dangers > that could go along with a president who got re-elected for the rest of > his life, and he put a stop to it. He had nothing to do with the 22nd Amendment. It was conceived and ratified after his death. > That in itself is historic. However > he is also the only president in history to be elected to 4 terms. :) I believe, and my reading backs me up, that the only reason he ran for the third term was the threat from Nazi Germany, and the fourth term because of the war. Had international conditions been different, I don't think he would have sought the third term. Had he lived out his fourth term with the war ending when it did, I don't think he would have sought a fifth term. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com Corporation: n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. (Ambrose Bierce) From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 4 13:39:44 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Steven Underwood) Date: Tue Nov 4 13:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Oy vey, Hubble in trouble again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B4C5A76C52A2sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > Charles wrote in > news:Xns9B4C536696E97TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61: > >> Ooh. a 486. Like I said, my cheapo calculator is more powerful. I >> know that it needs to be rock solid and testing and programming takes >> years and all, but, seriously. That's lame. >> > > You'd think it would have been made relatively 'easy' to switch the > computers out. Short sightedness by the designers if not. The Hubble was placed into orbit in 1990... the pentium processor was released in 1993. It's not like these computers are playing games... I would hope that they would have qualified a newer machine for the same job as the existing one, but that may not have been done and you don't want to take any chances when the field service man needs to be delivered via rockets :) From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Nov 4 13:47:49 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Nov 4 13:50:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Home purchase vs lease - Update In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > As a general rule of thumb in this housing market, would it be > considered better for someone to lease or purchase a home? I know > that's a very vague question, but in a nutshell, there's a real bitch of > a woman on our street who finally up and moved out. She's selling her > house but also has it available for lease. I'm hoping she sells it, > since that means there's no chance she'll ever be back...but I'm > wondering how likely it is that someone will actually buy it as opposed > to leasing. Here's the listing: > > http://www.realtor.com/map/search/listingdetail.aspx?zp=91505&mnp=31&mxp=31&typ=1&sid=8bb647b2381a4deaa4ca6896741a067f&pg=3&lid=1102681783&lsn=28&srcnt=36 > > > Although not listed here, she's asking $2500 per month for the lease. Well last night she took down her "for lease" sign and a second sign that said "I'm gorgeous inside". The big realtor "for sale" sign is still up. She also removed her house from the Realtor.com listings but it's still up on Remax. This comes right on the heels of a $17k price reduction, bringing the overall price to $70k below original asking. I'm beginning to hope that she actually sold it. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 4 14:07:03 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (BlueWave) Date: Tue Nov 4 14:10:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Fearless Election-Eve Electoral College Prognostications In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: D.F. Manno wrote: > In the Daily Kos prediction contest (prize: a new MacBook), I went with > Obama 311, McCain 227. Seems that even Karl Rove is more "optimistic" than we are: http://www.rove.com/uploads/0000/0049/McCain-Obama_11_3_08_FINAL.pdf Obama: 338 McCain: 200 From dfmanno at mail.com Tue Nov 4 14:35:12 2008 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Tue Nov 4 14:40:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Fearless Election-Eve Electoral College Prognostications References: Message-ID: In article , BlueWave wrote: > D.F. Manno wrote: > > > In the Daily Kos prediction contest (prize: a new MacBook), I went with > > Obama 311, McCain 227. > > Seems that even Karl Rove is more "optimistic" than we are: > > http://www.rove.com/uploads/0000/0049/McCain-Obama_11_3_08_FINAL.pdf > > Obama: 338 > McCain: 200 He also predicted that the GOP would retain control of both houses of Congress in 2006. Some expert. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com Corporation: n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. (Ambrose Bierce) From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 4 15:35:45 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (BlueWave) Date: Tue Nov 4 15:40:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Fearless Election-Eve Electoral College Prognostications In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: D.F. Manno wrote: > He also predicted that the GOP would retain control of both houses of > Congress in 2006. Some expert. In this case, I hope he's right.... ;-) From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Nov 4 16:11:44 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Nov 4 16:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Home purchase vs lease - Update In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:geq5cu$n97$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Well last night she took down her "for lease" sign and a second sign >> that said "I'm gorgeous inside". The big realtor "for sale" sign is >> still up. >> She also removed her house from the Realtor.com listings but it's >> still >> up on Remax. This comes right on the heels of a $17k price reduction, >> bringing the overall price to $70k below original asking. I'm >> beginning to hope that she actually sold it. >> > > It'd say 'sold' or 'in escrow' if she had, wouldn't it? I would think, but she could be waiting for it to be official. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 4 20:43:37 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Nov 4 20:45:05 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Home purchase vs lease - Update References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B4CAE50B461Esylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > Yay, they just called PA for Obama hee hee. Ditto NH and IL... and NJ! And > MA. And MD (good boy indi). And CT. And VT. And ME. And DE. And DC. > Leading > FL whooo! > > KY, SC, TN and OK for McCain. > > Results are coming in thick and fast. And so far it's looking good lol Bwah!! I loved what they just said on NBC - "Bush Bush Bush, bringing the party down". That's quite a legacy, not only has he fucked up the country and the economy but he's sunk the GOP. You get what you pay for. The Republican senator in NH got his ass handed to him by Jeanne Shaheen, so that majority is looking better and better. From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Nov 4 23:00:34 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Nov 4 23:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Obama for the win! Message-ID: Woot! /dances From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 4 23:31:43 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Nov 4 23:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Obama for the win! References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B4CCDC9668FFsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > Borgholio wrote in news:ger5pb$49i$1 > @news.spamcop.net: > >> Woot! /dances >> > > lol, they called that pretty fast huh? > > at last, someone with a brain in the white house! Hot. Damn. I don't think I've taken a deep breath in three months. McCain's concession speech was the best one he's given all year. And I'm going to be late for work tomorrow, because now I have to stay up and watch Obama's speech... From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Nov 4 23:35:20 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Nov 4 23:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Obama for the win! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message > news:Xns9B4CCDC9668FFsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... >> Borgholio wrote in news:ger5pb$49i$1 >> @news.spamcop.net: >> >>> Woot! /dances >>> >> lol, they called that pretty fast huh? >> >> at last, someone with a brain in the white house! > > Hot. Damn. I don't think I've taken a deep breath in three months. > > McCain's concession speech was the best one he's given all year. And I'm > going to be late for work tomorrow, because now I have to stay up and watch > Obama's speech... > > I'm staying up until local state measures are in. One of them bans gay marriage. I'm just hoping that one fails... From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 4 23:36:26 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Nov 4 23:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Obama for the win! References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:ger7qh$49i$2@news.spamcop.net... > Heidi wrote: >> "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message >> news:Xns9B4CCDC9668FFsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... >>> Borgholio wrote in news:ger5pb$49i$1 >>> @news.spamcop.net: >>> >>>> Woot! /dances >>>> >>> lol, they called that pretty fast huh? >>> >>> at last, someone with a brain in the white house! >> >> Hot. Damn. I don't think I've taken a deep breath in three months. >> >> McCain's concession speech was the best one he's given all year. And >> I'm going to be late for work tomorrow, because now I have to stay up and >> watch Obama's speech... > > I'm staying up until local state measures are in. One of them bans gay > marriage. I'm just hoping that one fails... In the meantime.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_Yyao8obPc From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Nov 5 00:23:26 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Nov 5 00:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Obama for the win! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > "Heidi" wrote in news:ger7jg$oi$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Hot. Damn. I don't think I've taken a deep breath in three months. >> >> McCain's concession speech was the best one he's given all year. And >> I'm going to be late for work tomorrow, because now I have to stay up >> and watch Obama's speech... > > Hubby got home at about 6.15 this evening and he was fretting about the > result but I already knew it was going to be Obama's, it was just obvious. > > Ooh, sounds like Obama's arrived to give his speech... That was a historic speech. I actually feel good about the next 4 years. From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Nov 5 00:52:23 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Nov 5 00:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Obama for the win! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:gerakn$49i$3@news.spamcop.net: > > >> That was a historic speech. I actually feel good about the next 4 >> years. >> > > We can but hope that the folks on Fox News and the GOP faithful will pause > before tearing him apart and doing their best to undermine what he needs to > do. Luckily the Senate race is ending with a commanding Democratic majority. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 07:48:47 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Wed Nov 5 07:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Oy vey, Hubble in trouble again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B4C536696E97TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > > Ooh. a 486. Like I said, my cheapo calculator is more powerful. I know > that it needs to be rock solid and testing and programming takes years and > all, but, seriously. That's lame. C'mon, you gotta know a wee bit about Hubble's history, besides long term projects, right? It took 25 years from conception to launch! And there was this extra little 3 year launch delay in there too, remember? You just can't go stuffing new "brains" into something if your parts become 5-10 years obsolete because the ENTIRE rest of the telescope was designed to work with that exact computer. You'd have had to rewire, recode, full retest, a nightmare. I know the 486 program took many many years to finally implement because duplicating the interfaces and whatnot of the existing computer wasn't close to trivial. And the code! You'd love to see that! It takes nearly a year to make relatively simple updates to the code, the testing and review process is exhausting, as it should be. We can "patch" the code in a few days, but hardcoding the patch is what takes so long. Oh, and there's actually two computers onboard......the 486 is the brains while the other one does housekeeping grunt work. And then each instrument has their own onboard processors. Not easy to get everyone to place nice together, especially when you can't exactly hook up a new instrument to the "real thing" to make sure everything's compatible. There's a software/hardware simulator at Goddard, but it's not exactly identical anymore (stolen parts!), and keeping track of patches to the onboard code and the test bed code is a lot of work. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 07:54:21 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Wed Nov 5 07:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Oy vey, Hubble in trouble again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B4C59FEEB9F1sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "Indigo" wrote in > news:geokps$19m$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Well, it's now a 486 based computer, we test flew the current flight >> one in 1999 on the shuttle. Dunno why the article sez it was pre 1990. >> >> > > holy crap, a 486?! Eek! LOL... hope it's not running Windows... Heh. No. Winbloze didn't even exist when the telescope was built ;-) A lot of stuff is written in.....damn, what's the name of the most basic kind of programming.....brain ain't awake yet.......assembly language! That's it! From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 08:05:41 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Wed Nov 5 08:10:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:gehs9t$tco$1@news.spamcop.net... > > First I 'saturated' it with ibuprofen to the tune of about 2400 mg/d for a > few days, which would be 12 of the OTC tabs and that worked, but the > problem wasn't really gone yet, because it would come creeping back as the > time since the last saturation grew. So next I decided to do it with > naproxen, because the dosing would be more convenient, and also because I > wanted to see if I would get the same result. So next I saturated it with > naproxen to the tune of 440 mg every 6-8 hours, which I was eventually > able to stretch to 8 hours and now it is slowly getting to 12. I guess a visit to a doctor or chiropractor or something is just too easy rather than slamming your body with overdoses of meds? > > I wouldn't worry (too much) about 2-3 beers per day making your liver have > fatty degeneration (harbinger to cirrhosis), but it definitely adds up to > a lot of extra calories that need to be burned somehow or other. > > The business about some doctors letting their advice or warnings be > influenced by the fact that some of them don't drink as much as their > patients is a sad fact; but the good news is that as a general rule, > doctors drink as much or more than the average person. Yup, "you drink too much" is the fall-back response for anything they can't explain (which I learned first hand, unfortunately). But seriously, tylenenol + alchohol = an unhappy liver. Luckily, the liver is (I think) the only self healing organ in the body, able to regenerate new cells to replace damaged ones. Ibuprofen doesn't bother the liver too much, most people have more GI problems with it than liver problems. And the calories.....something weird with my body and beer. Say I consume say 4 beers on a golf outing (more like after, I don't drink while I play usually) and I'll gain about 2-3 lbs. I can drink DOUBLE that amount of mixed drinks or wine and not gain an ounce. Why is that? The carbs in the beer? My drink of choice is sprite + flavored vodka, I know there's calories in there....almost as many as in some beers. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 08:13:33 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Wed Nov 5 08:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Blue Wave and Republicans are Morons In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B466B9E168FFsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "Heidi" wrote in > news:ge8ar2$1vr$1@news.spamcop.net: > >>> I'd rather he didn't...I'm a part of that IP block. :) >> >> LOL, I remember last time - you might have been in that block at that >> time, but you're not anymore, from what I can tell. >> >> >> > > Yeah didn't Borg get blocked out for a bit? So far the behaviour certainly > doesn't merit harming Borg's ability to connect but he may have to become > a > sacrificial lamb if things get the way there were in 04 No way that'll happen. The last time the asshole re-appeared I personally appealed to JT backchannel and he said "nope, I'm not blocking anyone again. If you kids can't play nice together and/or handle it yourselves I'll just shut down the damn newsgroup". The groups and server space are provided to us by JT for free, you know.....he doesn't give a rat's ass if they exist or not, and if I was in his position I'd feel the exact same way. So NO BITCHING TO JT about sock pupppets! Deal with it on your own, whatever way you want. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 09:14:01 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Wed Nov 5 09:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:geia9m$ocr$1@news.spamcop.net... > > I agree that there is a significant problem with touting what is otherwise > a decent analgesic (for conditions unrelated to chronic inflammation) for > a condition which is based on inflammation and its pathophysiology. > Tylenol is not a NSAID, nonsteroidal antiinflammatory, because it is not > antiinflammatory. It is a 'good' antipyretic and analgesic.> > If we are talking about choosing a mountainside drug to help someone self > motivate and self enable themselves back down the mountain as quickly as > possible, I think I would go for the coca leaf. And maybe a potent > steroid. > >> Al this from observation of the curative properties of willow bark. Steroids sure don't hurt ;-) At least not in the short term, but bad news long term. A wee bit of hydrocortisone/day can have an amazing effect on body aches and pains. I'm still on 20 mg/day, which barely counts as being at the "steroid" level. That said, I've probably taken more pain meds (OTC and scrip) and antibiotics/antifungals/anti-you-name-it drugs than the combined amount of 50-100 folks my age, and I'm not joking. Starting with herniating my L5 disk at age 18 thru my Lyme treatments I've taken almost every drug known to man, it seems. I *know* I've taken every pain med that's for sale, from aspirin up to morphine/dilaudid/fentanyl. All those percocets and vicodin over the years were wreaking havoc with my liver, and so were the toxins created whenever I had to take some "anti" -- the bugs they kill off release toxins that have to be eliminated by the liver and kidneys. My chiropractor has chided me for years about not taking that stuff, but when you're in pain so bad you want to scream sometimes you don't have much choice. Now that my current pain levels have dropped to maxes of 4-5, I've discovered two natural products that are much easier on your body and just as effective (at least for me) as ibuprofen or naproxen, neither of which I can take anymore. Google "Infla-profen" and "Celadrin" -- they're both anti-inflammatories with pain relief made from all natural ingredients (herbs). I buy Infla-profen at MOM's grocery stores (kinda expensive), and Celadrin (much cheaper) at Rite Aid. Of course, Celadrin, at something like $14 for 60 pills, is 100 times more expensive than aspirin or ibuprofen, but it really works, at least for me. I still have my tramadol scrip too, but I'm pretty sure that both of those herbal products listed above are more effective, at least for the pains I have (joint and muscle). I switch back and forth between all three, I can't afford to take the herbal stuff all the time. Just make sure you read the product labels carefully, some herbs can interact with other drugs you may be taking -- blood thinners and MOA's seem to have the most conflicts. And guess what I found out the other day? All along I thought tramadol was this wonderdrug, non-narcotic, non-addictive, works ok.....and it's also a mild SSRI.....now *that* was news to me! It's over the counter in most countries outside the US, but that can cause some problems for folks with seritonin issues. Found this out while I was researching my new detox drug, CSM, which seems to be working. Well, something's working! I also started a new kind of physical therapy two weeks ago, it's called Bowen Therapy, I'd describe it as a cross between acupressure and massage that works on the SNS. Something has drastically changed in my body and brain recently, for the better, FINALLY, and I'm really leaning towards the Bowen treatments as the reason, based on what I've been thru and what I've learned from researching stuff on the net and my acupuncturist, but I won't bore y'all with the details.....hope it's not just a short term effect, like I've had with other treatments before, only to fall back down again.... From joegill at removethis Wed Nov 5 10:33:10 2008 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Wed Nov 5 10:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Assassination watch, day 1 References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B4D55BC92FFCTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > Watch out for domestic terrorists, man. I mean, wingnuts... Yeah. Watch > out. With all the hate and vitriol about Bush over the last 8 years... I think Obama is safe... But on the other hand with the racial polarization in this nation, I bet all bets are off. Obama was schedule to speak today, but it was cancelled... I would bet he is being fitted for security equipment just like Bush and any other national figure. He will need a day or so to become accustomed to the processes and people (Secret Service). I think you probably have seen the last 'open air' / outside speech by him, though. He will, like all past presidents, have his exposure 'managed' From me at privacy.net Wed Nov 5 12:03:46 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Nov 5 12:10:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Assassination watch, day 1 References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B4D50704665Fsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : Charles wrote in : news:Xns9B4D6DFCB373ATheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61: : : > I'm showing my prejudices, here, but I feel that anti-Bush people are : > much less likely to be gun-toting lunatics than anti-Obama people. : > : : Definitely. Did you notice that during McCain's speech when Obama's name : was mentioned there were loud boos whereas the response was much milder : when Obama spoke and mentioned McCain, and he was in front of a much larger : crowd. There is a bit of a difference (not counting the neocon hard right) McCain lost, Obama won ... it's a lot easier to be magnanimous when your guy won. : : People who might have an issue with Obama are more likely to be irrational : (ie they think he's tied to terrorism in some way or they're extreme : racists). Thus a more extreme response. McVay etc come to mind. Remember it only takes ONE nut case. Hopefully the secret service is on top of thing and has a bit of luck on their side. From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Nov 5 12:53:17 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Nov 5 12:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Why do I still live in CA? Message-ID: CA obviously is fucked beyond belief. Here is how we voted in this election: http://vote.sos.ca.gov/props/index.html Basically we passed a 10Bil bond act to build a high speed train network and gave money to children's hospitals, but no money for law enforcement, alternative fuels, or renewable energy. We said YES that farm animals should be given more room in their cages while they wait to be slaughtered, but we said that minors should be allowed to get abortions without notifying their parents, and we said that same-sex marriage is illegal. What kind of a fucked up state has CA become? We have no sense of priorities anymore. ARGH From me at privacy.net Wed Nov 5 14:43:34 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Nov 5 15:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Please to References: Message-ID: Today is Guy Fawkes Day. the only man ever to enter Parliament intending to do as he promised From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 16:32:38 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (BlueWave) Date: Wed Nov 5 16:35:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > Basically we passed a 10Bil bond act to build a high speed train network > and gave money to children's hospitals, but no money for law > enforcement, alternative fuels, or renewable energy. Did you read the text of those 3 failed propositions? They sounded good on the surface, but there were several serious flaws with the way they were worded (especially considering CA's ongoing budget crisis). > We said YES that farm animals should be given more room in their cages > while they wait to be slaughtered, but we said that minors should be > allowed to get abortions without notifying their parents, and we said > that same-sex marriage is illegal. Prop. 8's passage isn't the final word on that issue, the court challenges are probably already underway even as we speak and it will be several years (and maybe a few more election cycles) before this is settled definitively. > What kind of a fucked up state has CA become? We have no sense of > priorities anymore. ARGH Given our diverse population, CA has always been a melting-pot of conflicting ideas and philosophies. Think of it as a grand adventure - sit back and enjoy the ride. :-) From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Nov 5 17:35:08 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Nov 5 17:40:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: David Dean wrote: > In article , > Sylvesterthekat wrote: > >> I have to say the train thing has me flummoxed. Who is going to use it? > > I will. Flying to visit my sister in southern california is too much > hassle for the short flight. Driving is too much of a chore. I'd > probably pay just as much to take the train than to take a plane just to > eliminate the security hassles. Despite what I said, I voted yes on the train. I thought it was just ironic that CA voters opted to spend money on a train and not on Law Enforcement, as I said earlier. :) With that said, I too will use the train to visit my father in Oregon. Taking a high speed train up to Sacramento to be picked up will be easier than having to fly all the way there. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 17:43:33 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Wed Nov 5 17:45:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B4D8B5FF44C1sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > Borgholio wrote in > news:gesmik$6p4$1@news.spamcop.net: .... > The one that bothers me the most is Prop 8. That's just WRONG. How would > these people who voted yes feel if for whatever reason homosexuals > became the majority and started taking away heterosexuals' rights? Weird, I thought they were the majority, ....Ducks and Runs From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Nov 5 18:33:39 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Nov 5 18:35:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: David Dean wrote: > In article , > Sylvesterthekat wrote: > >> How would >> these people who voted yes feel if for whatever reason homosexuals >> became the majority and started taking away heterosexuals' rights? > > I'm almost convince that government should not recognize/sanction > marriage at all. Let it remain a private affair. I'm sure that would > really get up the nose of the folks who voted yes on 8. I tend to agree with that. Marriage has always been a religious thing. If religious leaders don't want to marry gays, that's fine. But the state should still recognize homosexual unions just the same as heterosexual ones. From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Nov 5 20:26:30 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Nov 5 20:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:get732$srg$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> With that said, I too will use the train to visit my father in Oregon. >> Taking a high speed train up to Sacramento to be picked up will be >> easier than having to fly all the way there. >> > > If he's in OR, isn't that a hell of a long way for him to drive to pick you > up? Shorter of a drive than coming all the way down here. :) From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 20:29:15 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Wed Nov 5 20:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Blue Wave and Republicans are Morons References: Message-ID: "Indigo" wrote in message news:ges65s$6m4$1@news.spamcop.net... > > No way that'll happen. The last time the asshole re-appeared I personally > appealed to JT backchannel and he said "nope, I'm not blocking anyone > again. If you kids can't play nice together and/or handle it yourselves > I'll just shut down the damn newsgroup". The groups and server space are > provided to us by JT for free, you know.....he doesn't give a rat's ass if > they exist or not, and if I was in his position I'd feel the exact same > way. > > So NO BITCHING TO JT about sock pupppets! Deal with it on your own, > whatever way you want. If you're going to start barking orders I have one for you - PAY ATTENTION! :D From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 20:31:10 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Wed Nov 5 20:35:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Assassination watch, day 1 References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B4D55BC92FFCTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > Watch out for domestic terrorists, man. I mean, wingnuts... Yeah. Watch > out. Ever since McLame and Barbie got the skinheads all fired up that's been my biggest concern. Someone did an exit poll last night that said something like 60% of people said their vote was racially motivated, as in wouldn't vote for a black man, but that 30% of those voted for him anyway, presumably they're so far in the hole he's the only hope they have. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 20:37:35 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Wed Nov 5 20:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Assassination watch, day 1 References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B4D50704665Fsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > Definitely. Did you notice that during McCain's speech when Obama's name > was mentioned there were loud boos whereas the response was much milder > when Obama spoke and mentioned McCain, and he was in front of a much > larger > crowd. > That's a huge sign of the less-than-classy tone of the campaign as a whole, and of what the Republicans have become. If McCain had shown that side of him in the campaign he might have done a lot better. Unfortunately he lost his spine and sold his soul to the devil - shame on him. From MikeE at ster.invalid Wed Nov 5 21:57:28 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Wed Nov 5 22:00:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: Borgholio wrote: > With that said, I too will use the train to visit my father in Oregon. The train proposition is nowhere near a baked idea. Not only is it not half baked, it doesn't even a cupboard with the ingredients yet. If you've been watching this idea cook/simmer for a few years, you would realize that the theory is a huge project that this trivial little $10 billion bond proposition hasn't begun to solve. I don't know which will be the bigger problems, the huge amount more money or all of the environmental impacts on parks, wildlife refuges, and protected open spaces. > Taking a high speed train up to Sacramento to be picked up will be > easier than having to fly all the way there. You'll be lucky if either you will still be alive when some future CA hispeed train situation comes completely together. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 5 22:52:43 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Wed Nov 5 22:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Fscking Stock Market...... Message-ID: Well, I finally got up the nerve to invest about 1/2 of my 401k rollover money in my IRA the last two days since the market seemed to have established a stable upwards trend. I bought most of my stocks and ETFs yesterday, and almost all of my mutual funds today. Great for my funds purchases with the Dow down almost 500 points today, but of course my stocks/ETFs took a big hit. In just 24 hours I'm down 2.5% already! Oh well, I'm in this for the long term, everything I bought was in the top 5 year returns for their sector, and almost everything was near it's 2-3 year low point -- nowhere to go but up. I was really thinking that there would be a big bounce today with Barack getting elected last night, but no.......I dunno what news caused the panic today, especially in the last 1/2 hour of trading. Good thing I've learned not to buy all of my planned positions at once! From me at privacy.net Thu Nov 6 06:11:22 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Nov 6 06:15:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Assassination watch, day 1 References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:gethp0$vn8$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message : news:Xns9B4D50704665Fsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : > Definitely. Did you notice that during McCain's speech when Obama's name : > was mentioned there were loud boos whereas the response was much milder : > when Obama spoke and mentioned McCain, and he was in front of a much : > larger : > crowd. : > : : That's a huge sign of the less-than-classy tone of the campaign as a whole, : and of what the Republicans have become. If McCain had shown that side of : him in the campaign he might have done a lot better. Unfortunately he lost : his spine and sold his soul to the devil - shame on him. Something to note: the crowd at the McCain campaign party was the top of the top (invitation only) of 'Pub money tree and those folk should know better and act accordingly. The large bunch at the Obama party was, literally, WeThePeople and clearly not filtered. I can discount the nut cases on the internet and perhaps some of the campaign rallies but the reaction at McCain's 'pity party' is disappointing and truly scary, From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 6 06:43:43 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 6 06:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] From Faux News, of all places Message-ID: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWZHTJsR4Bc Ignorance is shocking enough, being unable to see it and rectify it is beyond the pale. "Wasilla Hillbillies", never heard a more appropriate tag. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 6 16:36:10 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Thu Nov 6 16:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B4DAA8A740E4sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > David Dean wrote in news:v8ltfuv02- > C388E4.14434105112008@killface.local: > >> I'm almost convince that government should not recognize/sanction >> marriage at all. Let it remain a private affair. I'm sure that would >> really get up the nose of the folks who voted yes on 8. > > Well that's an interesting idea. But then you'd get all the insurance > companies saying they're not required to cover spouses etc. Let alone the IRS being up in arms about couples filing separately or not.... From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 6 16:57:29 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Thu Nov 6 17:00:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Indigo" wrote in message news:gevo0a$g0f$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message > news:Xns9B4DAA8A740E4sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... >> David Dean wrote in news:v8ltfuv02- >> C388E4.14434105112008@killface.local: >> >>> I'm almost convince that government should not recognize/sanction >>> marriage at all. Let it remain a private affair. I'm sure that would >>> really get up the nose of the folks who voted yes on 8. >> >> Well that's an interesting idea. But then you'd get all the insurance >> companies saying they're not required to cover spouses etc. > > Let alone the IRS being up in arms about couples filing separately or > not.... And then there is Polygamy, does or rather, would the IRS divide the Tax table by the number of married adults in the household? From aunt.jemima at pancake.box Thu Nov 6 21:26:07 2008 From: aunt.jemima at pancake.box (dwacon) Date: Thu Nov 6 21:30:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Obama for the win! References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:ger5pb$49i$1@news.spamcop.net... > Woot! /dances Hoo ah! -- I made magic once. Now, the sofa is gone. http://blog.dwacon.com From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 6 21:54:17 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 6 21:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Bar0" wrote in message news:gevp88$ifa$1@news.spamcop.net... > > > And then there is Polygamy, does or rather, would the IRS divide the Tax > table by the number of married adults in the household? Kind of ironic you'd use that as an example, as the Mormons were the largest part of the financial drive against this passing. The religious zealots strike again, not happy enough to manage their own business, they want to mind everyone else's too. From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Nov 6 22:07:02 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Nov 6 22:10:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > "Bar0" wrote in message > news:gevp88$ifa$1@news.spamcop.net... >> >> And then there is Polygamy, does or rather, would the IRS divide the Tax >> table by the number of married adults in the household? > Kind of ironic you'd use that as an example, as the Mormons were the largest > part of the financial drive against this passing. The religious zealots > strike again, not happy enough to manage their own business, they want to > mind everyone else's too. > > Protests are ongoing here in LA. The Morman church was surrounded by hundreds of protesters, who then went on a march and blocked traffic at Whilshire and Santa Monica...one of the busiest intersections in the city. The whole protest lasted 6 hours or more, I think it's still going. From me at privacy.net Thu Nov 6 22:07:26 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Nov 6 22:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Why McCain Lost References: Message-ID: Commented on the late night circuit: This was an election between Bugs Bunny and Yosemite Sam. Any kid could have told you McCain didn't stand a chance... From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 6 23:05:24 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Thu Nov 6 23:10:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:gej8eq$l8b$1@news.spamcop.net... > I have to take 50,000 iu of prescription Vit D a week, I am chronically > deficient, even being outside in the sun all summer did nothing to boost > it. Vit D deficiency is the new epidemic now, or so they're finding out, > they've never tested for it before. > Yeah, I had a weird summer too -- despite being outside in the sun quite a bit, I never tanned anywhere -- a melatonin deficiency, I suspect -- I usually turn dark brown after 3-4 sun exposures. Stupid endicrinologist didn't bother to test for MSH though.....but my Lyme doc gave me the scrip to get tested for it. From avoozl at spamcop.net Fri Nov 7 01:44:07 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Fri Nov 7 01:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gesmik$6p4$1@news.spamcop.net... > CA obviously is fucked beyond belief. Here is how we voted in this > election: > > http://vote.sos.ca.gov/props/index.html > > Basically we passed a 10Bil bond act to build a high speed train network > and gave money to children's hospitals, but no money for law enforcement, > alternative fuels, or renewable energy. > > We said YES that farm animals should be given more room in their cages > while they wait to be slaughtered, but we said that minors should be > allowed to get abortions without notifying their parents, and we said that > same-sex marriage is illegal. > > What kind of a fucked up state has CA become? We have no sense of > priorities anymore. ARGH Yeah, the only one I really cared about was 11. At least that one passed. Most of the rest went the opposite of how I voted. Chris From JusNotPlainBill at comcast.net Fri Nov 7 01:52:40 2008 From: JusNotPlainBill at comcast.net (JustPlainBill) Date: Fri Nov 7 01:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-8F35A8.16303006112008@killface.local... > In article , > "Indigo" wrote: > >> Let alone the IRS being up in arms about couples filing separately or >> not.... > > Everyone would have to file as an individual if marriage was not > recognized by government. > -- > -David My wife and I happen to have reached a mutual agreement on this one after 38 years of arguing. The government should create and recognize contractual living agreements for couples (gender not an issue). Should a couple decide that they want a "marriage" ceremony then they have the option of getting some minister/priest/monk/guru/medicine man provide them with the esoterics needed. As far as taxes, joint ownership, insurance, or other legal goodies, none of that should be connected to religious canons. It's up to the government to decide what the benefits, costs, or benefits of a living agreement would be. And like any contract, starting or ending the contract is again a legal matter. JustPlainBill (Ignore the 'Not' in the address) From me at privacy.net Fri Nov 7 05:44:21 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Nov 7 06:10:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] New web site for Obama References: <6m67h451kbfs2h4qt29i26ckl5p6ou59ua@4ax.com> <943202e3-95ed-4ecb-98d2-8104bdaf6c43@e38g2000prn.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: http://www.change.gov/ From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 7 12:32:08 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Nov 7 12:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-04B60D.08330107112008@killface.local... > In article , > "JustPlainBill" wrote: > >> The government should create and recognize contractual living agreements >> for >> couples (gender not an issue). Should a couple decide that they want a >> "marriage" ceremony then they have the option of getting some >> minister/priest/monk/guru/medicine man provide them with the esoterics >> needed. > > IOW, domestic partnerships for everyone. Rather than create a > "separate but equal" system where straights can get married and gays get > a domestic partnership, we downgrade everyone to domestic partnerships. > Seems reasonable enough, what happens to the people already married? > -- > -David Well, they're domesticated and presumably still partners From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 7 14:03:51 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Fri Nov 7 14:05:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-D76FC7.09530707112008@killface.local... > In article , "Bar0" > wrote: > >> Well, they're domesticated and presumably still partners > > It's a ex post facto thing. Would their marriages be grandfathered, > redefined as domestic partnerships, or annulled. Each of those present > real problems. > -- > -David my guess would be; grandfathered, the way any existing gay marriages will probably also be grandfathered or any legal Out of State marriage is "grandfathered" (bad choice of word). From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 7 19:01:18 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Fri Nov 7 19:05:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: New web site for Obama References: <6m67h451kbfs2h4qt29i26ckl5p6ou59ua@4ax.com> <943202e3-95ed-4ecb-98d2-8104bdaf6c43@e38g2000prn.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:gf17m9$ddr$1@news.spamcop.net... > http://www.change.gov/ Has there ever been a site like this with previous Presidents, soliciting comments from the public? From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 7 19:54:04 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Fri Nov 7 19:55:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks References: Message-ID: "Indigo" wrote in message news:gf0eq5$7bf$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Yeah, I had a weird summer too -- despite being outside in the sun quite a > bit, I never tanned anywhere -- a melatonin deficiency, I suspect -- I > usually turn dark brown after 3-4 sun exposures. Stupid endicrinologist > didn't bother to test for MSH though.....but my Lyme doc gave me the scrip > to get tested for it. Melatonin and melanin are not the same thing.... From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 7 23:14:37 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Fri Nov 7 23:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:gf2nvd$9i2$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Indigo" wrote in message > news:gf0eq5$7bf$1@news.spamcop.net... >> >> Yeah, I had a weird summer too -- despite being outside in the sun quite >> a bit, I never tanned anywhere -- a melatonin deficiency, I suspect -- I >> usually turn dark brown after 3-4 sun exposures. Stupid endicrinologist >> didn't bother to test for MSH though.....but my Lyme doc gave me the >> scrip to get tested for it. > > Melatonin and melanin are not the same thing.... > Maybe I got the term wrong, but whatever hormone that's responsible for skin tanning was strikingly lacking in my body this summer. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 7 23:32:30 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Fri Nov 7 23:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks References: Message-ID: "Indigo" wrote in message news:gf33ng$552$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Maybe I got the term wrong, but whatever hormone that's responsible for > skin tanning was strikingly lacking in my body this summer. Melanin is in your skin and is controlled by genetics, it's not something you can have a deficiency of. Melatonin is responsible for setting your circadium rhythms which is why some people take it for sleep disturbances. Maybe something you were using had SPF in it, or maybe your just old and all your melanin will clump up and turn to age spots..... From me at privacy.net Sat Nov 8 07:23:08 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Nov 8 07:30:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Bar0" : >>> I'm almost convince that government should not recognize/sanction : >>> marriage at all. Let it remain a private affair. I'm sure that would : >>> really get up the nose of the folks who voted yes on 8. : >> : >> Well that's an interesting idea. But then you'd get all the insurance : >> companies saying they're not required to cover spouses etc. : > : > Let alone the IRS being up in arms about couples filing separately or : > not.... : : And then there is Polygamy, does or rather, would the IRS divide the Tax : table by the number of married adults in the household? What about these groups that marry their own daughers? Would they be under spouse, dependant or both? Reminds of the old adage: Sex is nice but Incest is best. From me at privacy.net Sat Nov 8 07:24:34 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Nov 8 07:30:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gf0bcq$tus$1@news.spamcop.net... : Heidi wrote: : > "Bar0" wrote in message : > news:gevp88$ifa$1@news.spamcop.net... : >> : >> And then there is Polygamy, does or rather, would the IRS divide the Tax : >> table by the number of married adults in the household? : > Kind of ironic you'd use that as an example, as the Mormons were the largest : > part of the financial drive against this passing. The religious zealots : > strike again, not happy enough to manage their own business, they want to : > mind everyone else's too. : > : > : : Protests are ongoing here in LA. The Morman church was surrounded by : hundreds of protesters, who then went on a march and blocked traffic at : Whilshire and Santa Monica...one of the busiest intersections in the city. : The whole protest lasted 6 hours or more, I think it's still going. Is ok, eventually it will peter out (g,d& r) From me at privacy.net Sat Nov 8 07:26:33 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Nov 8 07:30:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-04B60D.08330107112008@killface.local... : In article , : "JustPlainBill" wrote: : : > The government should create and recognize contractual living agreements for : > couples (gender not an issue). Should a couple decide that they want a : > "marriage" ceremony then they have the option of getting some : > minister/priest/monk/guru/medicine man provide them with the esoterics : > needed. : : IOW, domestic partnerships for everyone. Rather than create a : "separate but equal" system where straights can get married and gays get : a domestic partnership, we downgrade everyone to domestic partnerships. : Seems reasonable enough, what happens to the people already married? Only down graded sex? From me at privacy.net Sat Nov 8 19:11:56 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sat Nov 8 19:20:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] C&C References: <490b83ee_4@news.peopletelecom.com.au> <4910d068$1_3@news.peopletelecom.com.au> <4912241e_5@news.peopletelecom.com.au> <2N-dnenXlcWd0I_UnZ2dnUVZ_uednZ2d@giganews.com> <49126077$1_5@news.peopletelecom.com.au> <4913b89d$0$937$ba4acef3@news.orange.fr> <4914c86c$1_2@news.peopletelecom.com.au> <2bb2b4f8-d164-4299-8357-3518051e757c@r15g2000prh.googlegroups.com> <6nk4snFlglp9U1@mid.individual.net> <4914f227_4@news.peopletelecom.com.au> <6nl26vFm4u3kU1@mid.individual.net> <362dnRRq3II8MojUnZ2dnUVZ_tPinZ2d@giganews.com> <6nlqg1Fm6d0gU1@mid.individual.net> Message-ID: You'll like today's Doonesbury: http://picayune.uclick.com/comics/db/2008/db081108.gif From avoozl at spamcop.net Sun Nov 9 02:43:29 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Sun Nov 9 02:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-EA22E9.09023406112008@killface.local... > In article , > "Mike Easter" wrote: > >> The train proposition is nowhere near a baked idea. Not only is it not >> half baked, it doesn't even a cupboard with the ingredients yet. > > I do believe that they didn't ask for nearly enough money. > >> You'll be lucky if either you will still be alive when some future CA >> hispeed train situation comes completely together. > > Don't the let the perfect be the enemy of the good. This is a real > need that needs addressed. > -- > -David I support the idea in theory. However, the state *cannot* afford another 10 billion dollars in bond debt. That's why I voted no on 1A. Chris From me at privacy.net Sun Nov 9 06:24:46 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sun Nov 9 06:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] cartoon References: Message-ID: http://news.yahoo.com/edcartoons/mikeluckovich;_ylt=AmRIlzJ44HS1HZt_7PwPMFPlcLQF From me at privacy.net Sun Nov 9 19:08:23 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Sun Nov 9 19:10:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Washington Post story quotes Islamic radical: "Obama would be a nightmare for us." References: <6nonb2FimtU1@mid.individual.net> Message-ID: We can only hope. "During the presidential campaign, I interviewed a London radical with suspected connections to al-Qaeda. He was particularly concerned about how Obama might be the agent of such change. ‘Obama would be a nightmare for us,' he said. ‘He looks like the world, he knows Islam, his grandfather was a goat herder from Kenya, living like much of the world still lives. As president, he might finally unify the world's Muslim moderates, who outnumber us four or five to one. They know who we are, where we live. They could crush us.'" http://tinyurl.com/57jm3b -- Gratitude is riches, complaint is poverty, And the worst I ever had was wonderful. --- Brother Dave Gardner From MikeE at ster.invalid Sun Nov 9 20:45:39 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Sun Nov 9 20:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Washington Post story quotes Islamic radical: "Obama would be a nightmare for us." References: <6nonb2FimtU1@mid.individual.net> Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > "During the presidential campaign, I interviewed a London radical with > suspected connections to al-Qaeda. The author of the WP article is Ron Suskind who is a Pulitzer Prize winning investigative reporter. That being said, I doubt the veracity/accuracy/substance of the so-called or alleged London radical's insight into the ways of the Muslim world. The concept is that Obama would be/become a Muslim messiah/leader who magically unites the Muslim world to favor the US and its Christian/Muslim messiah. > He was particularly concerned about > how Obama might be the agent of such change. 'Obama would be a nightmare > for us,' he said. 'He looks like the world, he knows Islam, his > grandfather was a goat herder from Kenya, living like much of the world > still lives. As president, he might finally unify the world's Muslim > moderates, who outnumber us four or five to one. They know who we are, > where we live. They could crush us.'" > > http://tinyurl.com/57jm3b Whoever might believe in Obama as an agent of change for the US and its world leadership, I don't think they should quite get so hysterical. I don't think that Ron Suskind's pumping up of his 'Moral Authority' essay, which was otherwise reasonable except for that paragraph, with the anonymous and perhaps fictitious London radical's alleged remarks does any credit to his reputation as a reporter. Maybe he's trying to make the transition from investigative reporter, to author (2 books so far presumably nonfiction), to an inspirational fiction novelist. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Sun Nov 9 00:04:46 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Mon Nov 10 10:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:gf34ov$6ks$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Indigo" wrote in message > news:gf33ng$552$1@news.spamcop.net... >> >> Maybe I got the term wrong, but whatever hormone that's responsible for >> skin tanning was strikingly lacking in my body this summer. > > Melanin is in your skin and is controlled by genetics, it's not something > you can have a deficiency of. Melatonin is responsible for setting your > circadium rhythms which is why some people take it for sleep disturbances. > Maybe something you were using had SPF in it, or maybe your just old and > all your melanin will clump up and turn to age spots..... I don't use suntan lotion, at least very rarely. I've always tanned instantly without sunburn. And you've got it wrong anyway: http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ultranet/BiologyPages/M/MSH.html It's complicated, but the pituitary gland must start the tanning process (I had no measureable ACTH in my last blood test, getting my MSH levels checked next week): Tanning Proopiomelanocortin (POMC), the same precursor molecule from which the adrenocorticotropic hormone (ACTH) is synthesized, also produces two forms of MSH. One of them, a-MSH, is identical to the first 13 amino acids at the amino terminal of ACTH. a-MSH is responsible for tanning in humans. * When ultraviolet light strikes skin cells (keratinocytes), it activates the transcription factor p53. * p53 turns on transcription of the gene encoding POMC. * Cleavage of the POMC protein produces o a-MSH. This is secreted from the cells and stimulates nearby melanocytes (thus a paracrine effect) to synthesize melanin. The melanin is secreted by the melanocytes and taken up by the skin cells. o ACTH. This is secreted into the blood and may help reduce skin inflammation by stimulating the release of glucocorticoids from the adrenal cortex. o ?-endorphin. This may help suppress the pain of sunburn. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 10 15:20:00 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Mon Nov 10 15:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-6724D2.10161510112008@killface.local... > In article , "Bar0" > wrote: > >> ny legal Out of State marriage is >> "grandfathered" > > The term there is given full faith and credit. Article IV, Section 1 > of the US Constitution. > -- > -David I new that grandfathered was inappropriate in the context of that last scenario. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 10 18:10:01 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Mon Nov 10 18:10:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: One of those weeks References: Message-ID: "Indigo" wrote in message news:gf9l8b$m1q$1@news.spamcop.net... > > > I don't use suntan lotion, at least very rarely. I've always tanned > instantly without sunburn. And you've got it wrong anyway: > > http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ultranet/BiologyPages/M/MSH.html > > It's complicated, but the pituitary gland must start the tanning process > (I had no measureable ACTH in my last blood test, getting my MSH levels > checked next week): No I don't have it wrong, you have it confused - melanin may have something to do with your pituitary, but it has absolutely nothing to do with melatonin.....Melanin decreases as you age anyway, so you wouldn't necessarily always get as dark as you did. From me at privacy.net Mon Nov 10 23:02:26 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Nov 10 23:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] I'm sick Message-ID: I have a case of the creeping crud. Seem there are only three type of folk around here: those that have had it, those that have it and those that will have it. First stage you feel like sh|t, second stare you are sh|t and the third stage you feel worst than sh|t. Takes about 10-12 days to run the cycle. According to my wife (who had it before I did) I'm in the early 2nd stage. From skiwi at spamcop.net Mon Nov 10 23:14:20 2008 From: skiwi at spamcop.net (Skiwi) Date: Mon Nov 10 23:10:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's snowing! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > I know, I know. Well, whatever. But it is snowing. Snow is cool. not when you commute on a motorcycle... :-) From gezgin at spamcop.net.which.is.not.invalid Tue Nov 11 01:26:41 2008 From: gezgin at spamcop.net.which.is.not.invalid (Opinicus) Date: Tue Nov 11 01:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's snowing! References: Message-ID: "Skiwi" wrote >> I know, I know. Well, whatever. But it is snowing. Snow is cool. > not when you commute on a motorcycle... :-) Not when you commute. Period. Though it might be cool to commute by dogsled or snowmobile, I imagine. -- Bob http://www.kanyak.com From skiwi at spamcop.net Tue Nov 11 03:24:56 2008 From: skiwi at spamcop.net (Skiwi) Date: Tue Nov 11 03:20:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's snowing! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Opinicus wrote: > "Skiwi" wrote > >>> I know, I know. Well, whatever. But it is snowing. Snow is cool. >> not when you commute on a motorcycle... :-) > > Not when you commute. Period. > > Though it might be cool to commute by dogsled or snowmobile, I imagine. I was up riding in Nova Scotia this autumn - and saw yellow "Caution" with a snowmobile icon... I am guessing they are all over 'Back East', but it was new to me... From not at given.com Wed Nov 12 00:46:22 2008 From: not at given.com (Bob) Date: Wed Nov 12 00:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Spam dip Message-ID: The sudden drop in spam today seems to be due to McColo.com having its plug pulled. See http://voices.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2008/11/major_source_of_online_scams_a.html?nav=rss_blog for the story. No doubt things will be back to normal this time tomorrow, after the spammers find Chinese or Russian sites to host their botnet C&C servers. From dfmanno at mail.com Wed Nov 12 13:36:14 2008 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Wed Nov 12 13:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Spam dip References: Message-ID: In article , Bob wrote: > The sudden drop in spam today seems to be due to McColo.com having > its plug pulled. See > http://voices.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2008/11/major_source_of_online_sc > ams_a.html?nav=rss_blog > for the story. > No doubt things will be back to normal this time tomorrow, after the > spammers find Chinese or Russian sites to host their botnet C&C servers. We don't do the s-word in .social. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com This time _we_ won. This time _you_ get over it. From me at privacy.net Wed Nov 12 15:06:15 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Nov 12 15:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's snowing! References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B5474CB1C16Fsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : Charles wrote in : news:Xns9B5271D20D667TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61: : : > I know, I know. Well, whatever. But it is snowing. Snow is cool. : > : : No. Snow is COLD. And wet, don;'t forget wet. From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Nov 12 15:44:29 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Nov 12 15:45:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:geth4c$srg$3@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Shorter of a drive than coming all the way down here. :) >> > > LOL, what, to pick you up from home? Yep. :) From borgholio at storymind.com Wed Nov 12 18:18:59 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Wed Nov 12 18:20:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in news:gfff78$410$1 > @news.spamcop.net: > > >>> LOL, what, to pick you up from home? >> Yep. :) >> > > Why can't you drive up there? Does I5 go the whole way or is he in the > depths of Oregon somewhere? I can't drive up there because there's no pie waiting for me. From me at privacy.net Wed Nov 12 20:17:14 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Nov 12 20:45:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B547A5727363sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : David Dean wrote in : news:v8ltfuv02-04B60D.08330107112008@killface.local: : : > IOW, domestic partnerships for everyone. Rather than create a : > "separate but equal" system where straights can get married and gays : > get a domestic partnership, we downgrade everyone to domestic : > partnerships. : > Seems reasonable enough, what happens to the people already : > married? : : Supposedly the ones already married get to keep their rights. The whole : thing is ridiculous. : If they'd just call a gay union something other than : 'marriage' the morons who vote against it would probably go away happy. No chance. Most anti's not only want to protect 'marriage' but deny any benefits that would be accorded to such a union. the point I keep hearing is that gay unions will cost 'us' money to support their life style aka the gay agenda. From avoozl at spamcop.net Wed Nov 12 22:49:58 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Wed Nov 12 22:50:05 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gffo8u$410$2@news.spamcop.net... > Sylvesterthekat wrote: >> Why can't you drive up there? Does I5 go the whole way or is he in the >> depths of Oregon somewhere? > > I can't drive up there because there's no pie waiting for me. Pecan pie? From avoozl at spamcop.net Wed Nov 12 22:54:05 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Wed Nov 12 22:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's snowing! References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-4206C5.09362511112008@killface.local... > Bah! Commuting in a foot or more of snow is awesome. Especially when > my tiny little car passes SUVs in the ditch. I wager I won't see that > again until I move though. > -- > -David Maybe if you go over the summit in January ;) From avoozl at spamcop.net Wed Nov 12 22:55:08 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Wed Nov 12 23:00:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: It's snowing! References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:gffe0t$2v7$1@news.spamcop.net... > > "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message > news:Xns9B5474CB1C16Fsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > : Charles wrote in > : news:Xns9B5271D20D667TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61: > : > : > I know, I know. Well, whatever. But it is snowing. Snow is cool. > : > > : > : No. Snow is COLD. > > And wet, don;'t forget wet. > That depends. Some states gets damn dry snow. Fortunately, CA isn't one of em. :) From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Nov 13 00:26:11 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Nov 13 00:30:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Chris F. Willoughby wrote: > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:gffo8u$410$2@news.spamcop.net... >> Sylvesterthekat wrote: >>> Why can't you drive up there? Does I5 go the whole way or is he in the >>> depths of Oregon somewhere? >> I can't drive up there because there's no pie waiting for me. > > Pecan pie? > > Pumpkin. From me at privacy.net Thu Nov 13 14:49:42 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Nov 13 14:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gfgdpd$410$3@news.spamcop.net... : Chris F. Willoughby wrote: : > "Borgholio" wrote in message : > news:gffo8u$410$2@news.spamcop.net... : >> Sylvesterthekat wrote: : >>> Why can't you drive up there? Does I5 go the whole way or is he in the : >>> depths of Oregon somewhere? : >> I can't drive up there because there's no pie waiting for me. : > : > Pecan pie? : > : > : : Pumpkin. Yaaa Pumpkin. My DIL, grand kids and I work on a pumpkin pie economy. Right now I'm in credit mode wrg to pie. Might catch up over the holidays. From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Nov 13 14:53:50 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Nov 13 14:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:gfgdpd$410$3@news.spamcop.net... > : Chris F. Willoughby wrote: > : > "Borgholio" wrote in message > : > news:gffo8u$410$2@news.spamcop.net... > : >> Sylvesterthekat wrote: > : >>> Why can't you drive up there? Does I5 go the whole way or is he in the > : >>> depths of Oregon somewhere? > : >> I can't drive up there because there's no pie waiting for me. > : > > : > Pecan pie? > : > > : > > : > : Pumpkin. > > Yaaa Pumpkin. My DIL, grand kids and I work on a pumpkin pie economy. > Right now I'm in credit mode wrg to pie. Might catch up over the holidays. > > Jack in the Box has holiday shakes that are appropriate for the season. For November, they're having Egg Nog shakes and Pumpkin Pie shakes. Mmmm....they're really good. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 13 18:35:46 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 13 18:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gfi0k7$6k3$1@news.spamcop.net... > Jack in the Box has holiday shakes that are appropriate for the season. > For November, they're having Egg Nog shakes and Pumpkin Pie shakes. > Mmmm....they're really good. I much prefer Shipyard Pumpkin Head Ale..... From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Nov 13 22:27:51 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Nov 13 22:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:gfi0k7$6k3$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Jack in the Box has holiday shakes that are appropriate for the >> season. For November, they're having Egg Nog shakes and Pumpkin Pie >> shakes. Mmmm....they're really good. >> > > I think I may hurl. Don't like shakes? :) From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Nov 13 22:28:16 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Nov 13 22:30:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: hey borg In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/video?id=6503001 > > looks like burbank gets off fairly lightly. don't move to pasadena or > downtown la lol. my area seems to have about the same predicted shaking as > burbank, maybe a little lighter as it's further away Oh yeah I know, that's one of the good things about Burbank. :) From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Nov 13 23:16:19 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Nov 13 23:20:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in news:gfir7f$6k3$2 > @news.spamcop.net: > > >>> I think I may hurl. >> Don't like shakes? :) >> > > not too keen on pumpkin pie or egg nog Heathen. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 14 19:12:09 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Fri Nov 14 19:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B5651D922A02TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "Heidi" ! > >> I much prefer Shipyard Pumpkin Head Ale..... > > blecheroonie! Like I expected you to say anything else? It's got a really cool label too... From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 14 20:26:55 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Fri Nov 14 20:30:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B56C4E6F6FEDTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > Oh, and I imagine that we go under contract this weekend. Woo hoo! I > still hope that it's at my price and not hers! But after our (very nice) > letter, they had an appraisal done. And it came in pretty close to our > offer! Woo hoo! Still need to see, with the realtors, what that means, > but I'm sure it's good! Does that mean the realtor doesn't get their commission if you brokered the deal on your own? And what about escrow? From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 14 22:50:02 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Fri Nov 14 22:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B55B7BE5D2D8sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > Borgholio wrote in > news:gfi0k7$6k3$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> >> Jack in the Box has holiday shakes that are appropriate for the >> season. For November, they're having Egg Nog shakes and Pumpkin Pie >> shakes. Mmmm....they're really good. >> Yumm...Eggnog Shakes......so good, but so bad for you.... From borgholio at storymind.com Sun Nov 16 18:54:22 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Sun Nov 16 18:55:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Why do I still live in CA? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in news:gfiu2b$6k3$4 > @news.spamcop.net: > > >> Heathen. >> > > lol. > > i wish like hell it would rain, the air is bloody awful and it's too > freakin hot. it's november fer krissakes, it's supposed to rain even here! > how's the smoke over your neck of the woods? i can faintly smell it here, > it's not too bad but i wouldn't exercise in it and the sun has been a > sickly yellow orange all day It's hazy here and you can smell it even indoors. Could be worse but it's still pretty bad. From dfmanno at mail.com Mon Nov 17 11:52:22 2008 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Mon Nov 17 11:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: In article , Sylvesterthekat wrote: > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/7733482.stm > > what the hell are they gonna do with it, sell it on ebay one barrel at a > time? > > Pirates have taken control of a Saudi-owned oil tanker in the Arabian Sea, > the US Navy says. > > The tanker was seized 450 nautical miles south-east of the Kenyan port of > Mombasa, a US Navy spokesman told Reuters news agency. What are they going to do with it? Sell it to a government that is not as fastidious about property rights as others. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com This time _we_ won. This time _you_ get over it. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 17 12:03:11 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Mon Nov 17 12:05:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "D.F. Manno" wrote in message news:dfmanno-44BF06.11522217112008@news.cesmail.net... > In article , > Sylvesterthekat wrote: > >> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/7733482.stm >> >> what the hell are they gonna do with it, sell it on ebay one barrel at a >> time? >> >> Pirates have taken control of a Saudi-owned oil tanker in the Arabian >> Sea, >> the US Navy says. >> >> The tanker was seized 450 nautical miles south-east of the Kenyan port of >> Mombasa, a US Navy spokesman told Reuters news agency. > > What are they going to do with it? Sell it to a government that is not > as fastidious about property rights as others. or unscrupulous refiner, etc. etc. Oil is fungible. Mainly though the threat will be; pay or we spill. From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 17 13:03:56 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Mon Nov 17 13:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B59802ADABTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "Bar0" ! > >> or unscrupulous refiner, etc. etc. Oil is fungible. Mainly though the >> threat will be; pay or we spill. > > Oh, I dunno. Usually they're just holding the hostages for the money, no? Correct, and Oil too is a hostage. Better than freight. From borgholio at storymind.com Mon Nov 17 13:35:52 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Mon Nov 17 13:40:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > It wasn't me! It was "Bar0" ! >> "Charles" wrote in message >> news:Xns9B59802ADABTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > >>> Oh, I dunno. Usually they're just holding the hostages for the >>> money, no? >> Correct, and Oil too is a hostage. Better than freight. > > Not as good as the people. Folks seem to care a whole lot more about > people than about goods. So why didn't they take a cruise ship hostage? :-P From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 17 13:43:37 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Mon Nov 17 13:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B5987AEE9BC2TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "Bar0" ! >> "Charles" wrote in message >> news:Xns9B59802ADABTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > >>> Oh, I dunno. Usually they're just holding the hostages for the >>> money, no? >> >> Correct, and Oil too is a hostage. Better than freight. > > Not as good as the people. Folks seem to care a whole lot more about > people than about goods. But a lot of folks also care more about oil spills, beaches and birds than about people From me at privacy.net Mon Nov 17 14:31:18 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Mon Nov 17 14:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gfsdhn$pki$1@news.spamcop.net... : Charles wrote: : > It wasn't me! It was "Bar0" ! : >> "Charles" wrote in message : >> news:Xns9B59802ADABTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : > : >>> Oh, I dunno. Usually they're just holding the hostages for the : >>> money, no? : >> Correct, and Oil too is a hostage. Better than freight. : > : > Not as good as the people. Folks seem to care a whole lot more about : > people than about goods. : : So why didn't they take a cruise ship hostage? :-P Recall the joke about PLO 'push Leon Overboard"? There have been a few documented attempts one in particular foiled by an audio cannon, (used high db phased speakers) From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 17 19:32:27 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Mon Nov 17 19:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B596F77498F3sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > > I would think that'd be FAR more likely than attempting to actually land > the oil somewhere. I'd imagine the various warships in the area would sink > the ship before allowing it to land or no oil tanker would ever be secure > again. I want to know how. How can an oil tanker the size of Rhode Island be taken by a group of militants in a little boat. Does no one on the big boat have a gun? I mean really, WTF is up with having no security, when these pirate thingies are not exactly a rare thing? From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 17 22:18:52 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Mon Nov 17 22:20:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] My new favorite blog Message-ID: http://margaretandhelen.wordpress.com/2008/11/16/government-cheese-of-a-different-kind/ "So many of you kept wanting us to talk about Sarah Palin. Sorry, but I have tuned her out. If I want to hear an ass talk I can just ask Harold to pass gas." and... "So the oil companies are once again boasting record profits and yet the auto makers are asking for some government cheese. Does anyone else see the irony here? So I've got a little trickle down theory of my own. As long as Detroit continues to make cars for the Gas-Capades let the oil companies bail them out. It's a "robbing Peter to pay Paul" kind of thing except in this case Peter and Paul seem to be riding the short bus. and it's not to save on gas." From MikeE at ster.invalid Mon Nov 17 23:46:14 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Mon Nov 17 23:50:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > Last > night I was looking at that watch and it was at $267 (after searching > for 2 hours, eh?). Today, first time I looked it was at $399. Now > it's at $300! I bought a digital Timex at WalMart last month for about $40. I bought it to replace the similar model which I bought about 10 or maybe 15 years ago for about $15 and subsequently replaced the band once and the battery once or twice. The buttons were getting so that they didn't always work just right and it was going to soon be time to buy a new battery and then the band broke. So, instead of replacing the band again and then likely having to replace the battery and simply go on living with the mild inconsistent button behavior, I bought a new one for a lot more than the old one had cost in the last millenium. I thought these computer based devices were supposed to be getting cheaper instead of more expensive. This one is black and green and has a leather and nylon band. My old one was black and brown and had a leather and nylon band as well. This one can set the minutes and hours backwards or forwards, which is a convenience. It also shows the date without having to push a button. I liked the way I could shift into chronometer mode better on the old one. The most interesting reading I've done recently related to horology was to read about Omega's coaxial escapement introduced by George Daniels in '99. I saw an Omega ad in Wired, got curious and so then I read about it in the wiki, then I went to Omega's website where they had a beautiful animated illustration^1. >From the wiki "Considered by many[4] to be one of the more significant horological advances since the invention of the lever escapement,[...]" ^1 http://www.omegawatches.com/index.php?id=100 -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Tue Nov 18 07:04:53 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Tue Nov 18 07:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: D.F. Manno scribed: >What are they going to do with it? Sell it to a government that is not >as fastidious about property rights as others. Rubbish, it's just straight forward extortion..."Give us a load of money and we'll let the ship and crew go." -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Tue Nov 18 07:07:36 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Tue Nov 18 07:10:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat scribed: >http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/7733482.stm > >what the hell are they gonna do with it, sell it on ebay one barrel at a >time? > > >Pirates have taken control of a Saudi-owned oil tanker in the Arabian Sea, >the US Navy says. > >The tanker was seized 450 nautical miles south-east of the Kenyan port of >Mombasa, a US Navy spokesman told Reuters news agency. They must think an oil tanker is a bit safer than that Russian ship they hijacked last time. That Russian ship seemed to have some sort of radio active substance on board that caused boils and death in some of the pirates and crew...allegedly. -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Tue Nov 18 07:09:27 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Tue Nov 18 07:10:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Charles scribed: >Not as good as the people. Folks seem to care a whole lot more about >people than about goods. Well it's all according to who the people are. I doubt that it would have made top news in the UK if there weren't two Brits on the crew. -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Tue Nov 18 07:13:58 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Tue Nov 18 07:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Borgholio scribed: >So why didn't they take a cruise ship hostage? :-P Too many people and armed security. Freight and tankers have very few crew these days so they are a push over. When I was doing marine electronics back in the mid 80s we were told about piracy of tankers. At that time it was happening in the South China Seas. Tankers could not carry fire-arms for obvious reasons so some companies were arming their crews with cross-bows and swords. Some things don't seem to change much. -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Tue Nov 18 07:20:10 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Tue Nov 18 07:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Heidi scribed: >I want to know how. How can an oil tanker the size of Rhode Island be >taken by a group of militants in a little boat. Does no one on the big >boat have a gun? Believe it or not a fire-arm on an oil tanker is a little risky to say the least. Some companies arm their crew with cross-bows and swords in case of this sort of thing. As far as how a little band can do this: they are expertly armed to the teeth, have good intelligence of where the ship is and what it's carrying and tankers go very slowly with a very small crew that are there just to fix things that go wrong occasionally. -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Tue Nov 18 14:32:58 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Tue Nov 18 14:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat scribed: >Canopus! Where you been, Egypt? No, been following in the footsteps of Captain Morgan AKA Black Beard, our favourite Welsh privateer (pirate) :))) -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Tue Nov 18 14:37:17 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Tue Nov 18 14:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat scribed: >>They must think an oil tanker is a bit safer than that Russian ship >>they hijacked last time. That Russian ship seemed to have some sort >>of radio active substance on board that caused boils and death in some >>of the pirates and crew...allegedly. >> > >LOL, then they'd get what they deserved! Perhaps we should bring back keel-hauling. Mind you a tanker has a pretty big keel to haul a pirate around and I'm sure someone on the Human Rights Commission would scream Water-Boarding. :)) -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From me at privacy.net Tue Nov 18 15:25:35 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Nov 18 15:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Its over now. So here's a poem to cellebrate References: Message-ID: from another group Election day is over, the talking is done. Your party lost, my party won. So let us be friends, let arguments pass. I'll hug your elephant, You kiss my ass. From me at privacy.net Tue Nov 18 15:28:00 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Nov 18 15:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] A cartoon message to all of us from Mother Goose & Grimm. References: <4922cc25$0$5555$9a6e19ea@nhxl.newshosting.com> Message-ID: globalpowerandwater.com From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Nov 18 15:56:38 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Nov 18 16:00:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> I bought a digital Timex at WalMart > > that's where you lost me.. WALMART?! Don't you have any option but to > shop there? Where do /you/ recommend buying a cheap digital watch? Is the idea to buy from a mom and pop (locally owned) store? Or a store that has different labor relations than WalMart? I have friends who work at WalMart. WalMart has excellent return policies, as does Fry's. I buy certain types of products from WalMart, others from Fry's Electronics, others from Target, and yet others from Home Depot. I don't buy upscale products. I don't think there are any 'buy American' stores in my neighborhood and the majority of my purchases were made in some other country. While ago when I was talking about some classy watches, there has been a lot of evolution in the industry. Once upon a time there were a lot of classy French and Swiss watchmakers and the technology was about movements. Then came 'electric watches', tuning fork watches, and then Asian quartz models took over and the classy watchmakers almost completely went away. Classy Swiss outfits became bankrupt, merged, morphed and started making lots of Swatches. Now Swatch owns practically all of the fancy watch companies including Omega and such things as handmade watches are enjoying a resurgence. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 18 19:07:59 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Nov 18 19:10:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Canopus" wrote in message news:gfv5hd$g01$2@news.spamcop.net... > Perhaps we should bring back keel-hauling. Mind you a tanker has a pretty > big keel to haul a pirate around and I'm sure someone on the Human Rights > Commission would scream Water-Boarding. :)) > Surely that would just be considered "water skiing". Of a sort. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 18 19:11:23 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Nov 18 19:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B59D34C0974ATheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > Amazon drives me crazy. The prices change every time you refresh the > window (well, not quite - I haven't seen it happen live, yet, but I know > it > happens, darn it!). I saved the window, I tell you! Last night I was > looking at that watch and it was at $267 (after searching for 2 hours, > eh?). Today, first time I looked it was at $399. Now it's at $300! > Like... The chances that I'll purchase it are going down and so is the > price. There's got to be a good amount of logic and research going on > there but it is pretty slimeball of them, methinks. Whatever. If they'd > just offered it to me today at $267 I would have bought it and been happy. > But no, they had to dick me around so I bought it elsewhere for even less. > Jerks! Huh, they did the same thing to me just now - a CD I had in my cart (from one of their other resellsers) went up a whole dollar since Friday. Think I'm going to buy it now? HAH. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 18 19:18:21 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Nov 18 19:20:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Canopus" wrote in message news:gfubtq$ugu$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Believe it or not a fire-arm on an oil tanker is a little risky to say the > least. Some companies arm their crew with cross-bows and swords in case > of this sort of thing. As far as how a little band can do this: they are > expertly armed to the teeth, have good intelligence of where the ship is > and what it's carrying and tankers go very slowly with a very small crew > that are there just to fix things that go wrong occasionally. > Someone must have a rifle on that boat, one crew member with an assault rifle could be picking off the little pirates before they even got on board. Do you really think the oil tanker would blow up? From me at privacy.net Tue Nov 18 19:31:53 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Nov 18 19:35:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:gfvm0d$cdl$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Canopus" wrote in message : news:gfubtq$ugu$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : > Believe it or not a fire-arm on an oil tanker is a little risky to say the : > least. Some companies arm their crew with cross-bows and swords in case : > of this sort of thing. As far as how a little band can do this: they are : > expertly armed to the teeth, have good intelligence of where the ship is : > and what it's carrying and tankers go very slowly with a very small crew : > that are there just to fix things that go wrong occasionally. : > : Someone must have a rifle on that boat, one crew member with an assault : rifle could be picking off the little pirates before they even got on board. : Do you really think the oil tanker would blow up? Doubt a rifle man on the boat would do much good. As one who has worked in the oil field, chemical plants and transfer dock YES TO EXPLOSIONS. : : From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Nov 18 20:04:44 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Nov 18 20:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > "Canopus" wrote in message > news:gfv5hd$g01$2@news.spamcop.net... >> Perhaps we should bring back keel-hauling. Mind you a tanker has a pretty >> big keel to haul a pirate around and I'm sure someone on the Human Rights >> Commission would scream Water-Boarding. :)) >> > Surely that would just be considered "water skiing". Of a sort. > > It's possible. They actually did it on Mythbusters behind a cruise ship. The passengers and crew of the ship had a blast watching them do it. :) From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Nov 18 20:08:11 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Nov 18 20:10:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > "Canopus" wrote in message > news:gfubtq$ugu$1@news.spamcop.net... >> Believe it or not a fire-arm on an oil tanker is a little risky to say the >> least. Some companies arm their crew with cross-bows and swords in case >> of this sort of thing. As far as how a little band can do this: they are >> expertly armed to the teeth, have good intelligence of where the ship is >> and what it's carrying and tankers go very slowly with a very small crew >> that are there just to fix things that go wrong occasionally. >> > Someone must have a rifle on that boat, one crew member with an assault > rifle could be picking off the little pirates before they even got on board. > Do you really think the oil tanker would blow up? > > Let's put it this way. During the process of loading / unloading the tanker, there are enough fumes on deck that even the slightest spark can set the whole thing ablaze. They often don't even allow crew on deck during that time, unless it's absolutely necessary. However with that said, the pirates usually do their work at sea when conditions are a bit less flammable. I would consider it prudent to have trained Marines or guards on deck to at least keep an eye for any boarding parties. Shooting off the ship into a small boat wouldn't be that dangerous, I wouldn't think. From me at privacy.net Tue Nov 18 20:20:25 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Nov 18 20:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gfvotp$f17$2@news.spamcop.net... : Heidi wrote: : > "Canopus" wrote in message : > news:gfubtq$ugu$1@news.spamcop.net... : >> Believe it or not a fire-arm on an oil tanker is a little risky to say the : >> least. Some companies arm their crew with cross-bows and swords in case : >> of this sort of thing. As far as how a little band can do this: they are : >> expertly armed to the teeth, have good intelligence of where the ship is : >> and what it's carrying and tankers go very slowly with a very small crew : >> that are there just to fix things that go wrong occasionally. : >> : > Someone must have a rifle on that boat, one crew member with an assault : > rifle could be picking off the little pirates before they even got on board. : > Do you really think the oil tanker would blow up? : > : > : : Let's put it this way. During the process of loading / unloading the : tanker, there are enough fumes on deck that even the slightest spark can : set the whole thing ablaze. They often don't even allow crew on deck : during that time, unless it's absolutely necessary. : : However with that said, the pirates usually do their work at sea when : conditions are a bit less flammable. I would consider it prudent to have : trained Marines or guards on deck to at least keep an eye for any boarding : parties. Shooting off the ship into a small boat wouldn't be that : dangerous, I wouldn't think. Unless the small boat had the ability to return fire with tracer and RPG. Not to mention 50cal armor piercing rounds. From me at privacy.net Tue Nov 18 20:40:27 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Nov 18 20:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B5ACFAA9884TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was Borgholio ! : : > Shooting off the ship into a small boat wouldn't be that : > dangerous, I wouldn't think. : : With, say, 6" shells through the hull... It would be dangerous for : someone, but not necessarily those on the big boat. 6" shell into a tanker? best to be 3-5 miles away ... up wind. From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Nov 18 21:20:29 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Nov 18 21:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Frog Prince wrote: > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:gfvotp$f17$2@news.spamcop.net... > : Heidi wrote: > : > "Canopus" wrote in message > : > news:gfubtq$ugu$1@news.spamcop.net... > : >> Believe it or not a fire-arm on an oil tanker is a little risky to say > the > : >> least. Some companies arm their crew with cross-bows and swords in > case > : >> of this sort of thing. As far as how a little band can do this: they > are > : >> expertly armed to the teeth, have good intelligence of where the ship > is > : >> and what it's carrying and tankers go very slowly with a very small > crew > : >> that are there just to fix things that go wrong occasionally. > : >> > : > Someone must have a rifle on that boat, one crew member with an assault > : > rifle could be picking off the little pirates before they even got on > board. > : > Do you really think the oil tanker would blow up? > : > > : > > : > : Let's put it this way. During the process of loading / unloading the > : tanker, there are enough fumes on deck that even the slightest spark can > : set the whole thing ablaze. They often don't even allow crew on deck > : during that time, unless it's absolutely necessary. > : > : However with that said, the pirates usually do their work at sea when > : conditions are a bit less flammable. I would consider it prudent to have > : trained Marines or guards on deck to at least keep an eye for any boarding > : parties. Shooting off the ship into a small boat wouldn't be that > : dangerous, I wouldn't think. > > Unless the small boat had the ability to return fire with tracer and RPG. > Not to mention 50cal armor piercing rounds. > > Yes but if they did that, it'd provoke a far more aggressive response from the national navies. From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Nov 18 21:25:56 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Nov 18 21:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! > >> 6" shell into a tanker? best to be 3-5 miles away ... up wind. > > 6" shells from the tanker, man. .50 cal mounts would be more effective. Even US Navy warships don't have 6" guns anymore. Just ring the tanker with a couple dozen .50 cal machine gun mounts, train the crew to use them as well as small arms. Even though tankers run mostly automated, hiring a few extra men to act as guards would be far less expensive than ransom. From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 18 21:54:31 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Nov 18 21:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Car people, tell me.... Message-ID: I had my snow tires (new last Dec) put on last weekend, and since then my car has pulled pretty strongly to the right, as in, let go of the wheel and you'll make the exit ramp without any help at all. I've taken it back twice, they swapped some of the tires around, still didn't help. Tonight I took it back and the guy drove it and said "yup, it's pulling, I have no idea why". They're claiming it's nothing to do with them. Useless... So tell me, can just jacking up a car to put wheels on screw up the alignment, especially if it's two separate jacks and not a lift? What else would make it pull? He said balance wouldn't. It didn't pull when I brought it in, there's no unusual wear on the all-seasons, so what screwed up my alignment? From borgholio at storymind.com Tue Nov 18 22:03:48 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Tue Nov 18 22:05:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > I had my snow tires (new last Dec) put on last weekend, and since then my > car has pulled pretty strongly to the right, as in, let go of the wheel and > you'll make the exit ramp without any help at all. I've taken it back > twice, they swapped some of the tires around, still didn't help. Tonight I > took it back and the guy drove it and said "yup, it's pulling, I have no > idea why". They're claiming it's nothing to do with them. Useless... > > So tell me, can just jacking up a car to put wheels on screw up the > alignment, especially if it's two separate jacks and not a lift? What else > would make it pull? He said balance wouldn't. It didn't pull when I brought > it in, there's no unusual wear on the all-seasons, so what screwed up my > alignment? > > Jacking a car up can indeed affect alignment. The car body rides on the chassis which is connected to the wheels by various mechanisms. When you raise the body or the chassis, it changes the angle at which the wheels can contact the road. I would suggest smaller tires. From joegill at removethis Tue Nov 18 22:20:37 2008 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Tue Nov 18 22:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] A very different(interesting) perspective. Message-ID: Very interesting article... And what is really creepy, is this author has great track record on predictions.... http://www.prisonplanet.com:80/celente-predicts-revolution-food-riots-tax-rebellions-by-2012.html -or- http://tinyurl.com/6zghms A small quote: There will be a revolution in this country," he said. "It's not going to come yet, but it's going to come down the line and we're going to see a third party and this was the catalyst for it: the takeover of Washington, D. C., in broad daylight by Wall Street in this bloodless coup. And it will happen as conditions continue to worsen." "The first thing to do is organize with tax revolts. That's going to be the big one because people can't afford to pay more school tax, property tax, any kind of tax. You're going to start seeing those kinds of protests start to develop." "It's going to be very bleak. Very sad. And there is going to be a lot of homeless, the likes of which we have never seen before. Tent cities are already sprouting up around the country and we're going to see many more." "We're going to start seeing huge areas of vacant real estate and squatters living in them as well. It's going to be a picture the likes of which Americans are not going to be used to. It's going to come as a shock and with it, there's going to be a lot of crime. And the crime is going to be a lot worse than it was before because in the last 1929 Depression, people's minds weren't wrecked on all these modern drugs - over-the-counter drugs, or crystal meth or whatever it might be. So, you have a huge underclass of very desperate people with their minds chemically blown beyond anybody's comprehension." From MikeE at ster.invalid Tue Nov 18 22:23:49 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Tue Nov 18 22:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> Is the idea to buy from a mom and pop (locally owned) store? Or a >> store that has different labor relations than WalMart? I have friends >> who work at WalMart. WalMart has excellent return policies, as does >> Fry's. > > WalMart is destroying other retailers in a slash and burn style of > retailing. They slash prices, other stores burn. I tho't the idea in business was survival of the fittest. Those who succeed win, those who don't, lose. Those who grow bigger and stronger at the expense of the market share of the others are like the strong animals who survive, while the weaker ones die off. That is, unless someone wants to change the balance scale between the role of government in a poorly (government) 'managed' economy - like so many managed economies which have failed before - and the model of regulated capitalism. What exactly is wrong with WalMart's retailing? Do you think there should be some kind of laws? A big company comes along and provides a better cheaper service to the public and the smaller less efficient businesses have to find some other niche. If people don't want to buy cheaply produced goods from various emerging capitalistic economies with poor human rights records all over the world, they can instead spend their money on locally produced goods with overpaid excecutives, overpowerful labor unions with excessive wage benefits to their members with resultant poor value to cost ratios of more expensive goods which rapidly fail once there is trouble in the economy. Someone recently did a little story about how the UK once pumped a few bil into a failing UK motorcar company, British Leyland and eventually took over the co in the mid 70s. But that didn't really work out either, so now all of the little Leyland pieces and parts are strewn all over the place where maybe some of them will do OK. I seem to recall that the UK Ryder Report decided that it just wouldn't be proper that the government should allow the UK's leading car company to collapse and fail (immediately) and all of those Leyland people being put out of work. It didn't work for the UK to spend all of that money delaying the ultimate failure. And it won't work here either. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From joegill at removethis Tue Nov 18 22:49:47 2008 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Tue Nov 18 22:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:gfvv58$mhv$1@news.spamcop.net... >I had my snow tires (new last Dec) put on last weekend, and since then my >car has pulled pretty strongly to the right, as in, let go of the wheel and >you'll make the exit ramp without any help at all. I've taken it back >twice, they swapped some of the tires around, still didn't help. Tonight I >took it back and the guy drove it and said "yup, it's pulling, I have no >idea why". They're claiming it's nothing to do with them. Useless... > > So tell me, can just jacking up a car to put wheels on screw up the > alignment, especially if it's two separate jacks and not a lift? What > else would make it pull? He said balance wouldn't. It didn't pull when I > brought it in, there's no unusual wear on the all-seasons, so what screwed > up my alignment? > Dumb question but... Did they check the air pressure in the tires? If the jacks were used correctly.. no problem from the jacks... However if someone placed the jack(s) incorrectly and lifted the car by part of the suspension... big problem... What kind of place did this? From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 18 23:11:57 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Tue Nov 18 23:15:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... References: Message-ID: "Joe Gill" wrote in message news:gg02cf$qg0$1@news.spamcop.net... > > > Dumb question but... Did they check the air pressure in the tires? > If the jacks were used correctly.. no problem from the jacks... > However if someone placed the jack(s) incorrectly and lifted the car by > part of the suspension... big problem... > > What kind of place did this? Dumber answer - I got hosed for an extra $20 for nitrogen in my tires - wished I'd known about it before, I don't think it's going to be worth the money, from all accounts it's a nice marketing job. I think they did check it again tonight though. I had it done at Tire Warehouse - so basically a place that should have known better, but by the number of excuses flying thick and fast about how the last guys who did it (same place last spring) were losers, I'm not impressed. Mostly I'm expecting a fight over who's going to pay for the alignment it now obviously needs. From me at privacy.net Wed Nov 19 01:41:40 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Nov 19 02:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:gg03me$sb3$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Joe Gill" wrote in message : news:gg02cf$qg0$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : > : > Dumb question but... Did they check the air pressure in the tires? : > If the jacks were used correctly.. no problem from the jacks... : > However if someone placed the jack(s) incorrectly and lifted the car by : > part of the suspension... big problem... : > : > What kind of place did this? : : Dumber answer - I got hosed for an extra $20 for nitrogen in my tires - : wished I'd known about it before, I don't think it's going to be worth the : money, from all accounts it's a nice marketing job. I think they did check : it again tonight though. I had it done at Tire Warehouse - so basically a : place that should have known better, but by the number of excuses flying : thick and fast about how the last guys who did it (same place last spring) : were losers, I'm not impressed. Mostly I'm expecting a fight over who's : going to pay for the alignment it now obviously needs. Nitrogen is a Good Idea (TM) but not worth $20. If swapping the tires around did not swap the pull then something has happened to the alignment. Might not be a bad idea to get a second opinion from another shop. Preferable one that does alignments as a business. (Bear Alignment comes to mind if they are in your area.) Did you pay for this cash, CC or debit card? I ask as you may have to go the protest route. If protesting the charge is not an option you may consider small claims court. : From me at privacy.net Wed Nov 19 02:14:30 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Nov 19 02:15:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gfvt5b$f17$3@news.spamcop.net... : Frog Prince wrote: : > "Borgholio" wrote in message : > news:gfvotp$f17$2@news.spamcop.net... : > : Heidi wrote: : > : > "Canopus" wrote in message : > : > news:gfubtq$ugu$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : >> Believe it or not a fire-arm on an oil tanker is a little risky to say : > the : > : >> least. Some companies arm their crew with cross-bows and swords in : > case : > : >> of this sort of thing. As far as how a little band can do this: they : > are : > : >> expertly armed to the teeth, have good intelligence of where the ship : > is : > : >> and what it's carrying and tankers go very slowly with a very small : > crew : > : >> that are there just to fix things that go wrong occasionally. : > : >> : > : > Someone must have a rifle on that boat, one crew member with an assault : > : > rifle could be picking off the little pirates before they even got on : > board. : > : > Do you really think the oil tanker would blow up? : > : > : > : > : > : : > : Let's put it this way. During the process of loading / unloading the : > : tanker, there are enough fumes on deck that even the slightest spark can : > : set the whole thing ablaze. They often don't even allow crew on deck : > : during that time, unless it's absolutely necessary. : > : : > : However with that said, the pirates usually do their work at sea when : > : conditions are a bit less flammable. I would consider it prudent to have : > : trained Marines or guards on deck to at least keep an eye for any boarding : > : parties. Shooting off the ship into a small boat wouldn't be that : > : dangerous, I wouldn't think. : > : > Unless the small boat had the ability to return fire with tracer and RPG. : > Not to mention 50cal armor piercing rounds. : > : > : : Yes but if they did that, it'd provoke a far more aggressive response from : the national navies. Based on what I've seen on TV (limited footage) the bad boys have both RPG and 50 cal. No way to ascertain if they have tracers but it has been proven (they have a dud from a cruse ship as evidence) they will use RPGs. The limiting element in the ability to respond ARE hostages otherwise I expect there would have been some serious hurt land on the local 'fishermen' and their equipment' Perhaps a note from Moammar Kadafi (spl?) about his experience in his pissing match with the USN? Might be time the Saudis made nice with some of Israili's special forces folk? From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 05:46:45 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Wed Nov 19 05:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gfvvmi$f17$5@news.spamcop.net... > > > Jacking a car up can indeed affect alignment. The car body rides on the > chassis which is connected to the wheels by various mechanisms. When you > raise the body or the chassis, it changes the angle at which the wheels > can contact the road. I would suggest smaller tires. There's nothing wrong with my tires........they almost new and worked just fine last year with no pulling. I wanted to know if they jack up each side separately, with any combination of wheels off the ground while several people change them at once, would that affect the alignment. Commons sense tells me it could, but I don't know anything about alignment, except when it's bad. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 05:50:26 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Wed Nov 19 05:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:gg0eci$dg5$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Nitrogen is a Good Idea (TM) but not worth $20. The only thing that might be beneficial is that I won't lose tire pressure in the winter when it gets cold - we'll see. $5 a tire is cheaper than most, but since air is free, well.... > > If swapping the tires around did not swap the pull then something has > happened to the alignment. > > Might not be a bad idea to get a second opinion from another shop. > Preferable one that does alignments as a business. (Bear Alignment comes > to > mind if they are in your area.) > > Did you pay for this cash, CC or debit card? I ask as you may have to go > the protest route. If protesting the charge is not an option you may > consider small claims court. I fortunately paid by credit card, mostly because I was not anticpating paying $80 something to just get my tires mounted. I emailed the company asking what their customer service policy is, and if they're snarky about it I can always get it aligned and then dispute the charge. I"m hoping the guy at the tire place makes it right without trying to charge me for it, if for no other reason than to cover his own ass because someone messed up. From avoozl at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 06:26:31 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Wed Nov 19 06:30:05 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Canopus" wrote in message news:gfubi6$ttk$1@news.spamcop.net... > Too many people and armed security. Freight and tankers have very few > crew these days so they are a push over. > > When I was doing marine electronics back in the mid 80s we were told about > piracy of tankers. At that time it was happening in the South China Seas. > Tankers could not carry fire-arms for obvious reasons so some companies > were arming their crews with cross-bows and swords. > > Some things don't seem to change much. > > -- > Rob > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ > http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ > http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ I would think the the rounds that can be used on airplanes would work just as well on a tanker.. So they COULD carry if they wanted. From avoozl at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 06:32:22 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Wed Nov 19 06:35:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B5AB316F785sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > It may come to that, the whole thing is getting out of hand. If the > tankers > had some serious ordinance on board the pirates might think twice about > approaching at all. Hell, they could have dummy cannons on some of them, > it > may be enough to scare them off. Dummy rounds might work once, maybe twice.. After that though.. Chris From avoozl at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 06:41:00 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Wed Nov 19 06:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: My new favorite blog References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B5A489E5C157sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > > Let's tax the oil companies and give it to the auto makers! I hope you're not serious. That'll never work. =/ From avoozl at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 06:48:56 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Wed Nov 19 06:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A very different(interesting) perspective. References: Message-ID: Sounds a lot like certain DS9 episodes. Chris "Joe Gill" wrote in message news:gg00rp$onf$1@news.spamcop.net... > Very interesting article... > And what is really creepy, is this author has great track record on > predictions.... > > > > http://www.prisonplanet.com:80/celente-predicts-revolution-food-riots-tax-rebellions-by-2012.html > -or- > http://tinyurl.com/6zghms > > From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Wed Nov 19 08:35:35 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Wed Nov 19 08:40:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Borgholio scribed: >Yes but if they did that, it'd provoke a far more aggressive response from >the national navies. What? More aggressive than the Indian Navy blowing up and sinking a pirate ship today? :))) -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Wed Nov 19 08:39:02 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Wed Nov 19 08:40:05 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Borgholio scribed: >.50 cal mounts would be more effective. Even US Navy warships don't have >6" guns anymore. Just ring the tanker with a couple dozen .50 cal machine >gun mounts, train the crew to use them as well as small arms. Even though >tankers run mostly automated, hiring a few extra men to act as guards >would be far less expensive than ransom. International law would have to be changed as merchant ships are not allowed to carry arms in peace time. I'm not sure I like the sound of armed merchant ships prowling the seas. -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Wed Nov 19 08:41:42 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Wed Nov 19 08:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat scribed: >Borgholio wrote in >news:gfvotp$f17$2@news.spamcop.net: > > >>However with that said, the pirates usually do their work at sea when >>conditions are a bit less flammable. I would consider it prudent to >>have trained Marines or guards on deck to at least keep an eye for any >>boarding parties. Shooting off the ship into a small boat wouldn't be >>that dangerous, I wouldn't think. >> > >It may come to that, the whole thing is getting out of hand. If the tankers >had some serious ordinance on board the pirates might think twice about >approaching at all. Hell, they could have dummy cannons on some of them, it >may be enough to scare them off. Really the only answer is convoys escorted by an international agreement of naval ships. -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Wed Nov 19 08:45:22 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Wed Nov 19 08:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat scribed: >"Canopus" wrote in >news:gfv59a$g01$1@news.spamcop.net: > >>Sylvesterthekat scribed: >> >>>Canopus! Where you been, Egypt? >> >>No, been following in the footsteps of Captain Morgan AKA Black Beard, >>our favourite Welsh privateer (pirate) :))) >> > >What, roaming the Caribbean? He was also over in the Indian Ocean and left a little message on the Seychelles ;) -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From dfmanno at mail.com Wed Nov 19 11:42:10 2008 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Wed Nov 19 11:45:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: In article , Sylvesterthekat wrote: > WalMart is destroying other retailers in a slash and burn style of > retailing. They slash prices, other stores burn. And then, after the competition is destroyed, they raise prices. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com This time _we_ won. This time _you_ get over it. From dfmanno at mail.com Wed Nov 19 11:44:04 2008 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Wed Nov 19 11:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: In article , "Mike Easter" wrote: > I tho't the idea in business was survival of the fittest. Those who > succeed win, those who don't, lose. Those who grow bigger and stronger at > the expense of the market share of the others are like the strong animals > who survive, while the weaker ones die off. You're not supposed to end up with one 10,000-pound gorilla that can do whatever the fuck it wants. That's why there are anti-trust laws. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com This time _we_ won. This time _you_ get over it. From MikeE at ster.invalid Wed Nov 19 13:26:40 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Wed Nov 19 13:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: D.F. Manno wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> I tho't the idea in business was survival of the fittest. Those who >> succeed win, those who don't, lose. Those who grow bigger and >> stronger at the expense of the market share of the others are like the >> strong animals who survive, while the weaker ones die off. > > You're not supposed to end up with one 10,000-pound gorilla that can do > whatever the fuck it wants. That's why there are anti-trust laws. Yes. We definitely live in a world/state of regulated capitalism. Probably some more of the industries which are taking advantage of the public and the government should be more regulated, perhaps treated like a public utility. The pharmaceutical industry and other elements of health care and its costs of administration and financing come to mind. If the public feels that everyone should be provided/ have access to the highest quality medical care, then the capitalism of its provision should be more regulated, like the distribution of electricity is. But it definitely shouldn't be owned or administered or financed by the state. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 15:46:07 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Wed Nov 19 15:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A very different(interesting) perspective. References: Message-ID: "Chris F. Willoughby" wrote in message news:gg0ufl$6tr$1@news.spamcop.net... > Sounds a lot like certain DS9 episodes. > > Chris eh? What's that? DS9? I don't make that connection at all. But there was some TV series set in Seattle a coupl'a years back, can't remember the title that might connect. (had some sexy girl riding one of those ninja bikes as a courier) From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 15:53:27 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Wed Nov 19 15:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:gg1lor$ilf$1@news.spamcop.net... > D.F. Manno wrote: .... > If the public feels that everyone should be provided/ have access to the > highest quality medical care, then the capitalism of its provision should > be more regulated, like the distribution of electricity is. > > But it definitely shouldn't be owned or administered or financed by the > state. While not owned the system in Canada is definitely administered by the state, and efficiently so. There are occasions where it lapses unto long waits, but those things do get fixed, and at reasonable cost. There are too many powerful hungry interests slurping in the health care trough in the US and except for routine care, most clients are in a position where they feel forced to make hasty and poorly informed decisions with little information when the services are required. All the incentives are in the wrong places, and patients and now also doctors are getting more and more screwed by the current system. Governments can do some things well, all too often though they are not allowed to or not required to, for political reasons. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 16:29:45 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Wed Nov 19 16:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-357A7B.12214019112008@killface.local... > In article , > "Frog Prince" wrote: > >> Nitrogen is a Good Idea (TM) but not worth $20. > > Maybe a good idea if it's free, but the benefits seem pretty flimsy > to me: What conceivable benefit could removing the 20% of Oxygen and other contaminants from the air in a tire have? Whatever corrosion might be caused to tire rubber, and the Schrader valve occurs far more slowly than tread wear. It sounds to me like the "Oxygen" water that some dork was trying to flog a few years back, with much unwarranted success I might add. The nitrogen might be slightly beneficial if you have to inflate your tires in Mumbai, or Peking these days. From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 17:42:56 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Wed Nov 19 17:45:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A very different(interesting) perspective. References: <7329i4h76g8rc2bef0q1haequ0bddvuqi7@4ax.com> Message-ID: "Kenneth Loafman" wrote in message news:7329i4h76g8rc2bef0q1haequ0bddvuqi7@4ax.com... > On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:46:07 -0600, "Bar0" wrote: > >> >>"Chris F. Willoughby" wrote in message >>news:gg0ufl$6tr$1@news.spamcop.net... >>> Sounds a lot like certain DS9 episodes. >>> >>> Chris >> >>eh? What's that? DS9? I don't make that connection at all. But there was >>some TV series set in Seattle a coupl'a years back, can't remember the >>title >>that might connect. (had some sexy girl riding one of those ninja bikes as >>a >>courier) > > DS9 is Deep Space 9, one of the Trek spinoffs. I know, I just couldn't see the connection to DS9 . I don't recall DS9 being that disfunctional. > > The girl was Jessica Alba in "Dark Angel", That was the one I was trying to remember the name of , I thought it had Angel in it but I thought I might be confusing the Angel with some contemporary vampire series, whose protagonist was called Angel, now playing the lead male in "Bones" From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 19 22:55:45 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Wed Nov 19 23:00:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... In-Reply-To: <63a8i4pusvigncs5h96jg22k1f3pi0aqon@4ax.com> References: <63a8i4pusvigncs5h96jg22k1f3pi0aqon@4ax.com> Message-ID: "Kenneth Loafman" wrote in message news:63a8i4pusvigncs5h96jg22k1f3pi0aqon@4ax.com... > On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 23:11:57 -0500, "Heidi" wrote: > > If they lifted via a suspension component, say the trailing arm, then it > may have bent. Tire Warehouse and others hire fairly low pay help and > make most of their money with volume. Don't expect a real mechanic to > ever touch your car there. > > If they lifted the vehicle properly, no harm could have been done, unless > something was already about to break on its own. > I agree 100% -- if they put the jacks on suspension components and bent something that's bad news, but those guys would have to be idiots to do such a thing -- the car has very specific jack points on the chassis, if they ignored those......anyway, I occasionally have "pulling to the right" issue with my car, and every time it's been incorrect tire pressures, in either the front or rear (yes, the rear tire pressures can make your car pull too). I *may* have a slight misalignment of the front end, but a few pounds of air pressure in a tire can completely fix the problem. Also, be aware that almost all roads, especially highways, to _not_ have flat surfaces, so they can drain water away more efficiently. You may get a totally different feel riding in the far right lane (tilted to the right) than in the far left lane (tilted to the left). Basically, most roads are *crowned*, with the highest point in the middle. From MikeE at ster.invalid Wed Nov 19 23:38:07 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Wed Nov 19 23:40:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: David Dean wrote: > I just got done telling someone else the story of how I almost > died... > I had been in a waiting period to be eligible for my employer's > health insurance. You experienced that story, not me, but it sounds to me like your care was being adversely affected by your 'insurance status', but not exactly in the way it might be interpreted. Around here, if someone is really poor, unemployed, and uninsured, there is no 'barrier' to their health care - they are eligible for 'Medi-Cal'. Health care providers don't have a 'problem' with providing them services -- the majority of those services are paid for by the state of CA and some of those services the provider 'eats'. Similarly Medi-Care. However/But, if someone is a middle class citizen who is underinsured or uninsured, then their 'uncovered' (or all) medical expenses are going to be coming out of their own pocket - which is actually a better deal/ better reimbursement/ for the health care providers because the cost of those services is paid for 'at retail' - the full usual and customary list fees - whereas insurance patients and medi-cal and medi-care patients services are only reimbursed at the 'allowable' rates for those services, a fraction of the 'usual and customary'. That is, the financially responsible patient pays more for their services. However, if some patient with resources is in some kind of never-never land in which they are 'almost' eligible for medi-cal - or almost eligible for employment health insurance - then there might be some kind of tendency to 'slightly' delay providing the necessary diagnostic or therapeutic services because of providers' human/social/financial concern that those medical costs would have to be borne in full by the resourced patient. And/But slight delays in some medical care might have unintended/unexpected consequences. So then my imaginary story (not necessarily yours) turns out that the worst kind of 'insured' condition that one could be in that might affect the quality of their care is not poor and uninsured, but instead it is the status of 'about to be insured'. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 06:02:33 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 20 06:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... References: <63a8i4pusvigncs5h96jg22k1f3pi0aqon@4ax.com> Message-ID: "Indigo" wrote in message news:gg2n43$m68$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Also, be aware that almost all roads, especially highways, to _not_ have > flat surfaces, so they can drain water away more efficiently. You may get > a totally different feel riding in the far right lane (tilted to the > right) than in the far left lane (tilted to the left). Basically, most > roads are *crowned*, with the highest point in the middle. That was the obvious indication that there was a problem - I was in the left two lanes of 95, and it was pulling UPhill toward the crown. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 06:04:29 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 20 06:05:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B5BB2511C6A9sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > "Bar0" wrote in news:gg20gb$e9k$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> What conceivable benefit could removing the 20% of Oxygen and other >> contaminants from the air in a tire have? > > It's really only of benefit for aircraft tires because the lack of oxygen > means they won't explode in flames. butbutbutbut....I'll better mileage and I won't lose air pressure when it gets really cold! Really! From me at privacy.net Thu Nov 20 06:53:22 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Nov 20 06:55:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "D.F. Manno" wrote in message news:dfmanno-7237CC.11421019112008@news.cesmail.net... : In article , : Sylvesterthekat wrote: : : > Wal-Mart is destroying other retailers in a slash and burn style of : > retailing. They slash prices, other stores burn. : : And then, after the competition is destroyed, they raise prices. Bingo! Usually higher than the prevailing prices from before. I've been places were WM was the only game in town and for near 50 miles. (except for another WM) Go to their web site and you'll find you are required to enter you zip code. If you have time fine an area where WM is the only game in town and then find a not too far away WM that still has some competition. Prices on the same item will vary considerably. And no, shipping distances won't account for the difference. From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Thu Nov 20 07:49:59 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Thu Nov 20 07:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat scribed: >>Dummy rounds might work once, maybe twice.. After that though.. >> >>Chris >> >> >> > >Ah but they wouldn't know which ones were carrying the dummy >rounds/cannons. Some of them could be live. Considering the Russian navy has been approached by several companies to escort convoys through those waters it could mean a different slant on Russian Roulette :)) -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Thu Nov 20 07:51:34 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Thu Nov 20 07:55:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat scribed: >>Really the only answer is convoys escorted by an international >>agreement of naval ships. >> > >Apparently they're already stretched thin. I guess if they were in a convoy >it'd require fewer protectors but then there'd be the risk of blowing up a >container ship when aiming at a pirate. That's a point, the US already have a bit of a bad reputation for "Friendly Fire". -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Thu Nov 20 07:57:05 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Thu Nov 20 08:00:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat scribed: >>He was also over in the Indian Ocean and left a little message on the >>Seychelles ;) >> > >Really? I didn't know that. So you've been having a fun old time in the >Seychelles huh? Lucky you! No, only in my out of control imagination. However, if anyone has photos of the glyphs Captain Morgan wrote on those cliffs in the Seychelles I may very well go over there as they are supposed to point to his treasure and I believe I've found the code to transliterate the glyphs along with a strong suspicion of the language it was written in. -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From me at privacy.net Thu Nov 20 08:37:19 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Nov 20 08:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:gg3g7u$o1k$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message : news:Xns9B5BB2511C6A9sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : > "Bar0" wrote in news:gg20gb$e9k$1@news.spamcop.net: : > : > : >> What conceivable benefit could removing the 20% of Oxygen and other : >> contaminants from the air in a tire have? : > : > It's really only of benefit for aircraft tires because the lack of oxygen : > means they won't explode in flames. : : butbutbutbut....I'll better and I won't lose air pressure when it : gets really cold! Really! Slightly better gas mileage (but not for the reasons you might think) as to losing air pressure the major advantage here is no H2O vapor so the gas is closer to an 'ideal' gas in that there is no water to condense. This happens when the outside ari temp drops ,especially below zero. FWIW 'dry air' (NOT what you get out of the air hose at the service station.) will work just as well. As to tires not exploding for lack of oxygen, that has zero to do with anything. Hint if things are that bad you've a lot more to deal with than a bit of oxygen in the tires. : : From me at privacy.net Thu Nov 20 08:44:14 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Nov 20 08:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Cheney Indicted References: Message-ID: http://cbs2.com/politics/Cheney.Gonzales.indicted.2.868203.html Nov 18, 2008 9:10 pm US/Pacific Cheney, Gonzales Indicted In South Texas County McALLEN, Texas (AP) ? Vice President Dick Cheney and former Attorney General Alberto Gonzales have been indicted on state charges involving federal prisons in a South Texas county that has been a source of bizarre legal and political battles under the outgoing prosecutor. The indictment returned Monday has not yet been signed by the presiding judge, and no action can be taken until that happens. The seven indictments made public in Willacy County on Tuesday included one naming state Sen. Eddie Lucio Jr. and some targeting public officials connected to District Attorney Juan Angel Guerra's own legal battles. Regarding the indictments targeting the public officials, Guerra said, "the grand jury is the one that made those decisions, not me." Guerra himself was under indictment for more than a year and half until a judge dismissed the indictments last month. Guerra's tenure ends this year after nearly two decades in office. He lost convincingly in a Democratic primary in March. Guerra said the prison-related charges against Cheney and Gonzales are a national issue and experts from across the country testified to the grand jury. Cheney is charged with engaging in an organized criminal activity related to the vice president's investment in the Vanguard Group, which holds financial interests in the private prison companies running the federal detention centers. It accuses Cheney of a conflict of interest and "at least misdemeanor assaults" on detainees because of his link to the prison companies. Megan Mitchell, a spokeswoman for Cheney, declined to comment on Tuesday, saying that the vice president had not yet received a copy of the indictment. The indictment accuses Gonzales of using his position while in office to stop an investigation in 2006 into abuses at one of the privately-run prisons. Gonzales' attorney, George Terwilliger III, said in a written statement, "This is obviously a bogus charge on its face, as any good prosecutor can recognize." He said he hoped Texas authorities would take steps to stop "this abuse of the criminal justice system." Another indictment released Tuesday accuses Lucio of profiting from his public office by accepting honoraria from prison management companies. Guerra announced his intention to investigate Lucio's prison consulting early last year. Lucio's attorney, Michael Cowen, released a scathing statement accusing Guerra of settling political scores in his final weeks in office. "Senator Lucio is completely innocent and has done nothing wrong," Cowen said, adding that he would file a motion to quash the indictment this week. Willacy County has become a prison hub with county, state and federal lockups. Guerra has gone after the prison-politician nexus before, extracting guilty pleas from three former Willacy and Webb county commissioners after investigating bribery related to federal prison contacts. Last month, a Willacy County grand jury indicted The GEO Group, a Florida private prison company, on a murder charge in the death of a prisoner days before his release. The three-count indictment alleged The GEO Group allowed other inmates to beat Gregorio de la Rosa Jr. to death with padlocks stuffed into socks. The death happened in 2001 at the Raymondville facility. In 2006, a jury ordered the company to pay de la Rosa's family $47.5 million in a civil judgment. The Cheney-Gonzales indictment makes reference to the de la Rosa case. None of the indictments released Tuesday had been signed by Presiding Judge Manuel Banales of the Fifth Administrative Judicial Region. Last month, Banales dismissed indictments that charged Guerra with extorting money from a bail bond company and using his office for personal business. An appeals court had earlier ruled that a special prosecutor was improperly appointed to investigate Guerra. After Guerra's office was raided as part of the investigation early last year, he camped outside the courthouse in a borrowed camper with a horse, three goats and a rooster. He threatened to dismiss hundreds of cases because he believed local law enforcement had aided the investigation against him. From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Nov 20 12:37:01 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Nov 20 12:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: David Dean wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> So then my imaginary story (not necessarily yours) turns out that the >> worst kind of 'insured' condition that one could be in that might >> affect the quality of their care is not poor and uninsured, but >> instead it is the status of 'about to be insured'. > > Of course, in my story, I was uninsured for three years, not poor > enough for medical assistance. (I did get food stamps for a short > period) and the hospital had no way of knowing that I was about to get > insurance. I wasn't even able to confirm it until I had already been in > the hospital for four days. The sad thing was that once I did have the > insurance information my care turned around right away. After three > years of inadequate care and a dozen of trips to the ER, I got the > education and medication that I needed to make sure that I wouldn't need > to go to the ER any more. Sometimes patients with the best insurance and resources in the world don't get the right kind of managment in the first or second or third place -- until someone else comes along with the right ideas. That is, another angle to the story might not've had anything to do with your coverage or lack thereof. Maybe the diagnosis was inadequate which had been influenced by your or their wishes to keep expenses down. Often that decision to defer some diagnostic strategy is made along with the patient's wishes to protect their resources 'in the loop' for deciding how to approach something. Once the diagnosis was more correct, then the correct managment including education unfolded. It is very common in low resource situations to approach a problem from a 'therapeutic trial' (let's try this and see if you get better) because the gamut of sophisticated diagnostic tools is too costly and too much trouble and requires too many resources and diagnostic tools are also not always without health risks themselves. By the time someone 'almost dies' from a poorly diagnosed condition, all of a sudden a lot of attitudes about costs and risk benefits completely turns around. 'I don't care how much it costs, someone's got to figure how what's (really) wrong with this guy.' -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From avoozl at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 12:25:49 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Thu Nov 20 12:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A very different(interesting) perspective. References: <7329i4h76g8rc2bef0q1haequ0bddvuqi7@4ax.com> Message-ID: "Kenneth Loafman" wrote in message news:n669i4lkfkfgsa4jj5numg9jft2634j98n@4ax.com... >> On Wed, 19 Nov 2008 16:42:56 -0600, "Bar0" wrote: >>I know, I just couldn't see the connection to DS9 . I don't recall DS9 >>being >>that disfunctional. > > It was not. I think the OP was confused, or we did not see it all. Did you see the episodes where they went back in time to 21st or 22nd century earth? Where there were borroughs of people basically cut off from everyone by walls and security? From avoozl at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 12:50:14 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Thu Nov 20 12:50:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-1CFFF8.09062420112008@killface.local... > Of course, in my story, I was uninsured for three years, not poor > enough for medical assistance. (I did get food stamps for a short > period) and the hospital had no way of knowing that I was about to get > insurance. I wasn't even able to confirm it until I had already been in > the hospital for four days. The sad thing was that once I did have the > insurance information my care turned around right away. After three > years of inadequate care and a dozen of trips to the ER, I got the > education and medication that I needed to make sure that I wouldn't need > to go to the ER any more. > -- > -David Which would have been cheaper for the hospital in the long run if they'd just given that to you in the first place! Retards.. Chris From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 14:35:22 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Thu Nov 20 14:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B5C731999CCsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > David Dean wrote in > news:v8ltfuv02-F73566.18010219112008@killface.local: > > Today you can get first class care with >> insurance, second class care and bankruptcy, or no care and death. > > It's a disgrace, in supposedly the 'greatest nation on earth'. > It's the incentives theory, this is an incentive to get wealthy. From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Nov 20 14:54:36 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Nov 20 14:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: David Dean wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> That is, another angle to the story might not've had anything to do >> with your coverage or lack thereof. Maybe the diagnosis was >> inadequate which had been influenced by your or their wishes to keep >> expenses down. > > You're so incredibly wrong here. I didn't want to go into specifics, > but the risks associated with Asthma are well known. The treatment is > standardized. It's complete bullshit that I was only given acute care > and no information at all on how to prevent an attack. Giving me rescue > inhalers and telling me to go away was inadequate care. The maintenance > medication would have been so much cheaper than frequent trips to the > ER, but I was never even told that they existed until I had insurance. Maybe I don't understand, but it seems to me that the two different kinds of care you received were based on a type of care received as an outpatient in the ER vs the type of care received as a hospitalized inpatient. Most ERs lose a lot of money for various reasons and function as a kind of outpatient service like an 'office visit' for those patients who can't get a doctor because they have no insurance and so the ER wants to 'dispose' of them because they have all kinds of other things they need to be doing and no one has an appointment. The ER wishes that the outpatient asthmas that aren't so sick they need to be admitted could be taken care of some other way so that they would never show up in the ER. Patients who get admitted to hospitals these days are being cared for by 'hospitalists' who do a much better job of comprehensively taking care of common and uncommon illnesses than the care which is being dispensed by outpatient facilities such as doctors offices or even ER outpatient areas. The ER functions as a kind of triage process. These patients are very urgent and maybe can be completely taken care of in the ER and sent away. These patients are not very urgent and probably can be taken care of in terms of urgency after all of the other business and eventually they will be 'sent away' - dispense with - from the ER's perspective - even if they are lacking comprehensive care over the long run. These other patients are very urgent and need to be put into the hospital and taken care of by hospitalists or surgeons or whatever. There are mixed types of the above patients visiting ERs, but I can certainly see how a recurrent asthma problem, which in its mildest forms is a very common ailment which is usually managed satisfactorily by pediatricians and generalists and internists and pulmonists and all kinds of 'ists' in an office outpatient setting, not even urgent care and/but in its most severe and refractory forms is an instantly deadly disorder. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Nov 20 18:21:44 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Nov 20 18:25:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: David Dean wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> Maybe I don't understand, but it seems to me that the two different >> kinds of care you received were based on a type of care received as an >> outpatient in the ER vs the type of care received as a hospitalized >> inpatient. > A simple pair or prescriptions and good instructions would have > insured that I never had to come back. These days the same drugs are > available in a single medication. So, if I'm understanding you correctly, your beef with the ER's version of outpatient services was that they didn't do a good enough job of outpatient 'home medication' prescribing and educating you as if they were instead of an ER an inpatient hospitalist or an office-type of outpatient service. Many ERs don't consider home management and its associated prescriptions and other regimens to be part of their bag -- they may hand the patient some medications or even a printed handout which will last until such soon day that the patient is going to be seen by their 'own' doctor or the (previously unknown to the patient) doctor which the ER doc has arranged to see the patient in the very very near future. ER docs have a 'power' to motivate the doctors in their community to see an ER patient very very soon - again, the ER wants the patients being managed by the community's outpatient resources - especially those with asthma. On the visits for which you were deemed to not need admission but simply acute management which converted to discharge from the ER, apparently it was your opinion that your overall outpatient longrange condition should have been managed by the ER more comprehensively. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 19:53:03 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 20 19:55:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "Bar0" wrote in message news:gg4e5r$fak$1@news.spamcop.net... > > It's the incentives theory, this is an incentive to get wealthy. I've said it before and I'll say it again - there should be no way to profit in healthcare - that's where all the corruption is - when you start cutting costs you start affecting people's lives in a way that wouldn't happen if they were just allowed to get treated the way they need to be, all to satisfy the shareholders. It's inhumane. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 19:54:57 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 20 19:55:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Car people, tell me.... References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:gg3p6v$aho$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Slightly better gas mileage (but not for the reasons you might think) as > to > losing air pressure the major advantage here is no H2O vapor so the gas is > closer to an 'ideal' gas in that there is no water to condense. This > happens when the outside ari temp drops ,especially below zero. > > FWIW 'dry air' (NOT what you get out of the air hose at the service > station.) will work just as well. > > As to tires not exploding for lack of oxygen, that has zero to do with > anything. Hint if things are that bad you've a lot more to deal with than > a > bit of oxygen in the tires. LOL, I've not been worried about my tires exploding. They really caught me by surprise, if i'd had the time to do the homework I would have told them no, but ..... From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 19:58:55 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 20 20:00:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message news:Xns9B5AB1B7370A5sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... > well something has to be done, apparently they've already hauled in 20 > million this year in ransoms, even having staging posts because the ships > all started traveling 200+ miles off the coast They just hijacked a tanker worth over $100 million in oil, and they're only asking what, $20 million? Are these people not the sharpest? They could get organized and offload the oil and STEAL it, for more money. They've already got the ship! From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 20:01:27 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 20 20:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: My new favorite blog References: Message-ID: "Chris F. Willoughby" wrote in message news:gg0u01$6dc$1@news.spamcop.net... > "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message > news:Xns9B5A489E5C157sylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... >> >> Let's tax the oil companies and give it to the auto makers! > > > I hope you're not serious. That'll never work. =/ Really? Why's that? The friggin' oil companies are the only ones WITH any money now, and it's been largely made off the gas guzzlers Detroit is pumping out (collusion, you think?) why shouldn't they bear some of the cost of the bailout, if they don't, they're going to lose their cash cow. From MikeE at ster.invalid Thu Nov 20 20:27:38 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Thu Nov 20 20:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: David Dean wrote: > It was only after they were informed that I had insurance that > the standard of care changed. What I'm hearing is that it is your perception that you as a human being were being perceived as some lesser class/caste citizen/patient whether you did or did not have insurance and were therefore treated accordingly. I'm not buying into that concept. Your presentation hasn't begun to be convincing of that. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 21:42:01 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 20 21:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Palin - Tina Fey couldn't write this Message-ID: Dumber than a box of rocks. When asked if she really wanted this as a backdrop to her interview, she said "Yah, no worries". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-kjM1asH-8 From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 20 21:44:50 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 20 21:45:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Cheney Indicted References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:gg3pjb$au7$1@news.spamcop.net... > > http://cbs2.com/politics/Cheney.Gonzales.indicted.2.868203.html > It would be great if it sticks......... From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Nov 20 21:59:59 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Nov 20 22:00:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Palin - Tina Fey couldn't write this In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > No way it was me! It was "Heidi" ! > >> Dumber than a box of rocks. > > Whoa. Gross. Weird. Funny. Whoa. So she's talking about oil prices while a turkey is convulsing behind her...I think it's appropriate. The GOP convulsed and died behind her while she spoke during the campaign. From borgholio at storymind.com Thu Nov 20 22:53:33 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Thu Nov 20 22:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] What's wrong with this picture? Message-ID: http://pics.plentyofsite.com/dating/55/Burbank_singles_36988358.jpg No really, what's wrong with it? Why does it deserve to receive a 3.5 average out of 10 when rated by women? :-/ From me at privacy.net Fri Nov 21 07:45:00 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Nov 21 07:50:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:gg477t$1g1$1@news.spamcop.net... : David Dean wrote: : > "Mike Easter" : : >> So then my imaginary story (not necessarily yours) turns out that the : >> worst kind of 'insured' condition that one could be in that might : >> affect the quality of their care is not poor and uninsured, but : >> instead it is the status of 'about to be insured'. : > : > Of course, in my story, I was uninsured for three years, not poor : > enough for medical assistance. (I did get food stamps for a short : > period) and the hospital had no way of knowing that I was about to get : > insurance. I wasn't even able to confirm it until I had already been in : > the hospital for four days. The sad thing was that once I did have the : > insurance information my care turned around right away. After three : > years of inadequate care and a dozen of trips to the ER, I got the : > education and medication that I needed to make sure that I wouldn't need : > to go to the ER any more. : : Sometimes patients with the best insurance and resources in the world : don't get the right kind of management in the first or second or third : place -- until someone else comes along with the right ideas. Often this is the result of managed care and 'evidence base medicine. Case in point the postal workers (under Kiser Permeate) who were infected by Anthrax were treated under evidence base medical procedures (read cheaper) they died. Kiser claimed protection under ERISA and offered to pay the difference between what they might have gotten and what they received. Opps. Postal workers are not covered by ERISA not sure of the exact number of the settlement but each was on the order of $100M. : : That is, another angle to the story might not've had anything to do with : your coverage or lack thereof. Maybe the diagnosis was inadequate which : had been influenced by your or their wishes to keep expenses down. Often : that decision to defer some diagnostic strategy is made along with the : patient's wishes to protect their resources 'in the loop' for deciding how : to approach something. Once the diagnosis was more correct, then the : correct management including education unfolded. : : It is very common in low resource situations to approach a problem from a : 'therapeutic trial' (let's try this and see if you get better) because the : gamut of sophisticated diagnostic tools is too costly and too much trouble : and requires too many resources and diagnostic tools are also not always : without health risks themselves. : : By the time someone 'almost dies' from a poorly diagnosed condition, all : of a sudden a lot of attitudes about costs and risk benefits completely : turns around. 'I don't care how much it costs, someone's got to figure how : what's (really) wrong with this guy.' 1/3 of people presenting at ER with chest pains are admitted. 1/3 are sent home. both are proper DX. However there is another 1/3 that are sent home against good medical practice. Interesting enough Dick Cheney would have been in the latter group if he were not the VP. According to my cardiologist he would have had a better then 50% chance (low side estimate) he would have died. In my case I visited the ER a number of times over a 2-3 year period. Each time my insurance carrier's 'hospitialest' (spl?) was there and 'managed' my care so I was sent home being advised it was all in my head. The last time the ''hospitialest' (spl?) was delayed and a cardiologist just happened to be passing the ER. I woke up several days later after an emergency 3X by pass. A review of the records showed the procedures should have been done 2 years earlier. But since the 'hospitialest' (spl?) t worked for my insurance carrier and was not treating me I had no legal recourse. An aside the insurance company tried to deny payment based on 1) an unnecessary procedure (their 'hospitialest' (spl?) did not have an opportunity to review before the procedure was initiated) 2) it was a preexisting condition Judge nailed them hard but was unable to award damages or legal fees/court cost as the coverage was under ERISSA. Took me 5 years to get that and my resultant disability. (try living for 5 years with no income and medical bills mounting) From me at privacy.net Fri Nov 21 07:54:39 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Nov 21 08:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "Bar0" wrote in message news:gg4e5r$fak$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Sylvesterthekat" wrote in message : news:Xns9B5C731999CCsylvesterthekat@216.154.195.61... : > David Dean wrote in : > news:v8ltfuv02-F73566.18010219112008@killface.local: : > : > Today you can get first class care with : >> insurance, second class care and bankruptcy, or no care and death. : > : > It's a disgrace, in supposedly the 'greatest nation on earth'. : > : : It's the incentives theory, this is an incentive to get wealthy. Or for the wealthy to get (involuntarily) poor. : From me at privacy.net Fri Nov 21 08:12:42 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Nov 21 08:35:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:gg50pg$cf5$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Bar0" wrote in message : news:gg4e5r$fak$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : > It's the incentives theory, this is an incentive to get wealthy. : I've said it before and I'll say it again - there should be no way to profit : in healthcare - that's where all the corruption is - when you start cutting : costs you start affecting people's lives in a way that wouldn't happen if : they were just allowed to get treated the way they need to be, all to : satisfy the shareholders. It's inhumane. Profit is not a bad word nor is it a bad practice. Much can be accomplished under a for profit system so long as the system is not gamed. (See ERISA for some blatant abuse). Insurance companies and some doctors would have you believe that med mal is the cause of the high cost of care. Data from the various insurance commissions shows med mal is less than 1% of the cost of medical care yet med mal premium are out of sight. California enacted limits on med mal awards. Med mal premiums still increased. It was ONLY after CA legislated insurance reform did the rates go down. (an aside insurance companies still make big bucks under both programs). I know of two hospitals in western NC that had management errors that increased cost exponentially. The were caught billing for procedures that were not performed. What got them 'caught' was the procedures were medically necessary and they were billing Medicare/Medicaid for the work and the patients almost died as a result. Interesting aside my kids are foster to adopt. The foster kids are covered by Medicaid. Fees paid in NC are viewed as low, but fair. Fees paid in Texas are viewed as far too low. Result the foster kids can receive decent care in NC but in this TX there is but one doc in Dallas and one doc in FW that will accept them a patients. One kid was treated in DFW and made no improvement. Happened to be visiting NC and saw a doc there was treated aggressively and is now much better. (formal complaints have been filed on the DFW doc.) Texas medical society is taking action, Medicaid is moving slowly as 'the doc is the only one they have in this area'. From me at privacy.net Fri Nov 21 08:26:03 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Nov 21 08:35:05 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:gg52q8$eor$1@news.spamcop.net... : David Dean wrote: : : > It was only after they were informed that I had insurance that : > the standard of care changed. : : What I'm hearing is that it is your perception that you as a human being : were being perceived as some lesser class/caste citizen/patient whether : you did or did not have insurance and were therefore treated accordingly. : I'm not buying into that concept. My personal experience over the past 10+ parallels that of Dean. Not only with my own family but with my dealings helping friends. This is especially so with patients I've dealt with that are clients of several outreach programs I volunteer. In one case the ONLY thing that got the hospital in gear was the patent's grand daughter parking herself in the hospital director's office until they paid attention. Likely did not hurt that she mentioned they were a LARGE red neck family and unless something was done and done quickly they would ALL be up there razing Cain. (this was western NC where everyone knows exactly what that promise meant.) From me at privacy.net Fri Nov 21 08:33:50 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Nov 21 08:35:05 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] I'm sick (follow up) Message-ID: for the most part I'm over the kreeping krud thank you very much. I did find (with the help of my grand daughters) that: a) Kleenex with a lanolin like additive is much gentler on the nose and face b) Kleenex stored in one of those baby wipe preheaters is also a blessing. From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Fri Nov 21 08:46:42 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Fri Nov 21 08:50:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Heidi scribed: >They just hijacked a tanker worth over $100 million in oil, and they're >only asking what, $20 million? Are these people not the sharpest? They >could get organized and offload the oil and STEAL it, for more money. >They've already got the ship! That would be an entirely different kettle of fish. What you may not realise is that Somalia is virtually in a state of anarchy at present, so many have been killed in its internal wars that there are virtually only teenagers left trying to pick the country up and form some sort of government. It's difficult enough to grow food there and get water never mind refine oil. -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From no.spam.4.me at xs4all.nl Fri Nov 21 10:38:10 2008 From: no.spam.4.me at xs4all.nl (Nico Bartels) Date: Fri Nov 21 10:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Palin - Tina Fey couldn't write this References: Message-ID: On Thu, 20 Nov 2008 21:42:01 -0500, in spamcop.social "Heidi" wrote: >Dumber than a box of rocks. When asked if she really wanted this as a >backdrop to her interview, she said "Yah, no worries". Why not? Pretending this kind of business doesn't exist is even dumber. Turkey's are being killed just to be food for us. Waiting for them to die of old age is a possibility, but the the taste of the meat isn't getting any better then.. Nico -- Disclaimer: the above is the author's personal opinion and is not the opinion or policy of his employer or of the little green men that have been following him all day. From MikeE at ster.invalid Fri Nov 21 14:23:41 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Fri Nov 21 14:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Torture References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > So... How do I get > to know the condition of the roof? It's a 40+ y/o house and it's a 40+ > y/o roof! Arg. What kind of roof lasts 40y? Slate? You can hire an independent contractor who does nothing but inspect roofs and does no roof repair or installation. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From blacklist-me at davjam.org Fri Nov 21 14:29:31 2008 From: blacklist-me at davjam.org (David Bolt) Date: Fri Nov 21 14:30:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You can imagine the conversation.. References: Message-ID: On Fri, 21 Nov 2008, Sylvesterthekat wrote:- >http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/thedishrag/2008/11/ashlee-simpson.html > >"What shall we name him? The Beckams called their kid Brooklyn, why don't >we call ours Queens or maybe Manhattan? I know, Bronx! Yeah! And Mowgli so >he can be tormented his whole life by jokers..." And, as a slightly more subtle joke, also has the initials BMW. Regards, David Bolt -- Team Acorn: http://www.distributed.net/ OGR-NG @ ~100Mnodes RC5-72 @ ~1Mkeys/s SUSE 10.1 32 | | openSUSE 10.3 32b | openSUSE 11.0 32b | openSUSE 10.2 64b | openSUSE 10.3 64b | openSUSE 11.0 64b RISC OS 3.6 | TOS 4.02 | openSUSE 10.3 PPC | RISC OS 3.11 From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Nov 21 14:39:47 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Nov 21 14:40:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's wrong with this picture? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in news:gg5bbm$i3f$2 > @news.spamcop.net: > >> http://pics.plentyofsite.com/dating/55/Burbank_singles_36988358.jpg >> >> No really, what's wrong with it? Why does it deserve to receive a 3.5 >> average out of 10 when rated by women? :-/ > > Is it you? > > Anyway I think Charles is right, it's the quality of the pic rather than a > comment on the person in it. From what I can tell there's nothing about him > that's off putting! The ones that are unobscured head shots (not for > instance the one with the sun right over his shoulder so his face is in > shadow lol) are best IMO. It would only let me click on about 5 before it > wanted me to register. A woman wants to see the eyes, you can tell a lot > from the eyes. Yeah it's me. :) So you'd suggest a closer view? It was originally a high-quality pic so it'd be easy enough to turn it into a head-shot. From MikeE at ster.invalid Fri Nov 21 14:53:20 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Fri Nov 21 14:55:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > David Dean >> How else do you explain that I got acute treatment for 3 days of >> inpatient care (nebulizer with albuterol) but then after I researched >> my eligibility for insurance and submitted it to them, that the next >> two days I got treatment with fluticasone and salmeterol? > > There is no other explanation than that they were doing the bare > minimum to get you out of their door without dying, first time around. Some more thoughts on emergency, outpatient, and inpatient asthma services. I've done some reading on studies performed by insurers about comprehensive asthma management. Everyone agrees that asthma is a chronic disease whose acute exacebations are life threatening and highpriority in ERs. Everyone agrees that education and effective outpatient prescribing keep people out of ERs and hospitals. Part of the problem is that ERs are geared/structured toward admitting or dismissing asthma patients most expeditiously. Another part of the problem is that all too often outpatient services are geared toward 'handling'/processing the patients walking into a nonacute appointment with a sackful of asthma prescription containers which need to be refilled -- and so the prescribers use their time writing for refills and maybe providing some preprinted asthma handouts. As a result of that, healthcare providers spend a lot of money on ER and inpatient asthma services and asthma patients spend too much time too poorly managed which results in their spending a lot of their money or the providers' money taking care of the most expensive forms of care instead of the more economical prevention or deterrence of acute episodes. So, the people who spend the money, such examples as Kaiser Permanente SoCal and health insurance organizations (I forget the initials), do some research to figger out if there is something they can be doing better about all of that. What they figger out is that if they develop a comprehensive program which includes outreach and education and oversight of all of these interfaces they see result in economy and quality of care. The way they do it is to reach out to the patients who've been seen in ERs and inpatient and to certain subsets of the patients who are seen in outpatient areas, such as those receiving higher multiples of prescriptions and other identifiers. When they do that outreach coupled with a much higher quality comprehensive outpatient care, what they find is that the number of outpatient visits is increased, the costs of outpatient prescriptions are increased, the number of patients being prescribed higher potency medications such as steroids is increased and the quality of patient education is increased and there is a concomitant significant decrease in the number of ER visits, inpatient admissions, a vast decrease in the overall asthma costs and a great improvement in the quality of life for the asthma patients. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From MikeE at ster.invalid Fri Nov 21 15:15:43 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Fri Nov 21 15:20:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Torture References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> What kind of roof lasts 40y? Slate? > > Membrane, apparently. Uhhhh. To me, membrane refers to the type of roofing which is used on flat or commercial buildings, and also my house which is predominantly a flat roof. Membrane flat roofing treatment has replaced such as the older tar + gravel type of flat roof treatment and comes in several varieties, such as torch-down bitumen-type (mine), thermoset continuous rubber-type, and thermoplastic lap-seamed rubbery. I'm assuming you are talking about a 40y/o residential house with a more typical pitched/slanty roof. -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From avoozl at spamcop.net Fri Nov 21 13:28:58 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Fri Nov 21 15:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: A very different(interesting) perspective. References: <7329i4h76g8rc2bef0q1haequ0bddvuqi7@4ax.com> <7jabi498s0dai3j60nfmv0vqkndafh4h4r@4ax.com> Message-ID: "Kenneth Loafman" wrote in message news:7jabi498s0dai3j60nfmv0vqkndafh4h4r@4ax.com... > As in today's gated communities? Yeah, no... That wasn't what I meant. Think more like a government run ghetto in the middle of some big city.. and people can't leave. From avoozl at spamcop.net Fri Nov 21 13:31:52 2008 From: avoozl at spamcop.net (Chris F. Willoughby) Date: Fri Nov 21 15:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Torture References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B5D5757BDE54TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > Uh. It's a song. And it goes, "Torture. Torture. Torture." Or > something like that. > > Anyway. I think that we're finally under contract. On the house that > we've been working on for at least a month. And then... Time to do > inspections and we get dumped on with snow! Crap! So... How do I get to > know the condition of the roof? It's a 40+ y/o house and it's a 40+ y/o > roof! Arg. Shovel snow off the roof and THEN inspect it? Eh.. *shrug* From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Nov 21 15:47:07 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Nov 21 15:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's wrong with this picture? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in > news:gg72pq$hk8$1@news.spamcop.net: > > >> Yeah it's me. :) So you'd suggest a closer view? It was originally >> a high-quality pic so it'd be easy enough to turn it into a head-shot. >> > > Yeah, do that. And good luck! This any better? http://pics.plentyofsite.com/dating/56/Burbank_singles_38851789.jpg From MikeE at ster.invalid Fri Nov 21 16:11:44 2008 From: MikeE at ster.invalid (Mike Easter) Date: Fri Nov 21 16:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Torture References: Message-ID: Charles wrote: > "Mike Easter" >> I'm assuming you are talking about a 40y/o residential house with a >> more typical pitched/slanty roof. >> > > Shnope. Pretty flat. The ad says membrane. So, yeah, torch-down or > continuous rubber. Ayup. Sounds right. Yabbut those (modern) membrane treatments were not a technology which was 'around'/ in usage/ 40 y ago. My house isn't anywhere near 40 and it originally used asphalt/tar + gravel on its flatness. There is also a 'generic' concept of membrane for a roof, such as the gravel is 'up here' on top and the membrane/ waterproofness (molten tar on top of black roofing material) is under there which membrane is on top of slightly slopy plywood cricket formation to guide the drainage. Or do you mean the house is 40 but the roof (treatment) is much younger? -- Mike Easter kibitzer, not SC admin From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 21 18:31:18 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Fri Nov 21 18:35:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: I'm sick (follow up) References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:gg6dd1$amv$4@news.spamcop.net... > for the most part I'm over the kreeping krud thank you very much. > > I did find (with the help of my grand daughters) that: > > a) Kleenex with a lanolin like additive is much gentler on the nose and > face > b) Kleenex stored in one of those baby wipe preheaters is also a blessing. I like the kind with menthol scent, as long as you don't rub your eyes. From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 21 18:39:27 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Fri Nov 21 18:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's wrong with this picture? References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gg76o2$hk8$2@news.spamcop.net... > Sylvesterthekat wrote: > This any better? > > http://pics.plentyofsite.com/dating/56/Burbank_singles_38851789.jpg Ponytails are SO 'last year'...... ;) From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 21 18:43:10 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Fri Nov 21 18:45:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Palin - Tina Fey couldn't write this References: Message-ID: "Nico Bartels" wrote in message news:f2ldi4d4v2f92vipu21ju6i3ta3d7jagph@4ax.com... > > Why not? Pretending this kind of business doesn't exist is even > dumber. > > Turkey's are being killed just to be food for us. > Waiting for them to die of old age is a possibility, but the the taste > of the meat isn't getting any better then.. Yeah, what SDK said - we all know animals get slaughtered for food, but there is such a thing as 'discretion'. Being a clueless bint babbling endlessly about fun while that's going on is a bit much. From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Nov 21 18:44:33 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Nov 21 18:45:05 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's wrong with this picture? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Heidi wrote: > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:gg76o2$hk8$2@news.spamcop.net... >> Sylvesterthekat wrote: >> This any better? >> >> http://pics.plentyofsite.com/dating/56/Burbank_singles_38851789.jpg > > Ponytails are SO 'last year'...... ;) > > Hey some chicks I've dated just gush when they run their fingers through it. One of my exes just LOVED to braid and brush it. ;-) From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Nov 21 20:20:19 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Nov 21 20:25:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's wrong with this picture? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in news:gg76o2$hk8$2 > @news.spamcop.net: > > >> This any better? >> >> http://pics.plentyofsite.com/dating/56/Burbank_singles_38851789.jpg >> > > It's better than the other but I'd still go closer if you can. http://pics.plentyofsite.com/dating/56/Burbank_singles_38866291.jpg Closer. :) From borgholio at storymind.com Fri Nov 21 20:28:23 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Fri Nov 21 20:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's wrong with this picture? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sylvesterthekat wrote: > Borgholio wrote in news:gg7mo9$hk8$4 > @news.spamcop.net: > > >> http://pics.plentyofsite.com/dating/56/Burbank_singles_38866291.jpg >> >> Closer. :) >> > > Yes it looks like that's as close as you can get with that pic, it's > starting to get blurry now. Cutie pie ;o) hehe :-P So better than the original? From me at privacy.net Fri Nov 21 21:15:54 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Fri Nov 21 21:20:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: I'm sick (follow up) References: Message-ID: "Heidi" wrote in message news:gg7gc8$bqr$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Frog Prince" wrote in message : news:gg6dd1$amv$4@news.spamcop.net... : > for the most part I'm over the kreeping krud thank you very much. : > : > I did find (with the help of my grand daughters) that: : > : > a) Kleenex with a lanolin like additive is much gentler on the nose and : > face : > b) Kleenex stored in one of those baby wipe preheaters is also a blessing. : : I like the kind with menthol scent, as long as you don't rub your eyes. If you can still smell the menthol you're not sick. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Nov 22 10:03:33 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Sat Nov 22 10:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: Torture References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B5E614338037TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was Sylvesterthekat ! > >> Isn't snow a problem on a flat roof? I sure hope the roof is sound >> lol... or you's getting a cave in! > > It's been there for 40+ years - I think we've had some pretty heavy > snowfalls in all of that time! Umm... Actually the really heavy, deep and wet snowfalls have been waiting just for you to buy the house. From dfmanno at mail.com Sat Nov 22 11:34:05 2008 From: dfmanno at mail.com (D.F. Manno) Date: Sat Nov 22 11:35:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's wrong with this picture? References: Message-ID: In article , Borgholio wrote: > Sylvesterthekat wrote: > > Borgholio wrote: > > > >> Yeah it's me. :) So you'd suggest a closer view? It was originally > >> a high-quality pic so it'd be easy enough to turn it into a head-shot. > > > > Yeah, do that. And good luck! > > This any better? > > http://pics.plentyofsite.com/dating/56/Burbank_singles_38851789.jpg "The page cannot be found." No, I don't think it's any better. -- D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com This time _we_ won. This time _you_ get over it. From nobody at spamcop.net Sat Nov 22 21:22:07 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Sat Nov 22 21:25:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's wrong with this picture? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Borgholio" wrote in message news:gg72pq$hk8$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Yeah it's me. :) So you'd suggest a closer view? It was originally a > high-quality pic so it'd be easy enough to turn it into a head-shot. Yeah, you definitely want to highlight your smile and eyes to attract women, unless you have crappy ones ;-) A "full body shot" is useful so they can tell you're not some short fat slob, but that's not enough. Me, I want to see both -- a closeup of a smiling face (no sunglasses!) and and a couple body shots, preferably front and back views in shorts (I'm a leg/butt man, remember). From borgholio at storymind.com Sat Nov 22 21:24:39 2008 From: borgholio at storymind.com (Borgholio) Date: Sat Nov 22 21:25:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: What's wrong with this picture? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Indigo wrote: > > "Borgholio" wrote in message > news:gg72pq$hk8$1@news.spamcop.net... >> >> Yeah it's me. :) So you'd suggest a closer view? It was originally >> a high-quality pic so it'd be easy enough to turn it into a head-shot. > > Yeah, you definitely want to highlight your smile and eyes to attract > women, unless you have crappy ones ;-) A "full body shot" is useful so > they can tell you're not some short fat slob, but that's not enough. Me, > I want to see both -- a closeup of a smiling face (no sunglasses!) and > and a couple body shots, preferably front and back views in shorts (I'm > a leg/butt man, remember). heh, yeah I should put a butt-shot of myself up. :-P From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 24 19:00:20 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Bar0) Date: Mon Nov 24 19:05:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B60C0A2D6248TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > Under contract? Oh? Really? Funny thing is, the other realtor never > showed it to us. And then she sold the house out from under us. Bitch. She works for the seller. If you never saw a signed contract, legally it didn't exist. Life and real estate agents can be bitches. From joegill at removethis Mon Nov 24 21:16:33 2008 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Mon Nov 24 21:20:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B60C9407D361TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Bar0" ! > >> If you never saw a signed contract, legally it didn't exist. > > Unless we find traces somewhere. Like in her email or office or something > like that. > > >> Life and real estate agents can be bitches. > > The former not so much as the latter! She was probably 'using' you to get another one of her clients to go higher. Immoral, disreputable... but unfortunately not illegal... But you might want to investigate action at your local Board of Realtors!! From nobody at spamcop.net Mon Nov 24 22:35:53 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Mon Nov 24 22:40:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B60C0A2D6248TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > Under contract? Oh? Really? Funny thing is, the other realtor never > showed it to us. And then she sold the house out from under us. Bitch. Huh? Which one? From joegill at removethis Tue Nov 25 01:17:09 2008 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Tue Nov 25 01:20:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B60D9DB95E2FTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Joe Gill" ! > >> But you might want to investigate action at your local Board of >> Realtors!! > > All in due time. First step first! /TIC ON Put down the shotgun, loaded with rocksalt! From me at privacy.net Tue Nov 25 15:11:28 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Tue Nov 25 15:15:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Bar0" wrote in message news:ggff6l$k0k$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Charles" wrote in message : news:Xns9B60C0A2D6248TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : > Under contract? Oh? Really? Funny thing is, the other realtor never : > showed it to us. And then she sold the house out from under us. Bitch. : : : She works for the seller. : : If you never saw a signed contract, legally it didn't exist. : : Life and real estate agents can be bitches. Hire yourself a buyer's agent. We did/do for all property we buy. It's a lesson (quite by accident) we learned way back when we bought out a cousin on some property we'd inherited jointly. Saved us both a bunch of grief. Nice part of the deal is that a buyer's agent cost you nothing. : From nobody at spamcop.net Tue Nov 25 19:41:47 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (bar0) Date: Tue Nov 25 19:45:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B61C055E5132TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! > >> Hire yourself a buyer's agent. > > Got one of those. They only work well when the seller's agent isn't a > sleazeball! > > >> Nice part of the deal is that a buyer's agent cost you nothing. > > Snarf snarf! It costs the seller's agent half of the commission. So... > If the end buyer is in the seller's agency, the seller makes more money > than if the buyer is with an independent agent. And, hey, if the seller's > agent is a bitch, well, all bets are off on anything. There is no such thing as a buyers agent, well, that's not entierly true, but mere mortals can rarely afford them. Unless YOU cut the cheque for ther agent, the agent , whether from the same or a different broker is being paid a sales commision by the seller, legally, and morally, the agent is beholden to and working for the seller. If you are wealthy you can pay a buyers commision or fee for a buyers agent, but then they don't get sales commission either, or they are violating the state code for real estate agents that deals with conflict of interest.. From me at privacy.net Wed Nov 26 02:02:01 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Nov 26 02:15:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B61C055E5132TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! : : > Hire yourself a buyer's agent. : : Got one of those. They only work well when the seller's agent isn't a : sleazeball! : : : > Nice part of the deal is that a buyer's agent cost you nothing. : : Snarf snarf! It costs the seller's agent half of the commission. So... : If the end buyer is in the seller's agency, the seller makes more money : than if the buyer is with an independent agent. And, hey, if the seller's : agent is a bitch, well, all bets are off on anything. And the seller's agent is your concern? A buyer's agent has specific legal duties to the client (you and yours). Like I said we used a buyer's agent for a private sale (their fee came out of our pocket) and it was one of the wisest 'investments' we made. I kinda look at a buyer's agent as a designated S.*.B but MY S.*.B. FWIW the fact that there is a buyer's agent in the game puts the seller and more so the seller's agent on notice that games will not be played in this deal. An aside: there will be a presale inspection. It is wise to read the report carefully and pay close attention to the disclaimer as that will give you ideas on where you need to look more carefully. Again a seller's agent is a help here as well From me at privacy.net Wed Nov 26 02:04:27 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Nov 26 02:15:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "bar0" wrote in message news:ggi60f$t61$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Charles" wrote in message : news:Xns9B61C055E5132TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : > No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! : > : >> Hire yourself a buyer's agent. : > : > Got one of those. They only work well when the seller's agent isn't a : > sleazeball! : > : > : >> Nice part of the deal is that a buyer's agent cost you nothing. : > : > Snarf snarf! It costs the seller's agent half of the commission. So... : > If the end buyer is in the seller's agency, the seller makes more money : > than if the buyer is with an independent agent. And, hey, if the seller's : > agent is a bitch, well, all bets are off on anything. : : There is no such thing as a buyers agent, well, that's not entierly true, : but mere mortals can rarely afford them. : : Unless YOU cut the cheque for ther agent, the agent , whether from the same : or a different broker is being paid a sales commision by the seller, : legally, and morally, the agent is beholden to and working for the seller. : : If you are wealthy you can pay a buyers commision or fee for a buyers agent, : but then they don't get sales commission either, or they are violating the : state code for real estate agents that deals with conflict of interest.. : Don't know about where your live but buyer's agents are quite common in Texas, Louisiana and Mississippi. And the written contact has this delineated in the boiler plate. From me at privacy.net Wed Nov 26 02:10:26 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Nov 26 02:15:05 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B61D13AB3A14TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was "bar0" ! : : > There is no such thing as a buyers agent, well, that's not entierly : > true, but mere mortals can rarely afford them. : : Yeah, well. We have an agent. She's working for us. Yes, she would get : commission on this, too. And, yes, she's pissed off, too. But, hey, you : know, it's life. If you let it eat you up then you'll just die early and : unhappy! : Is this an 'agent' (who may show you homes but is in fact the seller's agent) or your agent legally representing YOUR interest? There is a difference. My daughter almost fell into this trap. the agent she had been working with showed her a lot of property and as a hard sell. I met the woman and red flags went off. I talked my daughter into a buyer's agent and that alone saved her near $20K on the house she purchased. Part in the actual sale price but most in the 'got ya's that most buyers miss. From joegill at removethis Wed Nov 26 10:26:04 2008 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Wed Nov 26 10:30:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B624F412A5F0TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "Frog Prince" ! > >> And the seller's agent is your concern? > > Well, here it is. 'Cause she screwed us out of the house. I can think of some 'fun things' to do.. legal. but fun A) Get a few friends to have her show houses to them... Then all agree on the date/time they MUST see the house.... When she picks one.... have that person NOT show up. B) Wait for the first buyer's financing to fall through ! C) Go around to any houses, where she puts out flyers, have different people snarf them up. D) If she has an open house somewhere, have friends line the street in front of the sale. E) At a minimum report her to: - Local county Board of Realtors - State board of Realtors - Better Business Bureau. - Warn others about the behaviors on ripoffreports.com Make her SORRY for even messing with you! From me at privacy.net Wed Nov 26 13:54:17 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Wed Nov 26 14:00:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B624F412A5F0TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : It wasn't me! It was "Frog Prince" ! : : > And the seller's agent is your concern? : : Well, here it is. 'Cause she screwed us out of the house. Not familiar with your state but (making a lot of assumptions here) in Texas, Louisiana and Mississippi you would likely have cause of action against the agent, her agency and their errors and omission insurance/bonding company. From joegill at removethis Wed Nov 26 14:08:46 2008 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Wed Nov 26 14:10:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B62719D8C3FETheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "Joe Gill" ! > >> E) At a minimum report her to: > > I've asked her boss to look into it. And even then... You know, this is > a > small town - she's only one handshake away from me. She's still a bitch, > but there's not benefit to us in making pests of ourselves. OK.. if it is a small town.. and 'she's only one handshake away from me'..... There must be another person, familiar to you and who knows her, that can basically say 'wrong move' to her, and basically tell her, that as word of the action spreads, the few extra commission dollars she got, will pale in comparison to what she will lose over the next year as the story spreads.. mouth to mouth... From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 26 17:09:11 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Wed Nov 26 17:10:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Joe Gill" wrote in message news:ggk6rp$fr0$1@news.spamcop.net... > > > OK.. if it is a small town.. and 'she's only one handshake away from > me'..... > There must be another person, familiar to you and who knows her, that can > basically say 'wrong move' to her, and basically tell her, that as word of > the action spreads, the few extra commission dollars she got, will pale in > comparison to what she will lose over the next year as the story spreads.. > mouth to mouth... I'd reserve that pleasure for myself, if I were Charles, there is nothing like a good face to face confrontation to bring someone up short - they never expect to hear from him again, I'd make sure they didn't get away with screwing me out of a house without looking me in the eye first and listening to a few home truths. From joegill at removethis Wed Nov 26 19:33:27 2008 From: joegill at removethis (Joe Gill) Date: Wed Nov 26 19:35:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B62C06D392CDTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Joe Gill" ! > >> OK.. if it is a small town.. and 'she's only one handshake away from >> me'..... >> There must be another person, familiar to you and who knows her, that >> can basically say 'wrong move' to her, and basically tell her, that as >> word of the action spreads, the few extra commission dollars she got, >> will pale in comparison to what she will lose over the next year as >> the story spreads.. mouth to mouth... > > Well, the story is already out there. Highly respected and dynamic local > businessmen (those who told me to tell her boss) are all the heck over it. > The local law community is on the deal. Others as well. So, yeah, maybe, > at some point, it will bite her in the butt. And maybe not. But we need > to move on - this house is sold. Gotta look forwards and not back - gotta > keep the stress for things that are stressworthy. You said "...this house is sold"... Have they closed on it yet? If not, maybe the RE agent did a song/dance on the buyer saying "...Sure they will approve your loan and close" From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 26 21:46:20 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Wed Nov 26 21:50:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B614E17BE5CFTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "Indigo" ! >> "Charles" wrote in message >> news:Xns9B60C0A2D6248TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > >>> Bitch. >> >> Which one? > > The other one. The one that needed a lot of repairs? From nobody at spamcop.net Wed Nov 26 21:51:58 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Wed Nov 26 21:55:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B59D34C0974ATheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > Amazon drives me crazy. The prices change every time you refresh the > window (well, not quite - I haven't seen it happen live, yet, but I know > it > happens, darn it!). I saved the window, I tell you! Last night I was > looking at that watch and it was at $267 (after searching for 2 hours, > eh?). Today, first time I looked it was at $399. Now it's at $300! Never had that experience with Amazon, but I'm not surprised since they deal with so many secondary sellers who may change prices at a moment's notice. I bought a DLP light therapy machine on Ebay many months ago from a couple who had two different online Ebay stores. One store was selling the unit for $65, the other was selling the identical unit for $50! Of course I bought the $50 one ;-) From me at privacy.net Thu Nov 27 01:23:06 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Nov 27 01:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B62C0B3942D4TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... : No way it was me! It was "Frog Prince" ! : : > Not familiar with your state but (making a lot of assumptions here) in : > Texas, Louisiana and Mississippi you would likely have cause of action : > against the agent, her agency and their errors and omission : > insurance/bonding company. : : It doesn't really matter, here. You can get out of a contract in the first : 3 business days because the other party sneezed. I don't think that applies to real-estate purchases. Espically on the seller's side. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 27 09:16:57 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 27 09:20:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B62C06D392CDTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > > Well, the story is already out there. Highly respected and dynamic local > businessmen (those who told me to tell her boss) are all the heck over it. > The local law community is on the deal. Others as well. So, yeah, maybe, > at some point, it will bite her in the butt. And maybe not. But we need > to move on - this house is sold. Gotta look forwards and not back - gotta > keep the stress for things that are stressworthy. It also might happen that the sale falls through, unless they've upped cash for the house, they might not be able to get a mortgage, and the sellers might come back to you if they know you're interested - good time to drive a hard bargain and screw the other one out of her commission. Remember the insane heating bills, might not have been the best house for you anyway. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 27 09:22:26 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 27 09:25:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "Frog Prince" wrote in message news:gg6dd0$amv$2@news.spamcop.net... > > Profit is not a bad word nor is it a bad practice. Much can be > accomplished > under a for profit system so long as the system is not gamed. And therein lies the problem, the ones with the best paid lobbyists get their interests met. Where there is a human life vs. a dollar to be made, greed will ALWAYS win out, and when there are shareholders to satisfy, they don't care how they do it. Managed care is a joke, the only people it is designed to 'help' are the insurance companies who want to show a profit.. I had a knee MRI last year to reassess the state of my knee after two botched surgeries. I got no fewer than four requests from an outside company wanting to know if this injury was an accident and who was responsible, so they could go after THEM for the costs. I wanted to give them the original doctor's name, and say 'here's the guy who ruined my knee, go after him', but I'm quite sure they wouldn't. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 27 16:32:57 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 27 16:35:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B636CD2872F3TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > Well, the radon was really high (they emailed the report to me - I'm not > sure why). But that's easy to fix. And we can't screw the realtor out of > a commission - life just doesn't work that way. And, yes, I remember the > insane heating bills... But, see, we were going to upgrade the heating > system and insulation. Ah well. Some other house. How do you fix radon? From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 27 18:34:09 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Thu Nov 27 18:35:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Mike Easter" wrote in message news:gg4f9r$gfq$1@news.spamcop.net... > > Most ERs lose a lot of money for various reasons and function as a kind of > outpatient service like an 'office visit' for those patients who can't get > a doctor because they have no insurance and so the ER wants to 'dispose' > of them because they have all kinds of other things they need to be doing > and no one has an appointment. Huge problem in big cities with a large poor uninsured population that takes their kid with simple problems like the flu to the ER for treatment. They use the ER as their personal doctor since they can't access "real" doctors with no insurance. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 27 18:38:24 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Thu Nov 27 18:40:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "David Dean" wrote in message news:v8ltfuv02-D28F17.13172020112008@killface.local... > > You don't understand. In an ER triage there are three things will get > you seen without question. ABC: Airway, Breathing, and Circulation. Absolutely correct. On my 3rd (and worst) visit to the ER with a terrible attack of hives my throat was feeling constricted and I told them I was having trouble breathing, so I was instantly whisked inside for treatment -- I mean I showed up at the check in desk, and 10 seconds later I'm inside the ER being seen by a nurse practicioner. The horrendous appearance of my face and throat didn't hurt either (it was covered with huge red/purple hives). From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 27 18:44:25 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Thu Nov 27 18:45:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B59802ADABTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "Bar0" ! > >> or unscrupulous refiner, etc. etc. Oil is fungible. Mainly though the >> threat will be; pay or we spill. > > Oh, I dunno. Usually they're just holding the hostages for the money, no? Old thread, I've been busy doing other stuff. The pirates hold the crew and ship hostage for ransom, and the companies usually pay up -- they're losing up to $100k/day with the ship sitting there doing nothing, it makes it financially viable to pay a couple million in ransom to get the ship back. And the pirates, for the most part, are "honorable", they don't abuse their prisoners and they release the ship and crew when the ransom is paid. Except for those guys who rip out every piece of sellable electronics (radar, GPS, etc.) to sell on the black market. If I owned ships sailing in that area I'd hire Blackwater guards or someone similar to protect a multibillion dollar tanker, sniper team required since the biggest threat the pirates have is RPGs, a sniper has a greater range than an RPG. Going to "mark as read" the rest of this thread, have too many unread posts to ever catch up! From me at privacy.net Thu Nov 27 18:47:54 2008 From: me at privacy.net (Frog Prince) Date: Thu Nov 27 18:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: More on shopping References: Message-ID: "Indigo" wrote in message news:ggnaph$kis$1@news.spamcop.net... : : "Mike Easter" wrote in message : news:gg4f9r$gfq$1@news.spamcop.net... : > : > Most ERs lose a lot of money for various reasons and function as a kind of : > outpatient service like an 'office visit' for those patients who can't get : > a doctor because they have no insurance and so the ER wants to 'dispose' : > of them because they have all kinds of other things they need to be doing : > and no one has an appointment. : : Huge problem in big cities with a large poor uninsured population that takes : their kid with simple problems like the flu to the ER for treatment. They : use the ER as their personal doctor since they can't access "real" doctors : with no insurance. Yes on that. Might also mention that cash does not seem to swing much weight wrt getting an appointment. From nobody at spamcop.net Thu Nov 27 22:52:19 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Heidi) Date: Thu Nov 27 22:55:03 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B63B3FBA4BCDTheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > No way it was me! It was "Heidi" ! > >> How do you fix radon? > > Tie off its privates with a really small rubber band! You drill some > holes > in the slab and hook up a system of pipes and fans to suck the air under > the slab up and outside the house. The whole deal is pretty well > understood and given how foundations are laid (lots of gravel and empty > spaces underneath) works really well. What about old houses with granite foundations, seeing as granite is one of the big culprits (I live in the worst radon zone in NH...lovely)? From JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com Fri Nov 28 06:09:54 2008 From: JLNKOOECOCGY at spammotel.com (Canopus) Date: Fri Nov 28 06:10:02 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: pirates References: Message-ID: Indigo scribed: >If I owned ships sailing in that area I'd hire Blackwater guards or >someone similar to protect a multibillion dollar tanker, What! And have Blackwater shooting up innocent fishing boats just for a bit of fun? Well, at least they are stupid enough to video themselves doing it and end up with the video shown throughout the world so that they can be brought to account so it could be a good choice :)) -- Rob http://www.flickr.com/photos/canopus_archives/ http://canopianjournal.blogspot.com/ http://canopusarchives.multiply.com/ From nobody at spamcop.net Fri Nov 28 17:46:39 2008 From: nobody at spamcop.net (Indigo) Date: Fri Nov 28 17:50:04 2008 Subject: [Scsocial] Re: You're not going to believe this one In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Charles" wrote in message news:Xns9B644C3F97D68TheShrubIsAnAss@216.154.195.61... > It wasn't me! It was "Heidi" ! > >> What about old houses with granite foundations, seeing as granite is >> one of the big culprits (I live in the worst radon zone in >> NH...lovely)? > > You are actually probably OK - there's airflow. It's when you cut off the > air (by closing up all of the cracks) that you have problems! But, > anyway, > I imagine that they do very similar things - suck out the bad air... Around hear, where we're lucky enough to have a lot of radon in the bedrock, the remediation is pretty simple. You just install a vent fan in the basement and run PVC pipe outside to vent the gas. I know one of my neighbors has one because they finished their basement and turned half of it into an entertainment area. I've never check my basement, but I spend so little time down there (usually) I've never really worried about it. Right now, I wouldn't mind having some kind of forced air fan/vent system down there for when I'm doing woodworking or spraying paint or anything that releases chemical vapors into the air since we've recently discovered that I have developed a big sensitivity to chemicals. Having to wear heavy duty rubber or latex gloves, a full face professional grade respirator, and goggles every time I have to paint something is a royal PITA -- my hands sweat so bad they're pickled beyond belief when I get finished. Better than poisoning myself (more) though......that CSM cholesterol drug is working pretty well at removing toxins that have been stored in my body for a long time. I do open the two basement casement windows to help clear the air, but they're not terribly effective since there's no real air flow -- both windows are on the same side of the house so I can't take advantage of a side-to-side air pressure difference caused by the wind or a temp gradient. I wonder if hanging a small box fan in front of one of the windows would work, even partly? No way I can make a seal between the fan and the window frame though, the sizes wouldn't match, and I have to be able to easily remove the fan when I'm done so I can close the window for the night.